HOG Posted November 26, 2006 Report Share Posted November 26, 2006 The ‘Must Have’ Supplement?If you are a novice, adding a protein supplement to your diet is likely to illicit a greater boost to your training and physique than any other supplement. Within 1 to 2 weeks you should be sporting fuller, harder muscles that are stronger in the gym. But you can get the same result using whole foods like meat, chicken, eggs and fish.Protein supplements make it easier to develop an incredible figure or physique – but they are not a necessity. All else being equal, you will make exactly the same progress eating beef, chicken, fish or eggs as you might using a supplement. The question is whether you can (and will) consistently eat beef, chicken, fish and eggs several times per day?The only time protein supplements approach ‘must have’ status is in advanced bodybuilders. If your diet dictates that you require 500g of protein per day then you are going to struggle getting that from whole foods. Even if you did have the stomach capacity and time to eat 2.5kg of meat per day, your body could not efficiently digest it. Protein supplements can reduce this limitation and come with less unwanted fat calories. Diet Comes FirstIdeally, before you indiscriminately throw your money at the latest hi-tech protein you should have a dietary plan in place. Work out where and why you need a supplement and then find the supplement to fit. You will save money and realize far better progress.If you cannot be bothered with the hassle and complexities of a bodybuilding diet then simply adding protein shakes between your normal meals can give you an incredible boost. Just find yourself a reasonable, good value protein and don’t worry about the stuff with the latest NASA patented technology – you will get nothing extra from it.Value vs QualityThe quality of protein powder that is best for you will depend on your goals, dietary plan, training level and budget.If you are a novice looking to put on raw mass, you do not need be overly concerned with the quality of protein powder – you just want as much protein as possible for your money.As you become more advanced, higher quality products become more important. Advanced trainers need to eat, digest and absorb high quantities of nutrients and whole foods often cannot practically meet these needs. High quality protein powders tend to be more completely and readily absorbed than lesser quality protein sources.How to Find a Good Protein PowderProtein powders range from a single, raw protein source to a complex blend of proteins with additional micronutrients.If you are an advanced bodybuilder, single proteins are the best products to choose. Single ingredients allow more control. If you need a variety of proteins or added Glutamine, digestive enzymes or HCA, buy them individually and mix the ratios you need. For novices and intermediates, protein powder blends provide access to some high quality ingredients at a far lower cost than buying a pantry full of individual ingredients. Reading the Nutritional InformationIn terms of the Nutritional Profile, always look at the quantities in the ‘Per 100g’ column. Since it is protein that you are paying for then the percentage of protein is the relevant figure. Anything between 75-90% (75-90g per 100g) is good. The ‘Amount Per Serving’ columns can be deceptive and are usually incomparable. It is easy to claim “more protein per serving” by making the serving size bigger. Your dietary plan should determine your serving size based on the amount of protein, carbs and fat you need from the product. When analyzing any product label make sure to give as much attention to the ingredient listing as the Nutritional Profile. Ingredients must be listed in order of the quantities included. Very often the front of a product label will highlight ultra-high quality ingredients but the ingredient listing will show that most of the product is something far cheaper and less impressive.Look out for labels that ‘hide’ high quantities of a single ingredient by listing them as several different ingredients of lower potencies. For example, ‘sugar’ can be listed as 4 separate ingredients: sugar, sucrose, honey and natural sweetener.Another ingredient listing trick to look out for is the ‘proprietary blend’. If the most plentiful single ingredient in a product was sugar, for example, the manufacturer could hide the fact by listing all of the protein sources as a single ‘proprietary protein blend’ even though none of the individual proteins was particularly potent.Don’t Get DupedBe skeptical of anything affordable claiming above 90% protein. It costs about 10% more for each percentage point potency increase above about 85%! Use both the Nutritional Profile and ingredient listing to find inconsistencies. For instance, cocoa is often used to provide chocolate taste. Cocoa is high in sugars and fats. If the chocolate and vanilla flavors of a product have the same nutritional profile then the manufacturer has averaged them out or tested a flavorless sample. Either way, you can almost guarantee that the chocolate flavors has more fat and carbs than the label lets on!Look out for brands claiming quality ingredients at markedly lower prices – especially if they are well advertised. Most brands buy from the same manufacturers at the same prices. If their expenses are the same then its