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Nicotine for nattys

Chemo

By Chemo
in Diet & nutrition

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Chemo Senior member

Chemo

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Hey lads, just posting some food for thought, and getting some discussion going around nicotine. I notice some of the younger lads have been using it with some success, so I wanted to get some more info.

It looks like a valuable drug, especially as a natty, using nicotine alongside something like D-Aspartic acid for bulking could produce some meaningful effects without sticking a needle in the ass.

And for cutting just as useful. Its said 100mg of caffiene and 1mg of nicotine increase the fat burning properties by about 100%

(I don't have the copy paste for this)

Heres a copy paste outlining the good and some bad. Have a read if you have the time.

A week ago I was reading an article on hormone replacement therapy, in the article it stated that women you are going through menopause or on estrogen replacement should not smoke since nicotine lowers estrogen levels. From reading this I decided to try to find out more about its anti estrogenic effects. From searching the web I found a whole slew of positive effects of nicotine. Most of the info I am writing comes from the Hippo, Hippo II and Fate of nicotine in the body reports. These are studies done on nicotine in the late 70’s.

Nicotine as an Anti-estrogen/Anti-aromatase

Nicotine works in two ways to lower estrogen levels. First it is an anti-aromatase like arimadex. Nicotine has been shown to inhibit the conversion of androstenedione and testosterone into estrogen in a study by the University of Utah School of medicine. Also unlike novadex or clomid nicotine is a true anti estrogen and not just an estrogen blocker. By this I mean that nicotine actually speeds up the degradation of blood estrogen levels. So nicotine causes a reduction in estrogen production and also decreases existing estrogen levels.

Regulation of hormone levels

When Nicotine is used on a daily basis it stabilizes the Adrenal hormones by acting on the Hypothalamus, which affects the pituitaries release of regulating hormones and increases GH release. This keeps various hormone levels stable during times of depression, or stress. That is why a smoker can have a cigarette in the morning to wake up and one at night to help relax.

When you stop using nicotine your whole endocrine system gets f_cked up. Your cortisone, and adrenaline levels take a nose dive until your natural hormone regulation takes control again. Fortunately nicotine does not seem to have a negative effect on GH release upon cessation.

Getting your natural hormone levels back in order takes about two weeks. As body builders we can use this to our advantage. When you stop a cycle you can start using nicotine. This will quickly reduce the high cortisone levels to a normal level. After coming off nicotine you can start a new cycle and take advantage of the low cortisone levels for the first two weeks

Nicotine as a smart drug

Nicotine is a cholinergic agonist and mimics the effects of acetylcholine. It also has been shown to increase levels of neurotransmitters dopamine, nor-epinephrine, and serotonin. Dopaminergic neurons are linked to reward pathways and pleasure while serotonergic neurons are associated with anti-anxiety.

This effect may explain the addicting property of nicotine. But they also seem to have some nootropic benefits. Studies have shown that mice perform better on mentally strenuous tasks after being given Nicotine. Nicotine also causes a release of vassopresin. This hormone is the hormone that helps imprint thoughts into long-term memory.

Help with PGF2a

In one study nicotine was able to reduce the side effects of the prostaglandin PGF2a. In isolated canine retinal arteries partially contracted with PGF2á nicotine was added and resulted in the relaxation of those arteries without affecting the other effects of PGF2a. So in theory nicotine can be added to a PGF2a cycle to decrease intestinal discomfort.

Nicotine also seems to cause a release of prostaglandins, which favors the good prostaglandins like PGF2a.

Fat loss properties:

One study stated that Nicotine was possibly the most effective anti obesity drug available at the time that the study was performed (late 70’s). Nicotine has various properties that help in weight reduction while sparing muscle.

Reduced appetite:

Nicotine inhibits food intake via three mechanisms, first it elevated Adrenalin and Nor-adrenalin levels which reduces appetite. Next Nicotine itself has been shown to reduce the craving for carbohydrates. Great addition to a ketogenic diet.

Thermogenic effects:

The release of Adrenalin and Nor-adrenalin also cause a thermogenic effect similar to that of ECA.

Actual fat reduction:

Nicotine stimulates a very rapid mobilization of fatty deposits. This happens as quickly as 10 minutes after administration. The lipids are mobilized and free fatty acids are released in the blood stream in great amounts. The free fatty acids diminish quickly due to an unknown action of nicotine. Nicotine seems to help the body use the FFA’s for energy in an accelerated fashion.

To recap Nicotine has an eight-fold weight loss effect on the system.

1.Reduction of overall appetite

2.Reduced craving for carbs

3.Thermogenic effect

4.Fatty deposit mobilization

5.Stimulation of FFA degradation

6.Estrogen reduction

7.Prostaglandin release

8.Growth hormone release

Negative aspects of Nicotine:

I have talked about all the good things that nicotine does but what are the negative effects? Well I know everyone is thinking cancer right? Wrong, nicotine is not the cancer-causing agent in cigarettes. It is just the addictive chemical that makes you intake the 2000 or so carcinogens in tobacco. I am not talking about smoking here; use the gum or the patches. Nicotine does have some negative effects though:

Negative effects of Nicotine:

1.Decreased Vit. C

2.Decreased Vit. E

3.Increased VLDL

4.Decreased HDL

5.Addictive properties

6.And all the typical sides of stimulants

So to counteract these just make sure you take extra vitamin C and E and watch your saturated fat intake. As for the addictive properties well thats up to you.

Should also not its a vaso-constricter (shrinks the blood vessels) and increases heart rate.

Further comments and thoughts?

Also, dont smoke :P

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drizzt Veteran member

drizzt

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Nice post bro, liked.

