Rimma

[rose]

Had a spew-na sammy post-workout to cheer up, things are looking better now. Tuesday's session should be back to normal

Yay! How's your twinge?

[rimma]

Tuesday's session should be back to normal

Hmm wishful thinking...today still abit lacklustre. Stalled on two exercises, almost on all three

Squats: 70kg 5/5/3/4

Bench: 50kg 5x5

Bent row: 50kg 5/5/4/5/3

Pushups: 15, 15

Stalled on 70kg squats again, one more crack at it and then I'll have to deload if still can't get it 7ft bar is on the way which means I can soon say goodbye to bottom squats and start from the top.

Bench was hard, pretty certain I will stall next time.

Bent row was bad form, and missed reps. So same again next week.

Only did two sets of push-ups and skipped abs cos I had enough

[jono]

Tuesday's session should be back to normal

Hmm wishful thinking...today still abit lacklustre. Stalled on two exercises, almost on all three

Squats: 70kg 5/5/3/4

Bench: 50kg 5x5

Bent row: 50kg 5/5/4/5/3

Pushups: 15, 15

Stalled on 70kg squats again, one more crack at it and then I'll have to deload if still can't get it 7ft bar is on the way which means I can soon say goodbye to bottom squats and start from the top.

Bench was hard, pretty certain I will stall next time.

Bent row was bad form, and missed reps. So same again next week.

Only did two sets of push-ups and skipped abs cos I had enough

nice work mate.. if you are still stalling - up the cals

[Big john]

aye bump up the cals and u should see some progression, make sure ya get some pre/post tucker in ya aswell :nod:

[rimma]

Definitely need to up the cals, getting slack and feeling abit weak in workouts still. Had to reset squats, went back to 62, felt easy which is good at least. Also I'm just about 69kg BW so thats nice, just 1 kg off my inital goal of 70.

Squats: 62kg 5x5 (reset )

Bench: 52kg 5x5

Bent row: 50kg 5x5

Pushups: 3x15

Happy with everything except squats at the moment. Maybe cos its the one thing I have to do every session.

[rimma]

Nothing much to report, two cool things: Deadlift 95kg for 5, will do 100 easy next time I think. And did 3x10 chins 8) time to start adding weight. Squats are still poo, building it back up.

[rimma]

Slipping up, dropped a kg of BW during a cluster-f*ck of a weekend at work.

Weights are pretty steady though so hopefully it was mostly fat not muscle.

Back into the munchies today

Squats: 5x5x65kg, slowly building up to 70, no hurry.

Bench: 5x5x53kg, no prob, but a little messy towards the end.

Bent row: 53kg 5, 5, 4, 4, 4 Put up a 3kg increase and unsurprisingly failed it- repeat next time.

Pushups: 3x15

All good in the hood, time to hit the calories hard and make back some lost ground.

[rose]

Love the eating attitude sir. What'd you end up doing about std bar vs oly bar, or is it a work in progress still?

[rimma]

I just bought a standard 7ft bar, cost about eighty bucks. Should arrive in the next few days.

I considered olympic but I'm just too tight to get the whole set-up. I could buy it, but I decided it would be a bit premature given I've only been lifting a few months. I can't do more than 100kg on anything except deadlift anyway.

I'll keep up the hobby and if my lifts improve a lot I will bite the bullet and go olympic

[rimma]

By the way, good to have you back Rose 8)

[rimma]

7ft bar came by courier today, took it out for a spin and had a good workout: Cracked almost 40kg for Press and 100kg for deadlift.

Pretty stoked cos its my first (and hopefully not last!) lift to break 100.

Also happy with OH Press.

Squats: 65kg 5x5 (repeating for the sake of a slow re-build.) Focus on form, taking it super slow and easy. I think the adding 2.5kg thing works on the other exercises but is too aggressive for squats, cos they feature every W/O. Maybe its psychological...either way, I'm repeating each weight twice. So next four workouts will be 67, 67, 70, 70. etc.

