Standard of NZL Amatuer Bodybuilding

[nate225]

For simplicity's sake I'm going to confine this discussion to men physique.

I have in previous years stated that I thought the standard of mens physiques had gone downhill in recent times in NZL bodybuilding.

From a historical POV I grew up, trained alongside or watched on NZL stages guys like Kevin O'Grady, Joe Ulberg, Hugh Willis, Dave Smith, Paul Wood, Dave Wong, Justin Rys, Mike Debenham, Garry Jones, Mike Allsop-Smith, Steve Lynch, BJ Johns etc etc

In previous years I often felt that shows (across the federations) probably didn't have athletes of this calibre, or more so the depth of talent that we used to have.

My opinion may have changed after seeing some of this years competitors. Some of the names that are in the amatuer ranks and making an impression on me are guys like Mark Anderson, Supry Sos, Joe Ulberg (again!), Hamish Coulter, Mark Reed, Garth Van der Merve (sp), Nate O'Hearn, Khalid Slaimankhel (sp), Phil Kuklinski, Steve Orton, Andrew (dunno ya last name buddy!), as well as up & comers like Aaron Vaisigano.

I definately missed a few off both lists (apologies in advance!), but just wanted to put it out there - IS IT JUST ME OR IS THE STANDARD IN NZL AMATUER BODYBUILDING GETTING BETTER AGAIN?

Thoughts?

Nate

[gdl]

dont wanna open a can of worms here but one such factor would be the ceasing of drug testing in the NZ(I)FBB

Thats said a) its likely to be a small factor and b) that sure is a impressive list of BIG boys :nod:

[HarryB]

dont wanna open a can of worms here but one such factor would be the ceasing of drug testing in the NZ(I)FBB

Thats said a) its likely to be a small factor and b) that sure is a impressive list of BIG boys :nod:

I think the dropping of drug testing is one factor, a bit of spreading around of knowledge is another factor and also a BIG factor is a lifting of what people believe they can achieve!!! Not so much settling for being the best in a small pond but really striving to be competitive anywhere. Change of mindset.

[Android]

I was going to say the same as Harry.

The past greats Nate mentioned are all contributing to the knowledge of the new generation. You no longer have to try, fail, try again to find a way to grow or prepare for a contest. People sharing knowledge.

I am sure next year the BB scene is going to be even bigger in terms of size and conditioning, it's gaining momentum and there are some awesome young physiques.

[nate225]

I was going to say the same as Harry.

The past greats Nate mentioned are all contributing to the knowledge of the new generation. You no longer have to try, fail, try again to find a way to grow or prepare for a contest. People sharing knowledge.

I am sure next year the BB scene is going to be even bigger in terms of size and conditioning, it's gaining momentum and there are some awesome young physiques.

And a few older ones... :grin:

[Shutupandsquat]

I had a feeling that this thread was going to head in this direction. It's DEFINITELY picking up. Just look over these past few weeks. Mass monsters bringing great condition, and some guys who aren't mass monsters bringing AMAZING condition. It's actually really good to see our bodybuilding scene pick up

[Riccardo]

Lol I saw this and thought you were going to say Bodybuilding was getting worse, However I totally agree with you, having watched the Waikato show in the weekend I gotta say that there were a lot of awesome physiques there, the competition for the overall was amazing, a good mixture of Size and conditioning, One young guy I saw Andy Priestley looked really good and young Josh Milne will be one to watch for the future, awesome physique having just turned 18.

Looking at the NABBA/WFF pics the standard looks to be outstanding. Definitely a lot of wicked athletes around atm

[nate225]

I had a feeling that this thread was going to head in this direction. It's DEFINITELY picking up. Just look over these past few weeks. Mass monsters bringing great condition, and some guys who aren't mass monsters bringing AMAZING condition. It's actually really good to see our bodybuilding scene pick up

Good call - positive for all alright, except if you're vying for a title! :grin:

[HarryB]

I had a feeling that this thread was going to head in this direction. It's DEFINITELY picking up. Just look over these past few weeks. Mass monsters bringing great condition, and some guys who aren't mass monsters bringing AMAZING condition. It's actually really good to see our bodybuilding scene pick up

Good call - positive for all alright, except if you're vying for a title! :grin:

Who wants to win against chumps? The better the standard the better the win! Or placing, or not... lol

[Shutupandsquat]

I had a feeling that this thread was going to head in this direction. It's DEFINITELY picking up. Just look over these past few weeks. Mass monsters bringing great condition, and some guys who aren't mass monsters bringing AMAZING condition. It's actually really good to see our bodybuilding scene pick up

Good call - positive for all alright, except if you're vying for a title! :grin:

I'm vying for the overall title! But I won't be a contender for that for a few years. I don't rank with these guys so not vying for the title you were meaning haha.

