Test/Deca/Dbol - Second cycle with Bloods (First Post)

[bodyfat_zero]

First time caller up in here, looking for some opinions. Don't care how brutal just have at me. This post will provide a little background on myself and go into detail about my second cycle - I am currently at the end of PCT and will provide further information (bloods) within a week or two.

 

Firstly, some background info:

Sex: Male

Age: 22

Current weight: 86.5-87.5kg

Height: 6"0

Bodyfat: 10-11% (estimate)

Started lifting when I was 17.5 years old, weighed 68-69kg.

Trains in Chch.

 

Ran my first cycle of Test-E for 12 weeks @ 250mg/week - I weighed 76kg to start (although naturally I was bigger at 79kg, however had a little more fat) - went up to 86kg, was pretty bloated and received nasty acne on PCT, thinking my nolva was bunk. Sussed the gear off a mate at the gym. I overpaid like a newbie, however I learnt from my mistakes. I am also a student and when I came off I was an idiot and drunk like a fish...again I've learnt from my mistakes. Eventually I returned to 76-77kg through negligence of my body.

 

Now, down to the business, my second cycle. I didn't overpay for this one, in fact I think I got a pretty good deal - sussed it off a guy from SST but he was recently v&, so my source is bust at current. My acne from my first cycle went away after I recovered and hoped on some Doxy. Anyway, here it goes:

 

Weeks 1-10 Test-P @ 300mg/week Pinning: Mon/Wed/Fri

Weeks 1-9 Deca @ 600mg/week Pinning: Every Monday.

Weeks 6-9 Dbol @ 40mg/ED

Weeks 1-10 (+ 4 days until Test was out the system) Asin @ 20mg/ED - NB: The Dbol was legit, had to up the dose to 40mg/ED during weeks 6-9 - noticed increase in acne, slightly puffy nips.

PCT: Nolva 40/40/40/20/20 - I will talk about why I did 3 weeks at 40mg/ED later.

 

I am not sure how these forums functions work so far, so hopefully all the bloods I upload have the correct titles I put on them or something so you can follows the timeline.

 

My starting weight for this cycle was 80kg, slightly a bit more bodyfat then 11%. (1-Jun-2015)

So the first set of bloods were taken 3 Weeks into cycle (22-Jun-2015).

At this stage I was already feeling strong as f*ck, everything was all gravy except slightly high Cholestrol and LDL. Was up around 4kg - hardly bloated at all, no sides.

 

Second set of bloods were taken at Week 8 (24-July-2015) - 2 weeks of Dbol took a huge toll on my Cholestrol, LDL and HDL. My AST and ALT also went up slightly - all expected. My weight peaked at 91.5kg - bloated, holding a lot of water, but my lifts were all shooting up like crazy. Prolactin and estro almost doubled at this point.

 

Now for the third set of bloods (24-August-2015), this is where I have some doubts as to the Deca I was sold. The third set of bloods were taken in week 12 of my cycle (PCT - two weeks into jamming 40mg of Nolva/ED) - my test levels should have been at nothing, however they were still reading off the charts. As you can see everything dropped back down and was starting to balance; cholestrol, LDL, HDL (up), estro, prolactin.

 

This prompted me to think about the gear I was actually sold. Firstly, I know the Test-P couldn't have been Test-E for two reasons; (a). the pip was insane (b). it didn't make business sense for my vendor to sell me Test-E instead (or branded as) of Test-E, this was because of two reasons (i). I asked him for Test-E in the first place and he said he was out (ii). He was charging more for Test-E than P (expected given raw prices). I knew the Dbol was legit but discontinued use of it ages before the third bloods. This leads me to point fingers at the Deca, which very much could have been Test-E instead and would explain my test levels still being through the roof at week 12.

 

I also have another theory based on internet information I have read somewhere before saying that Nolva can increase Test levels by 50%? Not sure how legit that is lol - pls confirm?

 

Anyway, ended the cycle at 89kg. Maintained that for a week if that, dropped water weight like crazy now I am weighing between 86.5kg - 87.5kg through to the end of my PCT - I believe if I maintain my calorie intake I will be able to keep a lot of the gains made. Experienced a slight blow out in Acne early on in PCT, its way better now though (on Doxy, no tanning but will do when summer comes around, I use non-fragence bodywash and change sheets regularly).

 

That's it, thanks for reading guys, please give feedback. I would like to regularly start contributing to this forum. Please do not hesitate to scrutinise and ask questions. Cheers

 

 

 

 

[maccaz]

Remove source name

[bodyfat_zero]

Remove source name

Done, sorry about that.

[nate225]

Test levels could still be up if last shots of Prop were 2 weeks before testing. Go find a serum test calculator and log your Prop cycle....half life's and cumulative build up would explain that.

[bang_bang]

Why did you quadruple your dose on 2nd cycle?

Why did you run deca higher than test? Test should be equal or higher

Why would he sell you test e instead of deca if he was out of test e?

What were your lifts at end of cycle? Did you get any other sides? From what you've said the deca sounds legit.

