A Solution to the Problem

[Jigga]

viewtopic.php?f=26&t=11011&p=232425#p232425

You can find a balance between having a laugh and taking things seriously. It is pretty hard to avoid getting in to a argument though if someone says something "inflamatory" outside of the playground.

On one hand you want to NZBB be a place where you can get advice without having to sift through a whole lot of shit. On the other hand, things have to be fun and entertaining if you want regs to stick around. Not many people can sign in regularly with the sole purpse of answering the same mundane questions day in and day out.

A few ideas:

* you could expand the playground section - maybe merge with general chitchat so people can banter and take the piss all they like without being banned aslong as they keep the rest of the forum free of arguments. it is pretty constrictive having topics auto-deleted every few days and it results in people trawling other parts of the forum to have a laugh.

* have stricter posting rules. having 5 protein, creatine, squat topics pop up everyday is pretty tiring for the regs to answer. before you start a thread search for it first and revive the old thread if it applies or clearly title the new thread so people know how your question is different. if someone typed "squat" in to search they would get a list of 20 topics with the exact same title and they would then have to sift through a lot of shit before getting anything half informative or useful.

* a rep system could be helpful to make it clear who you should listen to and who you shouldn't and it would also motivate others to think before they post. perhaps give most/all of the rep power to the thread creator who can best judge whether they were helped or not. this would also ensure people didn't form little rep-trading alliances (like they have on bb.com?)

* there would be a big drop in numbers if all the shit stirrers were banned for good so rather than looking to stop it all together, throw topics that had no merit anyway in to the playground more readily so people can go off and argue in a corner. you have to sign up for the playground so you can stay completely removed from that side of things if you like.

tl;dr summary:

- increase the size/scope of the playground so people don't feel confined and have the need to infect the larger segment of the forum.

- stricter thread creating rules would streamline things a lot and keep regs from getting frustrated to the point where they take the piss out of newbies.

- rep system. positive reinforcement rather than negative reinforcement may be the go.

- increase the workload of the moderators where they more readily cut and paste the derailed part of topics in to the playground for people to squabble over.

I'm not being a lick nuts. Created this thread so other people could expand further on my ideas or come up with better ones.

[Luigi]

yea mentioned the rep system before but psydoneum was not keen so he brung it that 'like this post' instead which is kinda stupid because we cant even see who likes what post or how many likes sounds like its rigged to me.

and stickys in each section would stop the same questions being asked everyday

.

[devil_911]

+++ rep to jigga for this one :nod:

it will help if people search the site first before asking the same question over and over again

[oldfella]

stop being a lick nuts

Example a.

[Beowulf]

I like your rep system idea man

But I would go one step further with the playground and make it no holds barred that way if you cater to the people who just want to talk smack and it preps the other members so that if they do go into it they should wear their thick skin.

As for culling the number of repeat threads maybe having some form of FAQ section in the section i.e diet?

just a couple of ideas

[Jigga]

yea mentioned the rep system before but psydoneum was not keen so he brung it that 'like this post' instead which is kinda stupid because we cant even see who likes what post or how many likes sounds like its rigged to me.

and stickys in each section would stop the same questions being asked everyday

Yeah I can't remember what he said he didn't like about it but I think it could be very positive. I'm sure we could use a bit of kiwi ingenuity to side-step the problems larger sites have with the rep system.

+++ rep to jigga for this one :nod:

it will help if people search the site first before asking the same question over and over again

Yep. If every newbie had a short, clear set of rules that popped up on their screen before entering the site it would keep things a lot tidier.

1. Don't start a new thread before using the search engine.

2. Think carefully how to title a thread in a way which summarises your question specifically so it is distinguishable from the other threads on that topic.

3. Keep shit talk to the playground. You get 3 suspensions and then permanent ban.

or something to that effect...

I like your rep system idea man

But I would go one step further with the playground and make it no holds barred that way if you cater to the people who just want to talk smack and it preps the other members so that if they do go into it they should wear their thick skin.