And I completely agree with Harry

[cezare]

Like Nate, I too have been involved in and closely followed bodybuilding over the past two decades and would agree there had been a decline not just in the quality but also the quantity of competitors.

When I got into bodybuilding in the late 80’s early 90’s I guess I was lucky in some ways because the health and fitness industry was going crazy. Every man and his dog wanted to be in shape, muscles were cool, action movies with Arnold and Stallone were top of the box office and chicks dug guys with physiques. Less people are into being in shape (or cant be bothered) big muscles aren’t really as popular (I blame the ridiculously unattainable pro physiques of today and the negative bullshit surrounding gear) and the fact that the majority (1 in 3 (NZ obesity rate of NZ)) are fat arses who would rather criticise from their couches than actually do anything.

So it is really pleasing to see that lately show numbers are up and there are definitely some awesome physiques around for sure.

I would love to see bodybuilding make a comeback as it is the greatest sport but I’m preaching to the converted right.

[genetic freek]

I was thinking the same the other day Nate. But was thinking in chch its not as good as it used to be. Back ten years ago in my gym there were some serious freaks. Matt A, Mike D, Ed, Jason Brown, Darrel, DS etc. All of those guys if you saw on the st you would go WTF is that! You don't see that down here anymore...

[nate225]

I was thinking the same the other day Nate. But was thinking in chch its not as good as it used to be. Back ten years ago in my gym there were some serious freaks. Matt A, Mike D, Ed, Jason Brown, Darrel, DS etc. All of those guys if you saw on the st you would go WTF is that! You don't see that down here anymore...

Chch certainly had a scene back then, but it will happen again, cyclic me thinks. That and the fact you weigh 20kg more now & have seen a lot more since the mid / late 90's means it probably takes more to impress you?

Caught up with Darren Farrow in Akld last week - looking big as ever - and talked of a "rematch" in 2012 as he is competing again! Looking forward to it, but damn he'll be hard to beat and is definately a name to add to the list of top BBers presently.

[genetic freek]

I was thinking the same the other day Nate. But was thinking in chch its not as good as it used to be. Back ten years ago in my gym there were some serious freaks. Matt A, Mike D, Ed, Jason Brown, Darrel, DS etc. All of those guys if you saw on the st you would go WTF is that! You don't see that down here anymore...

Chch certainly had a scene back then, but it will happen again, cyclic me thinks. That and the fact you weigh 20kg more now & have seen a lot more since the mid / late 90's means it probably takes more to impress you?

Caught up with Darren Farrow in Akld last week - looking big as ever - and talked of a "rematch" in 2012 as he is competing again! Looking forward to it, but damn he'll be hard to beat and is definately a name to add to the list of top BBers presently.

Oh Did ya! Yep he has some serious lean mass, makes the most of what he can too. If he comes in dry you won't touch the sides lol

[nate225]

I was thinking the same the other day Nate. But was thinking in chch its not as good as it used to be. Back ten years ago in my gym there were some serious freaks. Matt A, Mike D, Ed, Jason Brown, Darrel, DS etc. All of those guys if you saw on the st you would go WTF is that! You don't see that down here anymore...

Chch certainly had a scene back then, but it will happen again, cyclic me thinks. That and the fact you weigh 20kg more now & have seen a lot more since the mid / late 90's means it probably takes more to impress you?

Caught up with Darren Farrow in Akld last week - looking big as ever - and talked of a "rematch" in 2012 as he is competing again! Looking forward to it, but damn he'll be hard to beat and is definately a name to add to the list of top BBers presently.

Oh Did ya! Yep he has some serious lean mass, makes the most of what he can too. If he comes in dry you won't touch the sides lol

LOL - although I haven't got any decent comparison pix or video to remind me I don't think it was size that beat me last time - it was his conditioning and those crazy striated glutes! Seriously who brings those in a novice comp! :pfft: :grin:

But you're right he has got some serious mass nowdays.

You joining us on stage in 2012 GF?

[cezare]

Darren is definitely a quality competitor, I trained with Darren back in the early 90’s at World Gym in Palmy and he is a very intelligent and dedicated trainer. He has sure done his time in the gym and deserves his results.

[nate225]

Darren is definitely a quality competitor, I trained with Darren back in the early 90’s at World Gym in Palmy and he is a very intelligent and dedicated trainer. He has sure done his time in the gym and deserves his results.

