Cardio and First Cycle Gear.

[Stanley]

Talked to a couple guys I know who have run cycles. One is built like a body builder, the other more slim "lean/mean" build.

Both have said a cycle of Prop would be a good idea, due to less water/bloat and that I could get away with running it at 2 x 1 ML a week over 12/14 week cycle for my first time, or even 8/10 (2 10 ML vial).

They said that being late 20s would not have to worry about anything else to run with it, get good BCAA etc etc and that with 2 x 1ML a week no Gyno etc wouldn't be a worry. To inject they said just do it on either side of your ass cheek in different areas, don't worry so much about isolation of muscle areas as it is not for bodybuilding, but cardio focus - what are some thoughts about this? I have read on various forums people do legs/quads etc but are more aimed for mass gains and running it with others, so would I get away with this as stated? Just want a few more opinions on the matter, both are reliable sources and done well training/bodybuilding wise.

Keep in mind this is for cardio/crossfit exercises, not going to be a bodybuilder - appreciate the comments about the cycle/duration and safety of running of Prop alone. I am aware that cycle amount isn't that much 2 x 1ML a week, but I was told I would see some improvements and due to it being low Prop alone would be safe to run.

Cheers,

Stan.

[Stanley]

Bump.

[Android]

Bump.

We've got a steroid-munching cross-fitter on this site somewhere, maybe Toms-sauce can help you :wink: help a bro out Tommy

[Pseudonym]

Come on Android. I'm sure you could give some quality advice if you choose to. That's why you're wearing that pretty badge!

Stanley, I'm no expert on steroids OR crossfit, but FWIW, here are my thoughts...

- Injection spots. I think there's a bit more to it than "pick a butt cheek and jab". There are certain spots on the buttock that you aim for.

- Rotating sites. Pinning in quads and other muscles is less about making that muscle grow (that's a dubious theory anyway) and more about giving your butt a chance to recover.

- Low dose = no gyno? Um, possibly. But I think that would still vary from person to person. Probably best to have a SERM/AI/whatever on hand just in case.

What are you hoping to achieve from this cycle anyway? I'm not sure testosterone will help with your cardio fitness if that's the goal.

As I say, I'm no expert, but hopefully this will at least stimulate discussion.

[denzil]

Keep in mind this is for cardio/crossfit exercises, not going to be a bodybuilder -

enough said, just stick to supps then bro, a solid diet moderate carbs high protien a test booster and pre workout if u must.

[tomsammce]

Bump.

We've got a steroid-munching cross-fitter on this site somewhere, maybe Toms-sauce can help you :wink: help a bro out Tommy

steroids were originally designed to increase performance in sports. Not for bodybuilders.

So I don't see what your problem with me using them is for my goals when it's really what they were designed for not for looking like a douchebag in yr yellow singlet posing ur back in the mirror or on stage in whatever gay coloured trunks you choose.

Anyway back to topic. Bodybuilders use the highest dosages of steroids out of any type of steroid users to get the benefits from it that they need/want.

In sports and where the cardiovascular system, lactic acid build up and a number of other things I can go into if you like? Come into play less is sometimes more. So if you are already training or competing at a good level in crossfit or any sport then the low dose of test prop would be great for u, enanthate or cypionate will be fine too. Lots of the guys use prop or suspension for the drug testing but other that ester weight and the halflife it makes no difference.

Hope that helps, if u want more info just say on what and I'll be more specific.

[tomsammce]

What worked best for me personally was

low dose test enanthate

low-moderate dose boldenone

moderate dose clenbuterol

that's a realy good cycle for your goals.

[musclenz]

What worked best for me personally was

low dose test enanthate

low-moderate dose boldenone

moderate dose clenbuterol

that's a realy good cycle for your goals.

