overtrain?

[ramy]

haha, look at trainharders aviator then take a look at your self ramy.

jealous much indeed :roll:

[trainharder]

hey dont call me a idiot i could call you a skinny pilolw biting faggot but i wont because its not nice

i still think if you say you get nauteous and feel like fainting before you enter the gym its not overtraining get a checkup it could be a dose of the clap from the guy you picked up at the gay bar the night before

i know for me overtraining i listen to my body and dont go near the gym

theres other signs and its not food related like you think

id live to stay and chat ramy but im off on a date maybe a little cardio if you know what i mean and i dont have to get down on all fours like you do

talk to you later

[AlBundy]

despite wat ppl believe it actually takes 7-10 days for your nervous system to fully recover form an intense training session that is why it is best to train bodyparts once per week and why wuld you train biceps 2days in a row thats just stupid they will begin shrinking if you keep that up

Where did you read that, pretty interesting but I'm hesitant to believe it. On friday on my first set of wide grip pull ups I only got 13, yet tonight I got 18 with what felt like better form. I did 40 total on friday and 50 total tonight. It's only been 4 days. That said i'm on the rebound after having the flu for 3 weeks.

[nemesis]

despite wat ppl believe it actually takes 7-10 days for your nervous system to fully recover form an intense training session that is why it is best to train bodyparts once per week and why wuld you train biceps 2days in a row thats just stupid they will begin shrinking if you keep that up

Where did you read that, pretty interesting but I'm hesitant to believe it. On friday on my first set of wide grip pull ups I only got 13, yet tonight I got 18 with what felt like better form. I did 40 total on friday and 50 total tonight. It's only been 4 days. That said i'm on the rebound after having the flu for 3 weeks.

but does what your doing come under the catagory of strength training? in which case you would get better at that excersize but not necessarily get muscle mass gains from doing so? I'm not stating, more asking?

[AlBundy]

An interesting question but I'm not sure if it is relevant. Sure maxing out stresses the nervous system no denying that but so does forcing your muscle to contract for that many reps. I find when I swap from high reps/volume to heavy weight my strength for low reps shoots up real fast usually past old plateaus. I mean I'm pulling my bodyweight alot of times I think that is categorized as a part of strength training.

[AlBundy]

first of all... There is two types of overtraining... Muscular and your central nervous system. Musclar overtraining is fairly obvious... If you're still sore when you haven't trained that muscle again it hasnt recovered. Overtraining your CNS is more tricky to identify. For me, after pulling a max effort deadlift I won't be able to perform at my best for a couple weeks. Contolled overtraining, or over reaching, is not necessarily a bad thing. Some routines have intentionally lower volume and moderate intensity so the lifted is able to lift more often (overall or for a specific body part), others focus on heavy volume or intensity that takes much longer to recuperate from. And then there are some crazy routines that have high intensity, volume and frequency. The ultimate goal of any of these types of plans is to improve performance. The more one overtrains the greater the body will overcompensate, the trick is to time your training to make the most of it. I'll post an article on this when I'm pack on my PC.

yeah i agree with swine. muscular overtraining is easy to identify when i over train my nervous system i go into the gym and my hearts beating fast but my body isnt even warm, you obviously push crap and feel like you CANT push. you feel nausey as if you wanna faint. with not being warm your skin will be pale. its natural signs of sickness regardless of bodybuilding. because when you train your giving your nervous system a beating from the anabolism more than your muscles, when you over train your nervous system simply cant keep up, like a market demand too great to be supplied it comes to a halt. Lowers your immunity and you can be susceptible to something simple like a cold. you may wake up in morning with a runny nose in the middle of summer.

thats from experience.

What you're describing is exactly what happens when you go to the gym without eating a decent meal sometime earlier. You have mentioned that you don't like to eat alot of carbs.

[rose]

trainharder, what do energy levels have to do with overtraining? energy levels obviously are according to your calorie count. over training is related to the nervous system. your trying to mix your digestive system and your nervous system together to explain why people cannot perform in the gym. The only reason those two should cross paths and not allow you to perform at the gym, is according to what your diet consists of (thus meaning your maintenance, not only what you ate today), and thats a whole new topic.

