NPP:test ratio

[Boosting]

Hey is there any particular ratio ppl would recommend for npp and test? And do you ramp up the npp doses as cycle progresses or just run constant dose?

-My goal is to get bigger and more importantly stronger.

-Want to get as strong as i can within 11ish weeks. Main goal is to deadlift 8pps(20kg plates)/340kg but will do a 3 lift and also maybe a push/pull a month after.

-I have only 10g NPP, practically unlimited test.

-Will be using orals. Hopefully a ghrp+mod grf 1-29 also, although dont physically have it yet.

[jimmybro1]

Most cycles I have heard of people doing was a 1:1 ratio of Test to Nandrolone

[Boosting]

Most cycles I have heard of people doing was a 1:1 ratio of Test to Nandrolone

Hmm interesting. Wonder if thsts for any particular reason.

[Daz69]

Hmm interesting. Wonder if thats for any particular reason.

 

Down to personal preference... Can be dependant on whether you are prone to nandrolone side effects..

Nandrolone has been shown to cause adverse effects to cardiovascular tissue, because of this it seems to have recently gone out of favour as one of the more popular steroids, as our understanding of the negative effects of AAS improves ..

 

The main problem is fibrosis in cardiovascular tissues. Fibrosis is the deposition of less flexible collagen not just in the heart but in arteries and veins across the body. This seems to occur directly and indirectly as a result of AAS use, and some AAS are worse than others - eg Deca is notoriously bad. This extra collagen makes the cardiovascular tissues a bit 'stiffer' and increases the pressure (force) required by the heart to pump blood through the body (increases the 'load').

As a result, a rather less healthy (and structurally maladaptive) deposition of new muscle (LVH) will occur in an attempt to overcome the strain of the increasing load, and once past a certain size, it begins to reduce the efficiency of the heart as a pump. But the fibrosis also affects things like the passage of nerve impulses across the heart (often resulting in atrial fibrillation or heart block, for example), and interferes with the essential growth of new blood vessels (angiogenesis) to the new cardiac muscle, potentially starving these tissues of oxygen, resulting in pain (angina), necrosis and scarring. And the scarring makes the heart even more inflexible, and is thus basically a very unwelcome positive feedback loop.

All these outcomes are incredibly unhealthy for the heart, and probably explain why some powerlifters/bodybuilders (anecdotally, and I suppose relative to their otherwise incredibly healthy looking bodies) seem to suffer disproportionately from heart attacks, afib etc etc.

[jimmybro1]

Down to personal preference... Can be dependant on whether you are prone to nandrolone side effects..

Nandrolone has been shown to cause adverse effects to cardiovascular tissue, because of this it seems to have recently gone out of favour as one of the more popular steroids, as our understanding of the negative effects of AAS improves ..

 

The main problem is fibrosis in cardiovascular tissues. Fibrosis is the deposition of less flexible collagen not just in the heart but in arteries and veins across the body. This seems to occur directly and indirectly as a result of AAS use, and some AAS are worse than others - eg Deca is notoriously bad. This extra collagen makes the cardiovascular tissues a bit 'stiffer' and increases the pressure (force) required by the heart to pump blood through the body (increases the 'load').

As a result, a rather less healthy (and structurally maladaptive) deposition of new muscle (LVH) will occur in an attempt to overcome the strain of the increasing load, and once past a certain size, it begins to reduce the efficiency of the heart as a pump. But the fibrosis also affects things like the passage of nerve impulses across the heart (often resulting in atrial fibrillation or heart block, for example), and interferes with the essential growth of new blood vessels (angiogenesis) to the new cardiac muscle, potentially starving these tissues of oxygen, resulting in pain (angina), necrosis and scarring. And the scarring makes the heart even more inflexible, and is thus basically a very unwelcome positive feedback loop.

All these outcomes are incredibly unhealthy for the heart, and probably explain why some powerlifters/bodybuilders (anecdotally, and I suppose relative to their otherwise incredibly healthy looking bodies) seem to suffer disproportionately from heart attacks, afib etc etc.

Interesting Daz. 

 

Was curious of the effects of particular anabolics on the heart. Its well known cholesterol and blood pressure can increase but haven't heard this before. Clen also being another compound that can advisedly affect the heart. 

 

Been reading into heart conditions a bit recently due to my recent low blood pressure and I was under the impression something like fibrosis is largely genetic? Have a colleague at work that has this condition and originally had a blood pressure of 240/120 at 40BPM! Currently has a pace maker and feeling mint though accompanied with a handful of blood pressure meds. 

 

Where did you find this information? Are there studies showing the progression over time etc? Would be interested to read. 

[jimmybro1]

 

What evidence is there that AAS administration enhances the LV hypertrophic response to resistance exercise?

In this issue of Heart, Urhausen and colleagues report the results of a cross sectional study of cardiac morphology in relation to AAS use.13 Male bodybuilders/powerlifters currently using AAS or ex-users who had abstained from AAS exposure for over 12 months (U and ExU, n  =  17 and 15, respectively) were compared to 15 weightlifters who denied current or past use of AAS (WL). Left ventricular wall thickness and cavity dimensions were assessed using echocardiography, and muscle mass (LVMM) calculated using the Devereux equation. Absolute LVMM measures (mean (SD)) were significantly greater for U than ExU or WL (281 (54) g v 232 (42) g v 204 (44) g for U v ExU v WL, respectively), with differences between ExU and WL only reaching significance after adjustment for body surface area or fat-free mass. These results suggest that AAS use increases the LV hypertrophic response to exercise, an effect which might last for well over a year.

 

 

 

Such data must nonetheless be treated with caution. We know, for example, that the magnitude and pattern of hypertrophy is dependent on the nature, duration, and intensity of exercise undertaken.8,9,14 Thus, strength trained athletes (such as weightlifters, powerlifters, bodybuilders, and throwers) develop a greater increase in wall thickness, a more concentric pattern of LV growth, and a lesser increase in LV chamber internal dimensions8 in comparison to those undergoing predominantly aerobic/endurance exercise.

 

It seems resistance training allow will increase LVH... So the journal is suggesting people resistance training are effectively increasing there risk of a heart condition 

[Daz69]

High blood pressure independent of AAS causes enlargement of the heart.  AAS gives a second hit.  The smooth muscle of the cardiovascular system is AR positive.  At high AAS concentration those muscle cells will hypertrophy. The job of the smooth muscle in the musculature is to pump rhythmically in a wave like form to assist the movement of blood.  With AAS induced hypertrophy of the smooth muscle that motion is compromised shifting more of the burden to the heart. Now I'm too old to play go fetch the pubmed abstracts but if you dig there you can find the support. It's an inconvenient truth but just be aware of it and try to limit super high dose use and control blood pressure.  One of the reasons that Diovan is so good for AAS users for blood pressure control is because it relaxes the smooth muscle of the vasculature opening the diameter and relieving some of the tension caused by hypertrophy.

[Realtalk]

Just do your cardio and eat well and don't smoke. Then you're ahead of most of the population even still if you are running grams of shit.

There is no need to panic here guys.

Of course if you use shit loads, eat shit, don't cardio and enjoy a fag every now and then... Well you might want to reassess what you're doing.. Of course if you die we will blame aas and not your shit diet or lack of movement. Duurrr