just not possible to be markedly cheaper in such a competitive industry.The ProteinsProtein Powders are a dried protein extraction from a whole food. Despite the wide variety of names and scientific jargon, virtually all protein powders come either from milk, eggs, soy or wheat. Biological ValueThe Biological Value of a protein source is a bodybuilders most useful measure of protein quality. In simple terms, BV compares the degree of nitrogen retention (assumed anabolism) between protein sources. BV considers the digestibility, absorbability, completeness of the amino acid spectrum and the ratio of amino acids. Many armchair academics are quick to criticize the usefulness of BV’s primarily because combining proteins can significantly change the BV. Some people don’t like that BV’s are measured on an empty stomach either – other foods will upset the BV. BV scores above 100 cannot be accurately established and can be manipulated easily. Outrageous claims of 157 BV Wheys put BV’s in doubt.Generally, bodybuilders aren’t concerned with mixing low quality, incomplete proteins. We want big quantities of the best quality we can get so BV is still our best measureWheat ProteinWheat protein is a cheap, highly allergenic, low BV (54) protein. It is hard to digest, hard to absorb and contains an incomplete array of amino acids. However, Wheat protein does happen to contain a very high concentration – over 50% in fact – of Glutamine peptides. Glutamine is the most abundant amino acid in our muscles and high doses (20g to over 100g daily) accelerate muscle growth and reduce catabolism. Wheat protein should be treated as a Glutamine supplement but not as a stand alone protein source. Soy ProteinIn their raw form, soya beans are famous for being a high quality protein source. And they are… at least by vegetarian standards. For bodybuilding purposes however, soy protein is not a great choice. It has a BV of only 74 and lacks the sulphur containing essential amino acid Methionine – an important (critical?) factor in a proteins contribution to immune function and muscle growth.In men, Soys’ phyto-estrogens can significantly reduce testosterone output, retard fat burning and in high quantities cause breast tissue growth. Soy also contains factors that block the protease enzymes (specifically a trypsin and chymotrypsin) that assist the digestion and absorption of protein from the gastrointestinal tract. Lectins in soy block the absorption of other nutrients too.Soy has definite health benefits but for those of you wanting a well-above-average body, minimize your intake of all forms of soy.Egg ProteinEgg protein powder (often called albumin) is a relatively inexpensive protein extracted from egg white. Egg white has a good BV of 88 (whole eggs’ BV is 100). Egg protein is digested slower than whey but faster than casein which makes it great in blends.Egg white protein is relatively tasteless and can be easily added to most anything. With no lactose, fat or allergenic protein fractions to be concerned about, everyone should feel confident with egg protein. Milk ProteinsMilk contains two proteins: Casein (80%) and Whey (20%) for a combined BV of 91. The problem with milk is its natural sugar ‘lactose’ that many people find difficult to digest. Common symptoms of lactose intolerance include flatulence, abdominal cramping and diarrhea. Taking the digestive enzyme lactase can help reduce or eliminate these problems for many people.CaseinCasein (ie calcium caseinate and micellar casein) is a relatively inexpensive protein with an average BV of 77. It is a complete protein that is difficult and slow to digest. Surprisingly, this is its most desirable benefit. The slow digestion ensures a steady leak of protein into the blood that peaks 3-4 hours after ingestion and lasts as long as 8 hours. As a result, studies have found Casein to be highly anti-catabolic – it slows muscle breakdown. Casein will slow the digestion of any other proteins eaten and can leave you feeling very bloated.Whey ProteinWhey is deservedly the most popular protein on the market. It is the highest quality protein available with an indeterminate BV, significantly greater than 100. HOG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterTel Posted November 26, 2006 Report Share Posted November 26, 2006 Excellent post, HOG!! The only time protein supplements approach ‘must have’ status is in advanced bodybuilders. If your diet dictates that you require 500g of protein per day then you are going to struggle getting that from whole foods. Even if you did have the stomach capacity and time to eat 2.5kg of meat per day, your body could not efficiently digest it.I like this comment - getting 500g of protein a day from purely whole food would indeed be really tough on the digestive system to handle - plus the teeth and jaw from chewing that much steak!