Comp prep cycle - opinions please

[Leeroid]

I'm currently 7 weeks out from IFBB Aucklands on Aug 15. Sitting at 83kg morning weight (84-85 at night) and about 10-12% bodyfat (picture attached from Saturday).

Right now I'm using 400mg of Test E a week which I've been on for 4 weeks. Also taking 10mg of Aromasin twice a week which seems to be the right level for me.

Here's what I plan to change to next week (6 weeks out):

Test P 100mg EOD (350mg/week)
Tren Ace 100mg EOD (350mg/week)

4 weeks out I will add 40mg Winstrol everyday.

Now I also have some Masteron Enanthate that I would like to use as well but not sure how to incorporate it into the cycle. It's dosed at 150mg/ml.

I was thinking I could do a ml of it EOD (525mg/week) but then that would make it a 3ml injection and I don't like doing 2ml+ injections. So if I did do Mast, I would pin ED and do 0.5ml of each everyday, making it only a 1.5ml shot.

My question is would Masteron be of enough benefit to warrant it's inclusion in the cycle, especially 6 weeks out as the enanthate ester?

And as for AI usage, would the inclusion of Masteron negate the need for Aromasin or should I keep taking it?

Cheers

[Daz69]

 

My question is would Masteron be of enough benefit to warrant it's inclusion in the cycle, especially 6 weeks out as the enanthate ester?

And as for AI usage, would the inclusion of Masteron negate the need for Aromasin or should I keep taking it?

Cheers

 

The rumor that mast and provi are anti-estrogens has been going around for nigh on 30 years now, but there is honestly nothing to suggest that. Both are pure androgens though, so that both will help ameliorate A:E ratios and combat estrogenic effect in that manner....

[Daz69]

Hey Tom.... Here's a bit of a rant by Peter Van Mol on Masteron:

 

I've read this stupidity in so many threads, and literally every other board, book and article, that I just decided to make this into a new thread. But apparently no one in the whole AAS game understand the difference between androgen mediated repression of estrogenic actions and actual anti-estrogenic actions. 

SERMS, are partial agonists and partial antagonists at the ER. Where they are antagonistic (like all of them are in the breast), they can be considered anti-estriogens. Aromatase inhibitors are anti-estrogens.

Dihydrotestosterone and ONLY dihydrotestosterone, as an androgen, has very mild anti-aromatase activity and could be considered a very mild anti-estrogen. THIS DOES NOT, NEVER DID, AND NEVER WILL MEAN THAT EVERY 5-ALPHA-REDUCED HORMONE (or DHT derivative as some like to call it) HAS ANTI-AROMATASE ACTION.

Androgens of all sorts, including actual testosterone, have been used in the clinical treatment of breast cancer, because androgen receptor binding in the breast, outweighing estrogen receptor activation, will counteract the estrogen-induced proliferation of breast cells. This is not an anti-estrogenic action, this is merely a function of androgens in the breast to counteract breast growth. This applies to :

- Mesterolone. Basically 1-methyl DHT, but the A-ring modification would interefere with aromatase binding. Meaning if DHT is a weak anti-aromatase drug, then the activity mesterolone might still have would require in excess of 500mg per day to have any direct anti-aromatase effect worth having. If you are using Proviron specifically as an anti-estrogen, you are wasting your money. It's effect in this regard is no different than any other potent androgen.

-Drostanolone, the 2-methyl group isn't just an A-ring modification that prevents or limits aromatase binding, it structurally protects the 3-keto group from being reduced, which is a requirement for aromatase function. Drostanolone is absolutely NOT an aromatase blocker. This is just some label given to it by people who saw it was predominantly used in treatment for breast cancer (which it was quite good at, because despite its weak nature, it is a very pure androgen, with little or no interaction outside of the AR) and the fact that it was structurally related to DHT. 

-Epistane, similar to drostanolone, the non17AA version Epitiostanol was principally used to treat breast cancer. There is no evidence or suggestion that points to either structure having the least bit of affinity for aromatase, let alone being a functionally active inhibitor in doses used. 

- Stanozolol, and I just read this one today on our very own winny thread, is MOST DEFINITELY NOT an anti-estrogen. On the contrary. The study mentioned below shows that Stanozolol can actually induce partial estrogenic sexual maturation in ovariectomized female rats. It would actually be an extremey weak estrogen, rather than an anti-estrogen.

Whitney AC, Clark AS. Effects of acute stanozolol treatment on puberty in female rats. Biol Reprod 2001 May;64(5):1460-5.

So please, do not confuse these things. known AI's like letrozole, anastrozole and exemestane are anti-estrogens. SERMs are conditional anti-estrogens. DHT, as a very, very mild AI, could potentially be termed modestly anti-estrogenic. Pretty much all other androgens we use ARE NOT ANTI-ESTROGENIC. Their effect in counteracting estrogen is purely based on their activity at the AR, and the effect is always going to be greater for more potent androgens. 

If there is no evidence of anti-estrogenic action, please don't go around saying it's anti-estrogenic. Any increase in A:E ratio by the addition of a non-aromatizing, non-estrogenic androgen will in fact have some apparent estrogen countering effect, simply because you are increasing the ratio of androgens to estrogens.

[Leeroid]

Thanks Daz

 

The rumor that mast and provi are anti-estrogens has been going around for nigh on 30 years now, but there is honestly nothing to suggest that. Both are pure androgens though, so that both will help ameliorate A:E ratios and combat estrogenic effect in that manner....

Thanks Daz, I've always wondered about that. Cheers

 

Any input on my other question or my cycle in general?

 

And as for fat burners, I don't think I will use any this prep. I have Albuterol on hand but I think I can get to comp condition without using it. I will evaluate myself 4 weeks out and reconsider if I believe I need more help losing fat

[Leeroid]

Bump

[Depleted]

Hi

Ive run mast/tren/prop at varying doses and have not found mast to be worth the administration. (possibly under dosed) The so called drying out affect never really has been noticeable for me. Tren A/Prop seems to be the usual and of course winny is great if genuine. I normally drop the prop 2 weeks out and run tren only. seems to work.

[Leeroid]

Hi

Ive run mast/tren/prop at varying doses and have not found mast to be worth the administration. (possibly under dosed) The so called drying out affect never really has been noticeable for me. Tren A/Prop seems to be the usual and of course winny is great if genuine. I normally drop the prop 2 weeks out and run tren only. seems to work.

Cheers for the reply bro. Exactly the sort of answer I was looking for. What do you do for estrogen? Do you run an AI even though there's no test?

[DIANABOL]

Drop the test altogether 4 weeks out, id prefer tren mast p winstrol HALO and letro.

Best cycle i ever ran

[DIANABOL]

MastP at 1.5g a week -8% BF will do wonders for striations in my experience 

[DIANABOL]

Last cycle I ran before my gut fucked out

 

1.5ml Tren A ED

1.5ml Mast P ED

150mg Stan ED

20mg Halo ED

1mg Letro ED

40mg Albuterol

100mcg T3

 

118kg 6% 4 weeks out then threw in the towel as i could stomach nothing without throwing up

[Leeroid]

Last cycle I ran before my gut fucked out

1.5ml Tren A ED

1.5ml Mast P ED

150mg Stan ED

20mg Halo ED

1mg Letro ED

40mg Albuterol

100mcg T3

118kg 6% 4 weeks out then threw in the towel as i could stomach nothing without throwing up

Wow that's one hearty cycle!! Not surprised your body couldn't take it. You must've looked absolutely sick though, I think I remember seeing the pictures you posted and they were truly impressive

[maccaz]

Wow that's one hearty cycle!! Not surprised your body couldn't take it. You must've looked absolutely sick though, I think I remember seeing the pictures you posted and they were truly impressive

just 40mg albuterol alone would make me feel like shit i reckon lol let alone other stuff

[Leeroid]

Thanks for all the input guys. Started my new comp prep cycle today. Exactly 40 days out from show day.

 

Pinning everyday until comp day

75mg Tren Acetate (525mg/week)

120mg Masteron Enanthate (840mg/week)

 

Monday and Thursday until comp day

10mg Aromasin

 

From 4 weeks out I will add 40mg Winstrol everyday

 

From 2 weeks out I will up Winstrol to 60mg everyday. I will also add 10mg Nolva everyday as well.

 

For the last 5 days, so starting on the Monday of comp week, I will take 100mg Winstrol and 20mg Nolva everyday. 

 

 

 

[Realtalk]

You ever read much about letrozole in the final week or so?

[Leeroid]

You ever read much about letrozole in the final week or so?

I have letro but I don't think I'll need it if I'm not running any test for 6 weeks plus all my compounds are dry. Also with Nolva and Aromasin, I don't think there'll be any estrogen in my body on comp day. What do you think?

[Realtalk]

Not sure iv never done it or read much about it just heard of people doing it. I can't think of anything worse feeling wise. I think I'd be bed ridden lol. Missed that you weren't using any testosterone so yeah good point bro. All the best!

[Pseudonym]

I don't think I've seen too many non-test cycles. It's often regarded as heresy to suggest such a terrible thing.

 

Keep a detailed log, Leeroid - I'll be following with interest.

[maccaz]

see few people do this on aus forum (no test, high tren/mast) in late stage of comp prep, with the reasoning that worst case scenario you will lose libido completely and you dont need that on stage anyway. good point lol

[Tonkintechnique]

Good stuff putting this up bro! cool to see you being so open!

 

As for not taking Test not from a bodybuilding stand point but quite few fighters have been caught for anavar only, maybe they were also taking test but it didnt show up as it was low dose. But my point being i'm sure you will still perform well without it!

[maccaz]

Good stuff putting this up bro! cool to see you being so open!

 

As for not taking Test not from a bodybuilding stand point but quite few fighters have been caught for anavar only, maybe they were also taking test but it didnt show up as it was low dose. But my point being i'm sure you will still perform well without it!

good point. anderson silva was masteron i think? 

[Leeroid]

Good stuff putting this up bro! cool to see you being so open!

As for not taking Test not from a bodybuilding stand point but quite few fighters have been caught for anavar only, maybe they were also taking test but it didnt show up as it was low dose. But my point being i'm sure you will still perform well without it!

Cheers bro. Thought it would help some people out especially as it relates to contest prep.

I'm not worried about sex drive at all. I don't have a gf so nobody to disappoint and girls won't really be on my mind until after comp. I'll provide updates on how my sex drive is and everything else too. Just ask me a question if there's anything else you wanna know. I'm interested to see how no test will go, especially with such a high level of androgens. Hopefully it makes a visible difference and I can look good on stage

[jimmybro1]

Cheers bro. Thought it would help some people out especially as it relates to contest prep.

I'm not worried about sex drive at all. I don't have a gf so nobody to disappoint and girls won't really be on my mind until after comp. I'll provide updates on how my sex drive is and everything else too. Just ask me a question if there's anything else you wanna know. I'm interested to see how no test will go, especially with such a high level of androgens. Hopefully it makes a visible difference and I can look good on stage

Whats the plan for recovery after blasting for the competition? 

 

Also planning to do nationals ? or waiting to see how placing goes? 

[Tonkintechnique]

good point. anderson silva was masteron i think? 

I'm not to sure bro but i can name a few guys who have only showed up for deca or Masteron or EQ but i assume they are still taking a form of test as those 3 compounds stay detectable far longer especially Deca. Which is why i just don't understand way athletes who get tested risk taking it.

[Tonkintechnique]

Sorry to hijack a bit Leeroid. 

 

Hows the appetite atm, is the stack making you more hungry or are the orals helping with prep hunger or just not noticeable. 

[Leeroid]

Whats the plan for recovery after blasting for the competition?

Also planning to do nationals ? or waiting to see how placing goes?

I'll just go back on 200mg per week test e for a while unless I decide to do nationals in which case I'll go back onto 500 test e until I start the cutting cycle for Nat's.

Will decide on Nat's after Auckland's