I had heard whispers of this before on a T-Nation article (I think?). Not specifically about the anti-estrogenic effects (I don't recall that anyway), but that in conjunction with some caffeine it could assist in a cut.

I went as far as buying a pack and chewing through it for a few days. Obviously not long enough to notice an effect, however I did get a nice little buzz out of it (not ever having had much nicotine at all in life), and would be keen to try it more indepth... if I could find a cheaper source! The stuff isn't cheap! Any ideas there?

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Chemo Senior member

Chemo

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Yeah drizz a pack from the pharmacy certainly is steep, but same can be said for fat burners that don't actually do a lot in comparison.

I tried some 4mg stuff, just used pre gym and it was a nice buzz, if even just for some focus and something to chew.

Yeah T nation, did a great article on it, the guy really pushed the dose and gave honest feed back. I'll try hunt that down and post again.

Will PM you about ways to get it cheap though if your looking to trial it some more. Kind of an exploit so wont make it public.

Nate, I'm pretty sure tobacco still some nasty shit in there. >:C

Making the nicotine even more addictive, so I wouldn't recommend it to someone who wanted to trial the effects of nicotine lols.

Your call though if you really like the stuff haha.

Best bet would be gum, lozenges or patches.

A note about what was said about addiction, I don't get the addiction at all, and I often forgot to take it after a week! There certainly inst any irresistible need to take it in my experience.

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Daz69 Senior member

Daz69

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A note about what was said about addiction, I don't get the addiction at all, and I often forgot to take it after a week! There certainly inst any irresistible need to take it in my experience.

Its my belief that nicotine only becomes addictive when combined with a MAOI found in tobacco smoke....

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Chemo Senior member

Chemo

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":1adaz6zg]wtf the gum is cheap as..you just go on quit-line website and fill in a form and they send you out a prescription card in the mail that you take into a pharmacy. its subsidised...you get something like $300 worth of gum for $3

Subtle lol, that's the exploit I didn't want to make public.

Quitline would be pissed if they knew we were using it to get ripped as kents for RnV and all that jazz...

But yeah a ton of gum for $3 \:D/

...

Thanks Azide

Tii:

There's no studies suggesting further results from using more than 3g of DAA, because they only did tests at 3g a day.

You could probably get more results from double dosing. WHere it becomes optimal...no idea man.

Read up on how it increases aromatase activity though ay

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tii Member

tii

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"

Tii:

There's no studies suggesting further results from using more than 3g of DAA, because they only did tests at 3g a day.

You could probably get more results from double dosing. WHere it becomes optimal...no idea man.

Read up on how it increases aromatase activity though ay

Yeah a friend of mine who takes it sometimes gets itchy nips, which could be worrying. Anyway I read something about taking B vitamins to combat the prolactin. B6 and B12 I think.

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tomsammce Veteran member

tomsammce

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It's not that great boys, calm down lol.

Tastes like shit, I wouldn't bother or feel like I'm missing out.

It's like a couple years ago when lotsa ppl were buying glycerine from the pharmacy and taking it with redbull pre workout.

Fads come and go, lotsa things look good on paper.. In reality it nothing but hype and a perhaps a minute benefit

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drizzt Veteran member

drizzt

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Here's the T-Nation article I referred to up above, good read:

http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/50_hits_of_nicotine

I've got myself a nice little supply of 2mg gum, so will be experimenting with chucking a piece in before a workout, and maybe another piece in later in the day. I have a coffee before I workout (at least one :shifty:) so the caffeine in that should make for an interesting little stack.

Also working out twice a day most days, so maybe 1x piece for each pre workout on these days.

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Kalidane Senior member

Kalidane

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It's not that great boys, calm down lol.

Tastes like shit, I wouldn't bother or feel like I'm missing out.

It's like a couple years ago when lotsa ppl were buying glycerine from the pharmacy and taking it with redbull pre workout.

Fads come and go, lotsa things look good on paper.. In reality it nothing but hype and a perhaps a minute benefit

I'm thinking this ^^

Better results from going to bed an hour earlier.

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Kalidane Senior member

Kalidane

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Better results from going to bed an hour earlier.

lolwut?

its just another stim bro, like caffiene or a PWO not saying its overly great but its useful.

Okay yeah to be fair my comment is more directed at the noobs who lurk and are looking for the next magical compound because ground unicorn horn didn't make them look like Arnie - if you're doing everything else right them yeah sure why not.

I'm just a bit burned out on supplements and other bullshit that distracts from actually eating, training and resting.

inb4 PMSing much :pfft:

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Ronin Senior member

Ronin

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its just another stim bro, like caffiene or a PWO not saying its overly great but its useful.

:nod: No harm in trying it out, especially for the cost it can be had at.

Well, hopefully no harm :pfft:

^^^ this.

Got some to give it a shot, 4mg gum. Just hoping as a reformed smoker that I don't re-awaken that particular demon :pfft:

Anyone know whether lozenges or patches are any better/worse?

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Kalidane Senior member

Kalidane

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its just another stim bro, like caffiene or a PWO not saying its overly great but its useful.

:nod: No harm in trying it out, especially for the cost it can be had at.

Well, hopefully no harm :pfft:

^^^ this.

Got some to give it a shot, 4mg gum. Just hoping as a reformed smoker that I don't re-awaken that particular demon :pfft:

Anyone know whether lozenges or patches are any better/worse?

In a bizarre twist my sister just gave me 6 boxes of 1mg lozenges and a pack of 7mg patches.

I guess I'm in on this after all :lol:

4mg gum is the strong stuff from what I've seen. Might consider 1/2 servings of that; initially at least.

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