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted November 26, 2006 Report Share Posted November 26, 2006 Correct me if I’m wrong here but you can only digest so much steak at a time (around 200-250gm) and anything above this sits in the stomach and basically rots …this may explain the really smelly farts the morning after having that 500gm steak :pfft: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pseudonym Posted November 27, 2006 Report Share Posted November 27, 2006 Great article! Can you give us a link to the original, please? Credit where credit's due, after all... Or did you write it yourself? If so, extra kudos to you! :grin: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deegee Posted November 27, 2006 Report Share Posted November 27, 2006 Good read, and helpful too, be interested to see the rankings of some localy available protein powders.Cost is always a major factor for me, no doubt I would choose another brand than my current one however my current choice is economicaly selected, as much as on quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOG Posted November 27, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 27, 2006 Protein powdersAmerican labeling only needs to be 65% correctCanadian products need to be 85% correctThat’s why I only use MAX’S protein from Australia.Australian law requires their labeling to be 95% That’s a huge differenceSo what’s the other 35% that’s not label in the American protein powders????HOG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deegee Posted November 27, 2006 Report Share Posted November 27, 2006 I have heard so much good feedback on their protein (Max's) that I will have to try it even though the price is out my range for full time use, unless it is available cheaper than I have seen it so far advertised! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted November 27, 2006 Report Share Posted November 27, 2006 There is little difference between the new Balance range and Max's price wise. In fact if you shop around you'll find our 3kg Daytime protein is priced the same as the Balance Isolate. We are cheaper than the equivalent Horleys products.And judging by the feedback, you'll find our products are of a quality that can't be matched by most manufacturers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash Posted November 27, 2006 Report Share Posted November 27, 2006 Protein powdersAmerican labeling only needs to be 65% correctCanadian products need to be 85% correctThat’s why I only use MAX’S protein from Australia.Australian law requires their labeling to be 95% That’s a huge differenceSo what’s the other 35% that’s not label in the American protein powders????HOG.Hang on - so you're saying that an American product that has 80% protein according to the label may actually only contain 65% of that amount??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flex Posted November 28, 2006 Report Share Posted November 28, 2006 I don't doubt that there is some variance allowable in labelling, however I am a little sceptical that it could be +/-35%Do you have any evidence to support that as I would be interested in finding out more if you did? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2guns Posted November 28, 2006 Report Share Posted November 28, 2006 maybe i better stop buying the elite powder lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
da_yellow_fellow Posted November 28, 2006 Report Share Posted November 28, 2006 And judging by the feedback, you'll find our products are of a quality that can't be matched by most manufacturers. Yea the Max's range will definetly contain quality protein, I tried the daytime protein a few months ago and I found that it increased my recovery time by quite a bit compared to the other stuff I have taken. :nod: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geneticgod Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 looks like ima have to stop going american too! n ditch my elite :cry: it tastes sooo good! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2guns Posted December 2, 2006 Report Share Posted December 2, 2006 n ditch my elite it tastes sooo good! i was just joking aye,yeah tastes good and a really good price Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khala Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Hi EveryoneAnother important thing when choosing protein powders for us girls that compete, is to make sure that they have low glycemic levels. This definately helps during our dieting phase as it stops the sugar cravings that we sometimes get. If we have this under control it makes the whole journey that much easier. I have found LA Muscle's to be the best so far and definately noticed the difference when using others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Surely then when referring to a 'Protein Powder' that is predominantly protein, such as LA Muscle's, the fact there are little to no carbs involved means the glycaemic rating is non-existant? Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Glycaemic rating refers to carbohydrates, not protein? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flex Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 "The glycemic index is a scale that measures the rate at which the body converts various carbohydrate foods into blood glucose. The higher the glycemic index, the faster the food is converted to glucose and the larger the insulin response"Whey contains very small amounts of carbs however its effect on blood sugar would be negligible. Unless you are using a powder with added carbs you don't need to worry about the GI when it comes to whey protein. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pittbull Posted December 4, 2006 Report Share Posted December 4, 2006 Surely then when referring to a 'Protein Powder' that is predominantly protein, such as LA Muscle's, the fact there are little to no carbs involved means the glycaemic rating is non-existant? Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Glycaemic rating refers to carbohydrates, not protein?Ok!Yes you're totally wrong, you're so way off base on that! Damn how could you be sooooo Wrong!lmfao, just messing with ya waldo, you're correct. I think it may have just been a shameless plug for that particular brand :pfft: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khala Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 Just to put you right, its not a shameless plug for LA Muscle actually and I bet if you asked alot of girls that compete we would all say the same thing. Lay off the sweet powders and bingo, all those cravings go as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PT Posted December 5, 2006 Report Share Posted December 5, 2006 Yep I'm going to have to agree with khala on this one...I consistantly use LA Whey on & off season. In between Regionals & Nats this year I changed over to a MAX brand and even tho it tasted yum my sugar cravings sky rocketed!So taking on advice from my nutritionalist I went back to LA Whey and my sugar cravings stopped. Because a lot of these companies add those "fake sugars" into their protein to make it taste nice it does screw with our sugar levels...LA Whey definatley doesn't taste all yummy and sweet like alot of other brands but just from personal experience it sure helps with those cravings! I've always been told...if it tastes really really good it usually has lots and lots of sugar added (fake or otherwise) and that usually goes for most things not just protein powder!train hard! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted December 6, 2006 Report Share Posted December 6, 2006 So you would be referring to the sweeteners used in the powders then, not the carb content. I can categorically state that Max's don't include any 'fake sugars' in their powders. Sweeteners can cause an insulin response, but a minimal one. Our powders are also tested regularly to ensure they comply and meet Australian Good Manufacturing standards, as well as Sports Supplement Industry Group standards.I know of a number of females who used our powders coming into comps this year and they had absolutely nothing but thumbs up to give on the products. I think this might be a case of different strokes for different folks. Nice to see you two found powders that work for you...I like it when things fall into place nicely! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loser Posted December 12, 2006 Report Share Posted December 12, 2006 i dont like max's for two reasons:one, they release too many damned versions of the same thing. ok so most companies have their own special nightime powder which is just the same stuff with calcium caseinate (rubbish). but maxs just went over the top. i heard they are going to release a pre-competition version of the protein with added psylium husks to get u shredded.two, they actually made a powder with added hca in it and marketed it for the cutting phase, like a little hca is going to do crapbut apart from that, from what ppl have said on this thread it seems pretty reasonable, but i would recommend getting some of your protein from soy as well because its got things in it that can extend your lifeto anyone who absolutely has to have the very best protein available in new zealand i will give it to you straight its metaphysics meta pro they use the best filtering but its xpensive and probably not worth it cuz you could just take twice as much wpc or ie wpi for the same price so u would get more protein anyway... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waldo Posted December 12, 2006 Report Share Posted December 12, 2006 Right of reply:-Our Nite-Time formula uses predominantly Micellar Casein as it's main form of protein. It also includes Whey Isolate, Concentrate, and Calcium Caseinate. -Your prediction of a pre-comp powder with psyllium husks is probably more a piss-take than truth.-Hydroxy Phase is a popular product for a simple fact...it works well. I know of a number of competeing Bodybuilders that specifically used HP+ as their powder of coice leading into comp. -Our powders are all different and tailor-made to suit certain times of the day.Max's also support bodybuilding at all levels in NZ as well as Australia. I would hate to think what the total sponsorship bill for both countries would amount to. We sponsored a good number of shows in NZ this year, 5 NZFBB and 2 NABBA, as well as supporting more than a handful of athletes with their preparation. So we put money into the sport too because it's what we are passionate about.Lastly, you mentioned to get some protein from soy. I rest my case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flex Posted December 12, 2006 Report Share Posted December 12, 2006 Soy protein - extend your life? classic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loser Posted December 13, 2006 Report Share Posted December 13, 2006 -Our powders are all different and tailor-made to suit certain times of the day.So when im taking my morning sh*t which powder should i be using?SPI is a great addition to your favourite powder. dont tell me its not just because you dont sell it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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