 

Doesn't seem like a well thought out cycle for someone going to the effort to get bloods etc. You would have got similar results off half those doses. There's lots of good gear in chch atm shouldn't be hard to find another source.

[cruxis]

What lab did you use in christchurch?

[cruxis]

 

 

The third set of bloods were taken in week 12 of my cycle (PCT - two weeks into jamming 40mg of Nolva/ED) - my test levels should have been at nothing, however they were still reading off the charts. As you can see everything dropped back down and was starting to balance; cholestrol, LDL, HDL (up), estro, prolactin.

 

No You only stopped taking Test Prop 2 weeks before this test ? Your levels still would be off the chart as there would have be a build up from your cycle as nate25 said.

 

Also remember when you inject you are also injecting the oil its suspened in which can behave like a little reservoir in the muscle thus slowing down clearance time.

 

Good that you got your bloods done, Looks like need torun your pct longer.

[bodyfat_zero]

Test levels could still be up if last shots of Prop were 2 weeks before testing. Go find a serum test calculator and log your Prop cycle....half life's and cumulative build up would explain that.

 

Makes perfect sense tbh. This is the most likely reason, can't believe I overlooked it. I was always told and had read to start PCT 4 days after Test-P ending due to the half life. I'll take this into consideration next time I try.

 

Why did you quadruple your dose on 2nd cycle? I guess there is no other excuse other than I wanted to try running two compounds and chose Deca to supplement the Test.

Why did you run deca higher than test? Test should be equal or higher - A lot of people have contradicting advice on this subject, I am still a youngbuck. Can you please explain?

Why would he sell you test e instead of deca if he was out of test e? His prices for Deca were priced higher than Test-e, therefore makes business sense to rip me off for a little more dosh. I kinda doubt this was the case though considering nate225's post above.

What were your lifts at end of cycle? I haven't tested 1RM for bench yet, but I'm pushing 95kg 5x5. Deadlift 1RM went from 115kg to 185kg. Squat 1RM from 100kg to 145kg. OHP 1RM 65kg.  Did you get any other sides? None that I know of. I know I'm kinda prone to gyno due to getting sensitive nips during puberty, and have had puffy nips since I was 16 years old, kinda sucks actually.  From what you've said the deca sounds legit. - what makes you say that?

 

Doesn't seem like a well thought out cycle for someone going to the effort to get bloods etc. - Im not paying a cent for my bloods so it's all good, I get free health care luckily. You would have got similar results off half those doses. - potentially, looking back I should have been using more Test but I guess there's always next time. There's lots of good gear in chch atm shouldn't be hard to find another source. It's hard for a youngbuck who doesn't know many serious lifters. I occasionally see people at my gym who I suspect who use, but I feel like if I asked I'd be treading on thin water.

 

 

What lab did you use in christchurch?

He was located in Chch but he advertised the product through Steroid Source Talk on Reddit. I never met him face-to-face, it just turned up at my doorstep after I paid.

[cruxis]

 

 

He was located in Chch but he advertised the product through Steroid Source Talk on Reddit. I never met him face-to-face, it just turned up at my doorstep after I paid.

I meant the Lab for blood tests sorry,  I see you got SBHG and Free Test done. SCL labs would not do that test for me. 

[atrollappears]

 

Weeks 1-10 Test-P @ 300mg/week Pinning: Mon/Wed/Fri

Weeks 1-9 Deca @ 600mg/week Pinning: Every Monday.

Weeks 6-9 Dbol @ 40mg/ED

Weeks 1-10 (+ 4 days until Test was out the system) Asin @ 20mg/ED - NB: The Dbol was legit, had to up the dose to 40mg/ED during weeks 6-9 - noticed increase in acne, slightly puffy nips.

PCT: Nolva 40/40/40/20/20 - I will talk about why I did 3 weeks at 40mg/ED later.

 

 

This prompted me to think about the gear I was actually sold. Firstly, I know the Test-P couldn't have been Test-E for two reasons; (a). the pip was insane (b). it didn't make business sense for my vendor to sell me Test-E instead (or branded as) of Test-E, this was because of two reasons (i). I asked him for Test-E in the first place and he said he was out (ii). He was charging more for Test-E than P (expected given raw prices). I knew the Dbol was legit but discontinued use of it ages before the third bloods. This leads me to point fingers at the Deca, which very much could have been Test-E instead and would explain my test levels still being through the roof at week 12.

 

 

 

Your Test P' could have been enanthate with too high BA..

 

Propionate would be showing at appreciable levels for a couple of days after last pin, no more...

 

Nandrolone would be present up to about week 11... its metabolites for much longer..

[bodyfat_zero]

I meant the Lab for blood tests sorry,  I see you got SBHG and Free Test done. SCL labs would not do that test for me. 

It was all through SCL, however I get my bloods done for free through my doc. I figure there is no point taking risks without knowing what is going on, for the sake of a higher insurance premium in the future. The health centre I use also is free on all visits because I am a student.

 

 

 

Your Test P' could have been enanthate with too high BA..

 

 

 

Propionate would be showing at appreciable levels for a couple of days after last pin, no more...