As for culling the number of repeat threads maybe having some form of FAQ section in the section i.e diet?

just a couple of ideas

I agree. Pseu kinda set up a FAQ section under the resources tab but I'm not sure many if any use it. I don't know anybody. How many dudes you know got the skills to go...

The thing that makes this site unique and more appealing than bb.com is that it is relatively small (tight community - everyone knows eachother) and we are nearly all NZers.

I understand Pseu's apprehension following suit with the monster sites but I don't think adopting some of the processes they use for dealing with these problems would affect the draw-card for this site.

The huge sites have been running longer, have had to deal with the same problems (with bigger numbers) and over the years they have developed some pretty effective systems. Take 2+2 for example. It is one of the most useful and organised sites I have ever come across (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/78/mi ... ent37.html). I think if Pseu had a bit of a look around at how they do things he might get a few ideas.

BB.com have a competition encouraging people to write clear, informative articles on selected topics. If you want information they are currently more useful. If this site is going to be more than just a place to chat and post in a journal, the current system could do with some re-working.

As an afterthought. Maybe NZBB will never compete with other sites in terms of clear, accessible information. Maybe its main appeal is that it is essentially a small site to chat on where the main theme is bbing. Rather than being a source of information it is a place to discuss things in a broader sense. I'm not sure, my thoughts are too scattered. I guess it really depends on the direction Pseu wants to take it.

[Dr Squat]

My 2 cents.

I think the site is generally fine and close to getting it right. It's well organised and easy to follow unlike some other forums. I guess it has a NZ touch which makes it relevant.

I don't really mind if some of the same stuff pops up. It's often good to refresh information and isn't it like TV? If you don't like it you can either turn it off or go to another channel.

The downside is that a few top bodybuilders/powerlifters aren't interested because of some of the negativity that goes on. That is a pity because they are the ones we want to encourage.

I don't like the petty insults that go on at times. Call me a nana but that's not necessary. I have myself fallen into the trap sometimes. I think the mods do a good job of handling this and give plenty of rope to the few that need it.

I think there a few people who over play their hand in terms of experience and credentials. But it is the internet I know and everyone has an arsehole etc... This is their right. But if you have hardly been to the gym you maybe better off learning from others for a while.

I'm sure that there are improvements that can be made. But as I said I don't think this forum is too far away from being a really good forum.

[Tygrrh]

I like the forum as it tbh. Then again, I can use the search function.

[soundsgood]

Some good ideas thrown around here.

Personally I'd like to see another title given to members who have proven their worth by consistently Posting Quality advice.

Several names pop intO mind straight away like Doc, MuscleNZ, Tonka, Teamfatboy, SamoanMuscle and Tom (mostly).

[Grover]

always good to review how things are done.

i agree with some of what Jigga posted, but do like the site

Perhaps a questionaire on which sites others frequent? then could perhaps see what attractions these sites have that we don't.

Agree with Soundsgood but would also post him there as well.

Why because he walks the talk, has a journal, posts pics and is the real deal BBer (unless he has photoshopped himself )

[justhell]

outlawmuscle

testosterone overload

http://www.outlawmuscle.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=25

=P~

Perhaps a questionaire on which sites others frequent? then could perhaps see what attractions these sites have that we don't.

[Chemo]

More sticky threads and a "best of" section

for anyone even thinking of joining they are presented with the best of threads, and good info without having to search or sift through the crap

and if we gonna go with a rep system add a humor stat i there too or jimjim tom and nzmm are screwed >:3

[Gasp]

1. Don't start a new thread before using the search engine.

This appears to be the number one problem and sadly these repetitive ones tend to run out of steam quickly and degenerate once everyones bored.

Secondly is it my imagination or are there a few out there who`s main aim is to accumulate posts to get out of "junior member status" rather than be informative.

There are also a few with limited BB or PL credentials who (when not banned) are hijacking some of the better threads.

O.k... GASP`s not innocent of all charges in these areas but the common theme should be "have fun but dont get boring"

Just my 5 cents worth.