OH Press: 5x5, Cracked 40kg (Well 39.5 to be honest) but it wasnt too hard. Last reps were mega facials tho

Deadlift: 1x5 Loaded up 100kg on my new bar, went for it, and got 5 reps no sweat. Grip was the only hard bit, had to quickly grab a better hold at the bottom of each lift.

Pull-ups (palms away): 9, 8, 7 just the usual, not great or bad.

[Draft]

Last reps were mega facials tho

Thats how it should be! Good work bro, keep it up!

[ThePman]

rimma this is my usual take-it-or-leave-it drive-by advice, but I'd personally shy away from doing that Stronglifts plan vs. the Starting Strength/Rippetoe beginner-level setup.

5x5 with the same weight, three times a week, is going to be troublesome for progression over the long run. That's a damn lot of stress to adapt to.

If you look at the models by the people that actually created/refined the 5x5, you see a few things:

1. Starr had you ramping up sets of five to a heavy set on Monday, and the Weds/Fri weights were 80% and 90% of that top set (and with fewer work sets).

2. Rip's variant has you doing 3x5, and as you get stronger you can alternate front squats with back squats.

3. You don't start seeing 5x5 sets across until the intermediate level, where it's only done one day per week, or at the advanced level, where you do pretty much what you're doing now - 5x5 across 3x/week - but then follow that up with a very dramatic tapering phase after you peak.

That latter thing especially is important here, for two reasons:

1. It's an advanced method, something that you shouldn't need until you've been at this quite awhile and

2. It appears you've peaked, given that you seem to have crashed recently. Yeah, calories and recovery overall will play into that, but the fact that you're doing a routine that's basically used to intentionally overtrain someone in another context is not helping.

If I were in your shoes, I'd cut back to 3x5 as per Rip, or at the very least do the heavy/light/medium arrangement from Starr. I really think either would be a much better option for you.

[rose]

rimma this is my usual take-it-or-leave-it drive-by advice

It's very good advice (IMHO of course).

[rimma]

rimma this is my usual take-it-or-leave-it drive-by advice, but I'd personally shy away from doing that Stronglifts plan vs. the Starting Strength/Rippetoe beginner-level setup.

5x5 with the same weight, three times a week, is going to be troublesome for progression over the long run. That's a damn lot of stress to adapt to.

If you look at the models by the people that actually created/refined the 5x5, you see a few things:

1. Starr had you ramping up sets of five to a heavy set on Monday, and the Weds/Fri weights were 80% and 90% of that top set (and with fewer work sets).

2. Rip's variant has you doing 3x5, and as you get stronger you can alternate front squats with back squats.

3. You don't start seeing 5x5 sets across until the intermediate level, where it's only done one day per week, or at the advanced level, where you do pretty much what you're doing now - 5x5 across 3x/week - but then follow that up with a very dramatic tapering phase after you peak.

That latter thing especially is important here, for two reasons:

1. It's an advanced method, something that you shouldn't need until you've been at this quite awhile and

2. It appears you've peaked, given that you seem to have crashed recently. Yeah, calories and recovery overall will play into that, but the fact that you're doing a routine that's basically used to intentionally overtrain someone in another context is not helping.

If I were in your shoes, I'd cut back to 3x5 as per Rip, or at the very least do the heavy/light/medium arrangement from Starr. I really think either would be a much better option for you.

Thanks for taking the time to give me this advice Pman. I appreciate you have a ton of knowledge in this area (have just finished battling through Maximum Muscle, my highschool biology was considerably strained :pfft: )

In retrospect (and I think I mentioned this earlier somewhere in my log) I do realise that the Stronglifts 5x5 is a somewhat pointless rip-off of other 5x5's (in that it added nothing of value to existing templates). The guy that wrote it weighs 75kg... (5kg more than me). Maybe that should have been a warning from the outset :roll:

Now your comments have alerted me to the fact that it is not just a rehash but it is missing a key ingredient: light/heavy cycling. (or fewer work sets).