Yes good plan for a strength training or speed athlete. Trouble is Eq takes a while to become effective & is residual for months afterward, so if testing in the sport is an issue its a no no. However, its great for increasing epo & red blood cell count & thus endurance & strength & collagen synthesis. Anavar is a tidy little steroid for strength mixed in with some Prop or Test Suspension. Performance athletes are best to avoid winstrol because of the effects it has on joints & ligaments.

[severe]

Talked to a couple guys I know who have run cycles. One is built like a body builder, the other more slim "lean/mean" build.

Both have said a cycle of Prop would be a good idea, due to less water/bloat and that I could get away with running it at 2 x 1 ML a week over 12/14 week cycle for my first time, or even 8/10 (2 10 ML vial).

I don't get bloat from enanthate. That would be a more stable cycle, blood level wise. Slow build up and slow decline. @250mg/ml, 2 1ml shots would be 500mls of test enanthate a week. It will be very noticeable after week 2-3. Even half of that would be suitable for your needs; recovery. Then you have enough for two 10 week cycles or a mother 20 week.

They said that being late 20s would not have to worry about anything else to run with it, get good BCAA etc etc and that with 2 x 1ML a week no Gyno etc wouldn't be a worry.

Bro-science regarding age, or maybe I misread it? You mean running PCT or other anabolics?

To inject they said just do it on either side of your ass cheek in different areas

That is a bit of piss-poor advice. There is a limited area to do it effectively and safely in that area (and with other areas). The quads are easier to manage in my opinion. No reach arounds. lol. Did they mention to aspirate before you push the oil in? http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?343692-How-To-Inject#.T6pH4b9mH-k

...don't worry so much about isolation of muscle areas as it is not for bodybuilding, but cardio focus - what are some thoughts about this?

Though compound movements are the golden rule, isolation have their place. For cardio? Bro-science. Cardio is for cardio.

I have read on various forums people do legs/quads etc but are more aimed for mass gains and running it with others, so would I get away with this as stated? Just want a few more opinions on the matter, both are reliable sources and done well training/bodybuilding wise.

I am unsure of what you are actually asking here Stanley. Running isolation with squats? Like leg extensions?

Keep in mind this is for cardio/crossfit exercises, not going to be a bodybuilder - appreciate the comments about the cycle/duration and safety of running of Prop alone. I am aware that cycle amount isn't that much 2 x 1ML a week, but I was told I would see some improvements and due to it being low Prop alone would be safe to run.

Cheers,

Stan.

You will get the recovery you need, for sure on what you intend, but I would say a slower releasing enanthate would be equally as sweet. I did crossfit for a while. I didn't get the improvements in cardio directly from gear, but I would wake up clean and ready for more due to better recovery. No more DOMS. And got vascular as hell. Lean bastard.

[crazyfacials]

but of a random question to op but why only 2x a week of prop? won't it be better to inject EOD?

[tomsammce]

Musclenz,

lots of drug tested champions over the years have tested positive for winstrol (stanozolol) obviously the joint issue wasn't a problem for the

... I and know of others who have taken winstrol at high dosages for longer periods of time than reccomended and not experienced joint pain...

Do u think it could be if you are predisposed to getting sore joints and also the type of training u are doing that contributes to the joint problems more so than the winstrol.

Personally I think it's like if your gonna loose your hair on a cycle it'll happen, same with winstrol and your joints. Iv never really bought into the myth or what ever you want to call it.

Thoughts?

[severe]

enough said, just stick to supps then bro, a solid diet moderate carbs high protien a test booster and pre workout if u must.

If cardio is the main focus, I would avoid pre-workout supps, as they give you the dries, hard. Hydration prior and bcaa's are sweet, but avoid stimulants. You don't have the luxury of sipping from your water bottle every set...

I even avoided creatine while crossfitting it as was way to thirsty, way too fast, and that went once I dropped the creatine. I found it to be horrible shit to boost CF.

[musclenz]

Musclenz,

lots of drug tested champions over the years have tested positive for winstrol (stanozolol) obviously the joint issue wasn't a problem for the

... I and know of others who have taken winstrol at high dosages for longer periods of time than reccomended and not experienced joint pain...

Do u think it could be if you are predisposed to getting sore joints and also the type of training u are doing that contributes to the joint problems more so than the winstrol.

Personally I think it's like if your gonna loose your hair on a cycle it'll happen, same with winstrol and your joints. Iv never really bought into the myth or what ever you want to call it.

Thoughts?

Yes Tom, like everything that is "prescribed" for cutting, bulking, endurance etc, there is a degree of individualism that has to be taken into account. How much you lift, how often, diet & body physiology blah blah. But from point of view with winny, it does seem to link strongly to connective tissue injuries especially in a pre comp dietary phase. However its possible its just one factor in the equation. I believe there has been some studies done over the years to link it into tendon & ligament damage but you never know how accurate these were & as you say it has been used by many strength training athletes. Whether any of these have been subject to injury, it would be interesting to know. Personally, I find that I cant run it for too long without experiencing joint dryness & I was running it when I recently damaged a bicep tendon at the proximal end. Coincidence? Its hard to say

[genetic freek]

Musclenz,

lots of drug tested champions over the years have tested positive for winstrol (stanozolol) obviously the joint issue wasn't a problem for the

... I and know of others who have taken winstrol at high dosages for longer periods of time than reccomended and not experienced joint pain...

Do u think it could be if you are predisposed to getting sore joints and also the type of training u are doing that contributes to the joint problems more so than the winstrol.

Personally I think it's like if your gonna loose your hair on a cycle it'll happen, same with winstrol and your joints. Iv never really bought into the myth or what ever you want to call it.

Thoughts?

Yes Tom, like everything that is "prescribed" for cutting, bulking, endurance etc, there is a degree of individualism that has to be taken into account. How much you lift, how often, diet & body physiology blah blah. But from point of view with winny, it does seem to link strongly to connective tissue injuries especially in a pre comp dietary phase. However its possible its just one factor in the equation. I believe there has been some studies done over the years to link it into tendon & ligament damage but you never know how accurate these were & as you say it has been used by many strength training athletes. Whether any of these have been subject to injury, it would be interesting to know. Personally, I find that I cant run it for too long without experiencing joint dryness & I was running it when I recently damaged a bicep tendon at the proximal end. Coincidence? Its hard to say

More association to age than the winny :grin:

[biggerthanyou2]

Musclenz,

lots of drug tested champions over the years have tested positive for winstrol (stanozolol) obviously the joint issue wasn't a problem for the

... I and know of others who have taken winstrol at high dosages for longer periods of time than reccomended and not experienced joint pain...

Do u think it could be if you are predisposed to getting sore joints and also the type of training u are doing that contributes to the joint problems more so than the winstrol.

Personally I think it's like if your gonna loose your hair on a cycle it'll happen, same with winstrol and your joints. Iv never really bought into the myth or what ever you want to call it.

Thoughts?

Yes Tom, like everything that is "prescribed" for cutting, bulking, endurance etc, there is a degree of individualism that has to be taken into account. How much you lift, how often, diet & body physiology blah blah. But from point of view with winny, it does seem to link strongly to connective tissue injuries especially in a pre comp dietary phase. However its possible its just one factor in the equation. I believe there has been some studies done over the years to link it into tendon & ligament damage but you never know how accurate these were & as you say it has been used by many strength training athletes. Whether any of these have been subject to injury, it would be interesting to know. Personally, I find that I cant run it for too long without experiencing joint dryness & I was running it when I recently damaged a bicep tendon at the proximal end. Coincidence? Its hard to say

Links?

[severe]

Stanley? You died or something? Shit, broscience got you.

[Stanley]

Stanley? You died or something? Shit, broscience got you.

Haha no, just been doing lots of reading and gathering information. A wise man does not make haste.

I really appreciate the information here, but I am not aiming for body building. I would like to take one cycle of "gear" and see the results. After talking to body builders and other various sportsmen, they all said its good to try different gear out over time and make your own mind up.