 

 

 

Nandrolone would be present up to about week 11... its metabolites for much longer..

 

I realise this, Nandrolone may have been around for a while yes 11-12day half life, I also tapered down in the last week. It could be either Test-P build up or Deca.

 

I will get more bloods done next week on Monday, will post results when I get them.

[atrollappears]

It was all through SCL, however I get my bloods done for free through my doc. I figure there is no point taking risks without knowing what is going on, for the sake of a higher insurance premium in the future. The health centre I use also is free on all visits because I am a student.

 

 

I realise this, Nandrolone may have been around for a while yes 11-12day half life, I also tapered down in the last week. It could be either Test-P build up or Deca.

 

I will get more bloods done next week on Monday, will post results when I get them.

 

Nandrolone half life is closer to 7-8 days...

 

The half life of Propionate can be as short as 0.8 days, it won't be residual test from propionate..

[bodyfat_zero]

Nandrolone half life is closer to 7-8 days...

 

The half life of Propionate can be as short as 0.8 days, it won't be residual test from propionate..

Everyone is yarning contradictory information in this thread lol. What you are saying is what I first thought.

[Daz69]

Everyone is yarning contradictory information in this thread lol. What you are saying is what I first thought.

 

Then someone must be wrong...

 

I have a paper showing propionate as having 0.8 day half life in some people, maybe as high as 2 days in others, dependant on concentration, bolus size, site of injection... 

 

I have experienced enanthate with too high BA and subsequent pip...

[bang_bang]

Test should be atleast equal so you can bang girls and not just flog them with it due to deca dick lol. Bloating, large strength gains and ache are all deca sides but test and dbol will do the same. It's hard to know whats doing what when you blast 2 new compounds at the same time..

 

Did you wait 2-3 weeks for the deca to clear before you started PCT?

[nate225]

Using nolva only is hardly a PCT....why would you wait for nandrolone to clear??

Point taken if using hcg or clomid, but with a pure estrogen blocker or AI with no effect on testes it seems silly, especially given the majority of E produced will be from the short acting T used. The T:Estrogen ratio will be well fucked by the time nandrolone has cleared.....

[HarryB]

Nandrolone half life is closer to 7-8 days...

The half life of Propionate can be as short as 0.8 days, it won't be residual test from propionate..

Stop being all factual. ..

[atrollappears]

Test should be atleast equal so you can bang girls and not just flog them with it due to deca dick lol. Bloating, large strength gains and ache are all deca sides but test and dbol will do the same. It's hard to know whats doing what when you blast 2 new compounds at the same time..

 

Did you wait 2-3 weeks for the deca to clear before you started PCT?

 

Its prudent to cease nandrolone 2 weeks prior to test, unfortunately nandrolone metabolites can be present in blood up to 6 months after cessation, which can cause issue when attempting to re-start HPTA...

 

Plus any estrogenic response from nandrolone is via estren....Estren is a metabolite of nandrolone through the 3α-HSD enzyme,  Estren is capable of activating estrogen specific constructs in the DNA through the AR (androgen receptor). Therefore using a SERM or AI is pointless..

[atrollappears]

Using nolva only is hardly a PCT....why would you wait for nandrolone to clear??

Point taken if using hcg or clomid, but with a pure estrogen blocker or AI with no effect on testes it seems silly, especially given the majority of E produced will be from the short acting T used. The T:Estrogen ratio will be well fucked by the time nandrolone has cleared.....

 

Its wise to use an AI in the last week of test to lower Estrogen, prior to going into PCT, then a SERM could be used to block any estrogenic response, which in turn should work via negative feedback to restart HPTA...

I believe Yeelang showed Nolva was fine for PCT....

 

I personally favour Clomid, as Clomid does more then act as an anti-estrogen in certain tissues. In the pituitary it acts as an estrogen, sensitizing pituitary cells to the actions of gonadotropin-releasing hormone (GnRH). This stimulates release of FSH & LH

[bodyfat_zero]

Test should be atleast equal so you can bang girls and not just flog them with it due to deca dick lol. Bloating, large strength gains and ache are all deca sides but test and dbol will do the same. It's hard to know whats doing what when you blast 2 new compounds at the same time..

 

Did you wait 2-3 weeks for the deca to clear before you started PCT?

 

Yes I waited.

 

My dick is working perfectly fine thanks, never had any issues with getting it up or off haha even on high deca/lower test - lucky me eh.

 

Definitely saw the most gains when I started Dbol, and up until that point I had not seen any estrogenic sides - was noticing a bit of bloat before I started Dbol but it was minimal. Dbol gave me minimal face acne (like 1-2 pimples) but a little more backne.

 

Using nolva only is hardly a PCT....why would you wait for nandrolone to clear??

Point taken if using hcg or clomid, but with a pure estrogen blocker or AI with no effect on testes it seems silly, especially given the majority of E produced will be from the short acting T used. The T:Estrogen ratio will be well fucked by the time nandrolone has cleared.....

Didn't have access to HCG or Clomid. Would have definitely used.

[ZADIE]

What's next cycle and when?