dieting down

[EMC]

i revamped my diet and now i lost about 4 kilos in about 2 weeks and then it began to slow down as planned. things are going according to plan as im getting leaner day by day and my bodys getting closer to its new maintenance caloric intake.

my diet is mainly

tuna

oats

protein powder

milk(skim)

some veges

banana

pretty lean meat fish, steak, pork, chicken breast

sometimes mince or thigh/legs(this is basically majority of my fat when i do get it)

egg whites

brown and white rice

potatoes

whole grain pasta

whole grain bread

the problem is im not eating much fat and my metabolism is almost on full blast. im slightly hungry when approaching my next meal, should i adjust something here or is this no problem?. the majority of my fats come in the way of trace fats and my one big post workout meal of starchy carbs/meat sometimes lean/moderate fat. so this means some days my fat intake is very seldom.

i couldnt really guess what my ratio is but i think it would be like 50/45,40/40,10/15 C P F.

is it possible to maintain a healthy level of testosterone without too much fat? anyone had blood tests that are typically on a similar diet?

[Andy2010]

Looking forward to following this thread! does fat intake effect testosterone levels??

[EMC]

Looking forward to following this thread! does fat intake effect testosterone levels??

ive read this in so many places. well i know(from experience) too much fat will aromatize testosterone so i think too little cant be too good either as with any balance. im finding it hard to find anything on pubmed.

can anyone shed light on this?

[Phedder]

http://www.ajcn.org.ezproxy.otago.ac.nz ... t/64/6/850

Abstract

We conducted a controlled feeding study to evaluate the effects of fat and fiber consumption on plasma and urine sex hormones in men. The study had a crossover design and included 43 healthy men aged 19-56 y. Men were initially randomly assigned to either a low-fat, high-fiber or high-fat, low-fiber diet for 10 wk and after a 2-wk washout period crossed over to the other diet. The energy content of diets was varied to maintain constant body weight but averaged approximately 13.3 MJ (3170 kcal)/d on both diets. The low-fat diet provided 18.8% of energy from fat with a ratio of polyunsaturated to saturated fat (P:S) of 1.3, whereas the high-fat diet provided 41.0% of energy from fat with a P:S of 0.6. Total dietary fiber consumption from the low- and high-fat diets averaged 4.6 and 2.0 g.MJ-1.d-1, respectively. Mean plasma concentrations of total and sex-hormone-binding-globulin (SHBG)-bound testosterone were 13% and 15% higher, respectively, on the high-fat, low-fiber diet and the difference from the low-fat, high-fiber diet was significant for the SHBG-bound fraction (P = 0.04). Men's daily urinary excretion of testosterone also was 13% higher with the high-fat, low-fiber diet than with the low-fat, high-fiber diet (P = 0.01). Conversely, their urinary excretion of estradiol and estrone and their 2-hydroxy metabolites were 12-28% lower with the high-fat, low-fiber diet (P < or = 0.01). Results of this study suggest that diet may alter endogenous sex hormone metabolism in men.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov.ezproxy.ota ... d/15741266

Abstract

To validate our hypothesis that reduction in dietary fat may result in changes in androgen metabolism, 39 middle-aged, white, healthy men (50-60 yr of age) were studied while they were consuming their usual high-fat, low-fiber diet and after 8 wk modulation to an isocaloric low-fat, high-fiber diet. Mean body weight decreased by 1 kg, whereas total caloric intake, energy expenditure, and activity index were not changed. After diet modulation, mean serum testosterone (T) concentration fell (P < 0.0001), accompanied by small but significant decreases in serum free T (P = 0.0045), 5 alpha-dihydrotestosterone (P = 0.0053), and adrenal androgens (androstendione, P = 0.0135; dehydroepiandrosterone sulfate, P = 0.0011). Serum estradiol and SHBG showed smaller decreases. Parallel decreases in urinary excretion of some testicular and adrenal androgens were demonstrated. Metabolic clearance rates of T were not changed, and production rates for T showed a downward trend while on low-fat diet modulation. We conclude that reduction in dietary fat intake (and increase in fiber) results in 12% consistent lowering of circulating androgen levels without changing the clearance.