I have heard good things about Deca in a 4 week cycle for my goals, 2 ML a week for two weeks, then 3 ML a week for the last 2 weeks = 10 ML Vial. I have read/heard you hold water, but after you get the results its better to hold the water and Deca helps with injuries and pain alot better.

My question for anyone whom has done Deca, along with some good L-Glut, Protein, BCAA's, is it vital to take a Test booster from say the supplement store along with it? Keeping in mind, shagging girls is not the goal throughout the 8 weeks of training hard. Another note on that is, would you get any bad side effects.

Cheers for the answers guys, have been doing lots of reading, but still like to ask more opinions here and thanks for the messages in my inbox, appreciate the assistance.

Stanley.

[Diab0lic]

Where did you hear a 4 week cycle of deca only is a good idea?

[Stanley]

Where did you hear a 4 week cycle of deca only is a good idea?

Various people because my goals are not that of a body builders?

[severe]

4 weeks of Deca? I have never heard that, and plenty of gossips in this place.

I have never heard anyone say that is worthwhile, or even mention 4 weeks in the same sentence as Deca. Or anything for that matter except Dianabol.

Seriously, a 10ml vial or testosterone enanthate would be all you need. I did CF. I have done it on 500mg/wk, but found the best was when I was running 375mg/wk average. Just one pin. 1.5mls.

Recovery was king.

You get a good shape and each day is fresh (after the 2-3 week).

Like I said earlier, the cardio wasn't an overnight success, but waking up with no muscle pain was great. Regardless of how punished I was the night before.

[denzil]

Where did you hear a 4 week cycle of deca only is a good idea?

Various people because my goals are not that of a body builders?

but srs decca 4 weeks ? ? wtff lol whos been filling your head with this bogus info..

[Stanley]

4 weeks of Deca? I have never heard that, and plenty of gossips in this place.

I have never heard anyone say that is worthwhile, or even mention 4 weeks in the same sentence as Deca. Or anything for that matter except Dianabol.

Seriously, a 10ml vial or testosterone enanthate would be all you need. I did CF. I have done it on 500mg/wk, but found the best was when I was running 375mg/wk average. Just one pin. 1.5mls.

Recovery was king.

You get a good shape and each day is fresh (after the 2-3 week).

Like I said earlier, the cardio wasn't an overnight success, but waking up with no muscle pain was great. Regardless of how punished I was the night before.

Thanks, how long did you run the cycle for?

[Diab0lic]

Where did you hear a 4 week cycle of deca only is a good idea?

Various people because my goals are not that of a body builders?

They were all wrong lol

[Daz69]

4 weeks of Deca? I have never heard that, and plenty of gossips in this place.

I have never heard anyone say that is worthwhile, or even mention 4 weeks in the same sentence as Deca. Or anything for that matter except Dianabol.

Seriously, a 10ml vial or testosterone enanthate would be all you need. I did CF. I have done it on 500mg/wk, but found the best was when I was running 375mg/wk average. Just one pin. 1.5mls.

Recovery was king.

You get a good shape and each day is fresh (after the 2-3 week).

Like I said earlier, the cardio wasn't an overnight success, but waking up with no muscle pain was great. Regardless of how punished I was the night before.

Pin 500mg/week and your only getting about 360mg of actual test when you subtract the weight of the ester.....

[Daz69]

Where did you hear a 4 week cycle of deca only is a good idea?

Various people because my goals are not that of a body builders?

My goals are not that of a body builder either but I wouldn't pin just Nandrolone on its own without Testosterone as a base.... 19-nors are progestins and will shut down the body's own natural testosterone production quite harshly even with relatively small doses....

Your mates know jack-shit.....

Plus Nandrolone Decanoate is (naturally) on the Decanoate ester which is slower releasing than most, (about 7.5 days half-life) so 4 weeks isn't really gonna cut the mustard....