"He who bothers to read this quote is bored."

[bang_bang]

some good ideas being thrown around. :nod:

i think a section with articles on different subjects would cut a lot of the crap out. newbies could quickly be pointed in the right direction. personally i usually use other sites to find information i need. not saying that there isnt alot of really quality information, there is. i like nzbb for the entertainment factor i guess its the ''kiwi humour''. i really dont like some of the negativity that goes on. people starting arguements for the sake of it or hating on other people photos. that shit should be cracked down on hard

[Pseudonym]

Good topic, Jigga. Thanks for starting this - the feedback from everyone is extremely useful. The tougher moderating policy is not meant to stifle all the fun in the forum, but we do want to make sure that legitimate questions get legitimate answers. As you say, it's about balance. Think of this as a slight correction to the steering, rather than a whole new direction. :grin:

Anyway, I'll try to respond to as many of everyone's points above as I can.

The Playground

I don't want to merge it with General Chitchat - I think we need somewhere to talk random topics, but without the attitude of the Playground.

There have to be limits, even in the Playground - if you make it no holds barred, that makes it more likely for people to take their grudges out into the rest of the forum. That said, there's not a lot we don't allow in the Playground, provided it doesn't breach the overall forum rules.

The auto-delete feature, I'll be honest - I like it. It gives the mods another option to deal with wayward posts without resorting to deletion (which always makes us feel like nazis!)... Instead, we move them to the Playground, where eventually they die a natural death in their sleep.

Anyway, I take your points... I'll have a chat to the mods about this.

The reps system

I think the main reason I was reluctant to add this feature originally was because no-one's built a reliable reps system for this version of our forum software. That's still the situation. There are some out there, but they either sound pretty dodgy, or they're for an older version of phpBB. However, I have a cunning plan. Read on...

The "I like this" system

The reason we haven't shown stats for this is because they don't tell you much. Although we get a number of nominations every month, there's often not a lot of agreement between them! For instance, last month there were 28 nominations, and 7 of them were for Android's post. The 3 next most liked posts only had 2 "likes" each. Which is why we've always said "the mods will select a winner using your nominations as a guide." We've never claimed it was a voting process, so we can't be rigging it, Luigi!

Now, my cunning plan. What if we use the "I like this" system to generate rep points? We could use a formula like this to calculate it:

4x your Likes in the last month, plus

3x your Likes in the two months, plus

2x your Likes in the three months, plus

1x your Likes in the four months.

Then we show everyone's rep rating as a percentage of the highest. That way it's self-adjusting (gotta take inflation into account!), and it it rewards the people who've posted good stuff most recently.

Stickies

Funny you should say this. I'd just mentioned this to the mods the other day. Our Bodybuilding for Beginners articles are good, but I think they get lost where they are. They also don't cover enough topics.

My plan here is to sticky a Bodybuilding for Beginners article in every forum, so every main topic would be covered. I'll see if I can round up some experts in the sport to write the articles.

Having said that, let's not pretend it's going to stop the newbies from asking the same questions over and over. Stickies are like instruction manuals - no-one reads them! But in a way, that's ok, because even though the questions are the same, the answers people give are often different. I know I've learnt things from reading the responses to questions I thought I knew the answer to.

But we do send each member a PM when they join up, so that would be a good place to introduce them to the stickies and the search function.

There's some other big features planned too (I'd tell you, but I'd have to kill you, etc...) and hopefully we'll see these roll out in the not-too-distant future. My issue at the moment is time - I don't have any. That means all new features are on hold until I can find a web developer to help. If anyone knows of a PHP guru, please get in touch.

[Pseudonym]

Ooops. Looks like I thoroughly killed this topic. I didn't mean to! :oops:

[mike27]

yeah a rep system would be great like other forums

definatly a more comprehensive FAQ and 'guide to bulking' and a 'guide to cutting' and 'guide to supps'

a range of basic to advanced training programmes maybe? tryed and trusted routines!