My question is: given that I have only been doing this for a couple months, would it be productive to continue with the Stronglifts program? I do think I will push through the squat barrier when I reach that weight again.

Or to rephrase, would it be counterproductive to switch to a new program just when I am getting the hang of my existing one?

Finally, if I were to change program, would you suggest the Bill Starr 5x5 above the competition?

I don't have the experience or knowledge to make the decision, so I would appreciate any further advice.

Cheers

[rimma]

If I were in your shoes, I'd cut back to 3x5 as per Rip, or at the very least do the heavy/light/medium arrangement from Starr. I really think either would be a much better option for you.

Actually you already answered my question as above. Guess I will start reading up on Rippetoes/ Starr. Just to clarify you would recommend Rippetoes over Starr? I realise both will work better than what I am currently doing.

[rimma]

Last reps were mega facials tho

Thats how it should be! Good work bro, keep it up!

Cheers man, sometimes my facials almost put me off my lifts. Gotta face away from the mirror :grin:

Edit: I have a mirror to watch my form... Honest! :wink: And its a small broken one, covered in flyshit and dust.

[ThePman]

I wouldn't think of it as "changing the program"

The quick fix here is just to drop your working sets back to 3x5, instead of 5x5.

Nothing else really has to change:

Workout A

Squat

Bench Press

Chins

Workout B

Squat

Overhead Press

Deadlift

Do everything for 3x5 (except the deadlift which is one set of 5), alternating between A and B each time you go to the gym - so one week will go A-B-A, the next B-A-B.

Stick with the weights you're currently using, and you're ready to go. No dramatic shake-up required.

[rimma]

No dramatic shake-up required.

Right-oh, sounds good. Dropping two sets shouldn't be too hard to get used to

...will start the switch from here on in. Cheers Pman for pointing that out. I imagine I've been spared from some frustrating or demotivating future squat sessions.

[rimma]

Had a really good one today. Drop off in sets obviously made things less intense, and gave me some room for a good warmup set too.

Squats: WU 50kgx8, 67.5kg 3x5

Bench: WU 45kgx5, 55kg 3x5

Bent row: 53kg 3x5

Pushups: 3x15

[rimma]

Another good one today.

(Work sets only)

Squats: 70kg 3x5

Went up alright, felt good.

OH Press: 42kg 3x5 8) woot

Glad to get 42 kg considering I only just got 40 the other day. Was pretty fucken hard though.

Deadlift: 105kg x4

Went for 105, almost got it but not quite, lost my mojo on the last rep. Time to start with 2.5kg increases as this is the first time I've missed a deadlift.

Chins: BW+5kg 8, 7, 7

Pretty cool first time adding weight to chins. Forgot to get a rucksack so had a super bogan set-up; a piece of cloth I found on the gorund tied around my waist, with a rope dangling between my legs threaded through a weight plate. Felt like having the worlds heaviest testicles!

Did some ab work to finish cos I haven't bothered doing any for a couple weeks :oops:

Body weight is still 68/69kg which I am happy with. Slow but steady gains are happening, aiming for a kg each month.

[jono]

nice work rimma. - you dont want to gain much more than that if you want to keep it lean :nod:

[ThePman]

Amazing how much better the workouts are when you're not blasting yourself to pieces with volume at each session, isn't it?

[rimma]

nice work rimma. - you dont want to gain much more than that if you want to keep it lean :nod:

Yeah man, I figure that one good thing about having difficulty gaining weight is that what small gains I do make are mostly muscle.

[rimma]

Amazing how much better the workouts are when you're not blasting yourself to pieces with volume at each session, isn't it?

Sure is; I gotta thank you again for suggesting that. My last two workouts were really good, felt high as a kite afterwards. Not easy, but not backbreaking, if you know what I mean.