LOL - we may have crossed paths then as I also trained in Palmy, not so much at worlds but in the same gym as Darren for a few years (cant remember gym name but was in Tainui st?).

[cezare]

New Body gym yeah had a few sessions there. Small world.

[Optimass]

IMO lifting the testing has been a fundamental part of the change - thats not to say there are not any good naturals out there - but there are parallels to the PLing debate in that there are a good protion of people who really dont give a shit if you're jacked or not - just want to see good numbers of qualified athletes in one show.

Another contributing factor has to be the split n factions around Nabba.wff/NAC Nabba and NZIFBB .... Some athletes that were strictly NZFBB back in the day now competing for Nabba feds and vice versa has probably openned up new networks. Things seem to be a lot calmer now in each federation which is allowing for focus to be put back onto the athletes in most cases.

We are also experience a lot of experienced but new promoters and judges coming through - you know bodybuilding feds have from time to time been bagged for being stagnant in their direction - but the current formats seem to be starting to become more refined in thier operation, which is great for everyone.

[musclenz]

I was thinking the same the other day Nate. But was thinking in chch its not as good as it used to be. Back ten years ago in my gym there were some serious freaks. Matt A, Mike D, Ed, Jason Brown, Darrel, DS etc. All of those guys if you saw on the st you would go WTF is that! You don't see that down here anymore...

Chch certainly had a scene back then, but it will happen again, cyclic me thinks. That and the fact you weigh 20kg more now & have seen a lot more since the mid / late 90's means it probably takes more to impress you?

Caught up with Darren Farrow in Akld last week - looking big as ever - and talked of a "rematch" in 2012 as he is competing again! Looking forward to it, but damn he'll be hard to beat and is definately a name to add to the list of top BBers presently.

I think I will have a stage that wil interest you both but I heard that you just want to be a tanner Nate :grin:

[musclenz]

IMO lifting the testing has been a fundamental part of the change - thats not to say there are not any good naturals out there - but there are parallels to the PLing debate in that there are a good protion of people who really dont give a shit if you're jacked or not - just want to see good numbers of qualified athletes in one show.

Another contributing factor has to be the split n factions around Nabba.wff/NAC Nabba and NZIFBB .... Some athletes that were strictly NZFBB back in the day now competing for Nabba feds and vice versa has probably openned up new networks. Things seem to be a lot calmer now in each federation which is allowing for focus to be put back onto the athletes in most cases. We are also experience a lot of experienced but new promoters and judges coming through - you know bodybuilding feds have from time to time been bagged for being stagnant in their direction - but the current formats seem to be starting to become more refined in thier operation, which is great for everyone.

Interesting to see some old NZFBB Exec's not only competing but in the audience

[Gym rat]

From the two shows that I have been to in the last two years which are last years NZIFBB Auckland champs and this years NABBA South island champs there were some phyisques on hand also photos from this shows from any of the feds that are out there.Also older people who are still competing like Collen Stlone and recently a couple of athlets from Dunedin who have been picked repsent NZ at the NABBA universe in Germany which are Donovan Chisholm and Sam Mausii which I find very cool.

[Optimass]

Interesting to see some old NZFBB Exec's not only competing but in the audience

yeah I know - who would have ever thought to see Mark Stewart supporting a Nabba/Wff event! He's been die hard IFBB affiliated ever since I have known him. Just goes to show how far the boundaries have been relaxed.

I sat next to Sanjeev at the Nabba/wff Pans ... I thought is was a no no for IFBB Pros to support events not sanctioned by the fed unless they are just manning a sponsers stand out in the foyer.

[nate225]

I think its a positive thing Opti, BBers should be able to watch / support other BBers in shows regardless of political affiliations.

I'm not aligned to any one federation and have attended NABBA NAC, NABBA-WFF & NZIFBB shows this year. When I compete and I'm a member of one (or two) of the federations I'll continue to do the same. Execs should be free to do the same - who knows they might even learn something from the 'opposition' while they're there! :grin:

[HarryB]

I think its a positive thing Opti, BBers should be able to watch / support other BBers in shows regardless of political affiliations.

I'm not aligned to any one federation and have attended NABBA NAC, NABBA-WFF & NZIFBB shows this year. When I compete and I'm a member of one (or two) of the federations I'll continue to do the same. Execs should be free to do the same - who knows they might even learn something from the 'opposition' while they're there! :grin:

ex execs?

I think it's always been ridiculous that you can't watch shows or compete in different feds. I know Nabba was never like that but the NZFBB used to be. We have a similar issue here with our IFBB affiliated NPC. Even guys who compete in one fed and have clients who compete in another get frowned upon for attending those other shows.