Sorry Ramy, but that's bollocks. Are you denying that one of the symptoms of overtraining can be lethargy (i.e. low energy, listlessness etc)?

SoaringSwine made good points re different types of overtraining. An exhausted CNS can cause other symptoms such as lethargy, depression, sluggish metabolism etc.

[teamfatboy]

Ain't it amazing...wherever Ramy goes, there spread confusion and misinformation.... :doh:

[rose]

Ain't it amazing...wherever Ramy goes, there spread confusion and misinformation.... :doh:

Yes and a perfectly good post by SoaringSwine gets lost in the quagmire caused by said young muppet.

I'm sorry but patience wears thin. Actually no I'm not sorry. There comes a point where people deserve all they get.

[boostinggtir]

What you're describing is exactly what happens when you go to the gym without eating a decent meal sometime earlier. You have mentioned that you don't like to eat alot of carbs.

No shit, the dude don't even no the basics, having fruit as his main carb source. :pfft: Some one feed this dude please.

[rose]

Interesting reading:

http://www.johnberardi.com/articles/training/what_you_dont_know_overtraining.htm:

"Two Types of Overtraining

While researchers have typically considered overtraining one phenomenon, new data indicate that overtraining syndrome may affect the nervous systems (autonomic) of aerobic and anaerobic athletes differently. These differences are so pronounced that two types of overtraining have been described. Since this area of research is new, the two types are not well classified just yet. However enough evidence is available to influence our perception of the demands of the two different types of activities (1,2,5,6,7).

Scientists have described the two types of overtraining as “Basedowoid” and “Addisinoid”, the first type expressing itself as a sympathetic nervous system dominance (hyper, irritable, etc.) and the second type expressing itself as a sympathetic nervous system dominance (fatigue, depression, etc; 8).

Basedowoid overtraining has been dubbed “classical” or sympathetic overtraining and results in performance incompetence, hyperexcitability, restlessness, and increased sympathetic activity at rest (6). Whereas, Addisinoid overtraining has been called “modern” or vagal/parasympathetic overtraining and is characterized by decreased sympathetic activity with predominating parasympathetic activity at rest and during exercise. While it also results in persistent performance decrements, high fatigue, apathy, altered mood state, altered immune and reproductive functions are the consequences (4). Don’t know what sympathetic and parasympathetic mean? Don’t worry – we’ll get to that in a minute. But first, here’s a chart illustrating the differences.

Basedowoid (Sympathetic)

Performance decrements

Easily fatigued

Restlessness/excitability

Disturbed sleep

Weight loss

Accelerated resting HR

Delayed recovery

Associated with anaerobic activity

Addisinoid (Parasympathetic)

Performance decrements

Easily fatigued

Depression, inhibition

Sleep undisturbed

Constant weight

Bradicardic (Decreased) HR

Good recovery capacity

Associated with aerobic activity"

Etc.

[SoaringSwine]

http://www.elitefts.com/documents/periodization1.htm

http://www.elitefts.com/documents/periodization2.htm

http://www.elitefts.com/documents/perio ... eaking.htm

Well worth the read!

[musclenz]

OMG I have just picked up on this guy (Ramy) & now I can see why he was banned :shock: although I don't agree with this process just because somebody is lacking in intellectual advice. We have all got something to contribute. However, I respect Admins decision.

[ohjoshua]

http://www.elitefts.com/documents/periodization1.htm

http://www.elitefts.com/documents/periodization2.htm

http://www.elitefts.com/documents/perio ... eaking.htm

Well worth the read!

bump. good read.

[Mrbig]

even tho your muscles feel recovered after 3-5 days you have to remember that its your C.N.S that sends the signal to the muscles to get the fibres all firing to do the lift your trying so if you have trained to absolut failure on an exercise it wont be able to do the same again for 7-10 days because the nervous system is still fried and thats why if you were to train the same bodyparts to failure (which is actually really hard depending on the exercise) all the time you will overtrain very easily