My personal preference is to lower carbs when trying to drop weight, I find having plenty of proteins and fats helps keep me satiated whereas if I eat plenty of carbs while dieting I'm always hungry. Fats are so important in so many processes in your body, yet we can live healthily with little to no carbs. Seems like a no brainer to me. Could be a good idea to swap the tuna for salmon, add some mixed nuts and maybe add olive oil to one meal a day.

[tinytraps]

Good point phedd, Ive always dropped pretty good when on high protein mod fat low carb diets. Eat more whole eggs, red meat yellow top milk etc etc.

[EMC]

thanks guys.

im currently around 15% BF my body has gotten pretty vascular and legs and calves are pretty hard, showing serratus and oblique muscles. i tend to hold fat on my gut than anywhere else and theres not even that much pinch anymore. this is purely a guess im planning on getting it checked soon.

are there any guys here that maintain a 12% BF all year round eating a full balanced diet including fats? can you recommend me a macro ratio?

btw the fats i would normally eat are like whole eggs, natural PB, mixed nuts & seeds

[musclenz]

You could take out a lot of that starchy carbs (bread, pasta, potato, white rice) & switch into a higher 'good" fat (keto type) diet. Macros could go something like this - 30/50/20 - C/P/F. These should not be saturated or mono sat or trans fats. Walnuts, some peanuts, peanut butter, tuna in oil, olive or omega 3 fats - flaxseed, avocado in moderation, watch not too much dairy. The idea is to reduce the likelyhood of unprocessed carbs being stored as BF. Switching to higher fats can trick the body into using fat cells as energy. Taking it to the next level is to virtually take out all carbs & then reducing fats to force the body into using fat as an energy source. Hey presto BBer on stage :grin:

[EMC]

You could take out a lot of that starchy carbs (bread, pasta, potato, white rice) & switch into a higher 'good" fat (keto type) diet. Macros could go something like this - 30/50/20 - C/P/F. These should not be saturated or mono sat or trans fats. Walnuts, some peanuts, peanut butter, tuna in oil, olive or omega 3 fats - flaxseed, avocado in moderation, watch not too much dairy. The idea is to reduce the likelyhood of unprocessed carbs being stored as BF. Switching to higher fats can trick the body into using fat cells as energy. Taking it to the next level is to virtually take out all carbs & then reducing fats to force the body into using fat as an energy source. Hey presto BBer on stage :grin:

ive heard keto diets for a long time can be bad for the body? toxicity from the biproduct ketones? though i know that we evolutionized over thousands of years to eat animal meat/fat and convert to glucose/ready ATP.

do you eat like this all year round mnz? also during cycling do you increase the carbs? or do you just increase the over all calories?

thanks

[musclenz]

You could take out a lot of that starchy carbs (bread, pasta, potato, white rice) & switch into a higher 'good" fat (keto type) diet. Macros could go something like this - 30/50/20 - C/P/F. These should not be saturated or mono sat or trans fats. Walnuts, some peanuts, peanut butter, tuna in oil, olive or omega 3 fats - flaxseed, avocado in moderation, watch not too much dairy. The idea is to reduce the likelyhood of unprocessed carbs being stored as BF. Switching to higher fats can trick the body into using fat cells as energy. Taking it to the next level is to virtually take out all carbs & then reducing fats to force the body into using fat as an energy source. Hey presto BBer on stage :grin:

ive heard keto diets for a long time can be bad for the body? toxicity from the biproduct ketones? though i know that we evolutionized over thousands of years to eat animal meat/fat and convert to glucose/ready ATP.

do you eat like this all year round mnz? also during cycling do you increase the carbs? or do you just increase the over all calories?

thanks

Not advocating a Keto Diet as such. Just taking one principle out of it to use more fats than carbs. You still need carbs for normal body & brain function. Like most BBers trying to reduce BF you needto limit the simple carbs - sugars, flours, processed foods. Go complex carbs & limit those unless bulking. As discussed on here its very difficult to reduce BF while maintaining mass or trying to increase it. If you are happy with smaller gains though its not impossible . However, every body responds differently to the type & number of carbs vs protein vs fats. Other factors come into play as well like workload, training intensity, amount of cardio etc. So it can become a complex equation finding what works best for you. Small changes for short periods can show if results are positive or negative.

[Andy2010]

Great advice from Musclenz :grin: