Letro on hand or with cycle?

[Taekwando]

Got my first cycle coming up test e 500mg 10weeks and also in thinking about adding in dbol for thw first 4 weeks, i got liquid letro and 40 nolva pills i can use throughout my cycle, queation is shuld i use letro on cycle or only wen i start getting  gyno symptoms which i hopefully dont !

[Murhf]

Keep some on hand if you can. I just got a touch of gyno, knocked it down striaght away. Nothing...nothing worse for a man than boobys....I probally wouldn.t take it thru a cycle, its quite hard on my system, but thats just me.

[Terrymundo]

I will comment on using Letro as an AI on cycle:

Letro can be run very effectively along side a cycle (I am currently doing so) as long as it's done RIGHT! Letro has the power to be very harsh and has a few annoying effects on the body. As far as AIs go letro is the last resort, so my advice would be to try something milder like adex or aromasin at low dose. Letro has the ability to drive your estrogen levels to ZERO and this not something you want to do (sex drive, hindering gains etc) . AI is all about stricking a BALANCE not to kill your estrogen. Letro being the beast it is, makes it very difficult to do so. People often require a course of nolvadex or other SERM after Letro as estrogen can rebound and cause all the nasty things we bodybuilders dread. SO USE WITH CAUTION!

If you are very gyno prone like me you may need to resort letro best manage your estrogen levels. I have found a little sweet spot at 0.5mg E3D to keep the gyno at bay whilst keep a health sex drive and the joints lubricated. on this lower does it may not be nesasary to follow up with Nolva.

 

To kill gyno (keeping letro onhand):

Absolute must!! I never let a 5mg Dbol in my house without having a good supply of Letro and Nolva(follow up). To kill gyno with letro you will need to take an aggressive course (1mg ED is what I've done) for a week or two (depends on how quick the gyno goes+ a few more days to seal the deal) this often results in complete gyno reversal BUTS NEEDS TO BE FOLLOWED UP NOLVA (20mg ed for 2-3weeks).

 

All the above is not from what I read buit rather compiled from experience.

[Daz69]

Got my first cycle coming up test e 500mg 10weeks and also in thinking about adding in dbol for thw first 4 weeks, i got liquid letro and 40 nolva pills i can use throughout my cycle, queation is shuld i use letro on cycle or only wen i start getting  gyno symptoms which i hopefully dont !

I'd agree with what Terry said regards Letro, its a very harsh compound and should only be used if absolutely necessary.. 

Any issues with abnormally high estrogen should be dealth with first with Adex, not letro..

You may not experience high estrogen, some people don't, it might be prudent to have blood tests on a regular basis throughout your cycle to confirm.. Any issues can be quickly dealt with, rather than guessing whats going on....

Estrogen isn't a bad thing, in fact most of the benefits we take for granted on a Test cycle would be significantly reduced were it not for Estrogen: The reasons go beyond size weight and strength gains one would attribute to estrogen related water retention, with estrogen having a direct effect on anabolism. This is manifest through increases in glucose utilization, growth hormone secretion, and androgen receptor proliferation..

Studies show the aromatisation of test is responsible for G6PD (glucose 6-phosphate dehydrogenase) an enzyme directly tied to the use of glucose for muscle tissue growth and recuperation..

Estrogen: plays in important part in the production of growth hormone and IGF-1, it can increase androgen receptor binding..  

estrogen suppression is associated with fatigue...

So you see estrogen isn't inherantly bad for you, just too much is..!!

 

 

[Taekwando]

 Ok guys thank for the replys, i think will just drop the dbol and see how test goes as this is my first so yea, i originally wanted aromasin or adex but was unable to source some so i just ordered liquid letro online, i think il just have it on hand and if i start getting symptoms add it in at around .25-4 mg e3d.

[Murhf]

Excellent posts guys...I learn something every day here.

 A few days ago I started developing gyno, took nolva first [kind of panicked] but also have Letro. Strating it tomorrow, kind of nervous at the thought of shutting down the estro...but hey what can I do, can.t put it off to long. Question, if the symptoms disapear fast can I stop the letro, or as you say  leave it a few days to seal the deal. 1mg seems high, not that I have a clue what Iam talking about...does say a week at this affect your mood? Should I expect anything like depression or extreme tiredness?  And one more question, Iam obviously prone to gyno also, is this something that automatically comes back every few weeks or is it luck of the draw when I get it. Terrymundo is .5 e3ds standard for most people, or have you gone to high ect to find your balance. What Iam asking is would .25 e3ds be a good place to start!

 

[yeelang]

Just be wary of running out of Nolva, 40 is borderline given your cycle

 

[Terrymundo]

Absolutley Murf! if you can keep the balance on the lower dose then do it! It can be tough to gauge as you often have few noticable effects of high/low estrogen. So start with 0.25mg E3D and run it for a week at leant, if that keeps things ticky boo then stick with that! If not, wander the dose to 0.5mg E3D and go from there. When I start my use of letro as my AI I started at 1mg ED to burn out the developing gyno then fell back to 0.5mg E3D. Sometimes 0.5mg E3D dosn't seem to be enough and the gyno starts play up. All I do is increase the frequency (not the dose) to EOD or ED dependending on how paniced I am *biggrin*. once it settles down I resume the E3D.

 

Hope this helps

[Taekwando]

Just wondering if i ran dbol for 3-4 weeks culd i run 20-10mg nolva for those 3-4weeks im on dbol and then once im done with dbol i stop the nolva and continue on with test..would that be algud? Or do u have to run nolva from start to end?

[yeelang]

Excellent posts guys...I learn something every day here.

 A few days ago I started developing gyno, took nolva first [kind of panicked] but also have Letro. Strating it tomorrow, kind of nervous at the thought of shutting down the estro...but hey what can I do, can.t put it off to long. Question, if the symptoms disapear fast can I stop the letro, or as you say  leave it a few days to seal the deal. 1mg seems high, not that I have a clue what Iam talking about...does say a week at this affect your mood? Should I expect anything like depression or extreme tiredness?  And one more question, Iam obviously prone to gyno also, is this something that automatically comes back every few weeks or is it luck of the draw when I get it. Terrymundo is .5 e3ds standard for most people, or have you gone to high ect to find your balance. What Iam asking is would .25 e3ds be a good place to start!

 

 

I've run letro at 2.5mg, (pyramid up/pyramid off) biggest issue was joints after 7 day mark. The mood effects are indivdual. 

 

Edit: I'm not suggesting this by the way, just pointing out the experience I had

[Murhf]

Would it be helpful for me to get bloods done once aweek, can this help indicate the high estro, or am I still guessing to a certain degree. Am going for bloods tomorrow, just before I start letro. Trying not to sound to dumb, but should I start at say 0.5 ed for a week and see what happens, if the gyno goes completely then tapper back down to .25 e3d for another week followed by 4 weeks of nolva. Gyno seems pretty minamal and like most people we can get carried away with checking our tittys. My nipples got really sensitive on friday, followed by itchyness, a mild dull ache, then a day later I noticed a smaill lump, but its not under the nipple, its to the left about 3 mil. And all this is only in my left booby, even my partner said geez am I making your this horny all day long...your nipples are harder than ya dick...which is a rough thing to say when your on gear, considering she enjoys the perks of test, lol. Thanks for the help everyone, no amount of research is better than the horses mouth.

[Chemo]

Just a side note.

 

I've done letro at 2.5 - 3mg ed. attempting to tackle gyno from pre gear days.

Was on 200test. Didn't feel too much. Sex drive was lower but not crashed.

i immediately thought my letro was fake but when I looked into it further I found some info.

 

There's some good studies showing young males having lesser e2 suppression from letro than aromasin. Due to the higher levels of circulating T. And reduces the half life of the drug.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16046582

The 97+% figure actually comes from letro applied to females. Why this changes with males I suspect is the half life thing.

Aromasin seems to be the best bet when it comes to e2 suppression, it also increases igf somehow too. Lol. Mad gains bros.

Long term nolva or raloxifen use with an AI would prob treat gyno better. If you can successfully block estrogen getting to the cell. It dies. (Yay) 

but as MNZ has covered before, serms are not the healthiest of drugs and should be used with discretion and perspective.

Just wondering if i ran dbol for 3-4 weeks culd i run 20-10mg nolva for those 3-4weeks im on dbol and then once im done with dbol i stop the nolva and continue on with test..would that be algud? Or do u have to run nolva from start to end?

Have letro ready, if you feel sensitive, run it with the dbol at a low dose. 1mg

if you feel gyno coming on you can go off the dbol and or use some nolva. Increase your letro dose and continue with the dbol. Or if you feel the gyno is still coming just stop the dbol. It's out of your system quick so there's no real damage done.

 

important thing is tht you have those tools if needed.