Pro seminar, what do you think?

[Loochi]

Sup guys,

Been a while since I posted! 2 more weeks and uni is over :pray: (hopefully I won't fail :pfft: )

Anyway, I was looking at a friend's facebook status when Darryn Onekawa posted that he should come to the seminar to learn more about bodybuilding and that just made me think "what.. the.. hell.."

Like what is the point of these seminars? From my understanding is to help those who want to succeed in their sport, am I right so far? With all due respect to Darryn, he's a lovely guy, down to earth and very humble. But what I like to know is, are you allowed to talk about drug use? (serious)

Like it's cool how they tell you, you need to eat this much, train like this... But to not mention gear..? (I'm assuming they can't/won't) Isn't that a bit wrong? And what would happen if someone mentions it? Would they deny this? I know in the back of my mind I'd love to ask that question but then people would probably think I'm a smart ass / hater... When I'm just genuinely curious lol.

This is what Darryn mentioned in the post

"It's a great chance to learn more from those who have started at the bottom and worked their way to the top."

I mean, I know the pro's work hard no doubt about it, but on the poster it says:

Posing - Training & Diet - Judging

But... To be where they are now, whether anyone wants to admit it or not, it's cause of the gear, right? I know I'll get flamed for this, and in advance

I'm truely sorry to offend ANYONE. Wasn't my intention at all, just thought it was interesting because part of the equation to be where they are at is a good diet, good training and gear.. Right?

[Shutupandsquat]

Cool friend

I was talking to Supry about it. He said they wouldn't mention gear, especially because Moe has lost 3 close friends already this year due to it. Darryn has massive hands, probably due to the gear, but they never mention it at seminars. Probably the risk of being arrested or something, or having a close eye on them. But I get what you mean.

There will be some political side to it, but I think if they're to be honest, then it should get a mention.

[Loochi]

:pfft:

That's the thing though bro, like wtf is the point of you wanting to 'help' others out if you're not going to say everything? Wouldn't that defeat the purpose?

I'm pretty sure being that size they'd have a close eye on them anyway, right? :pfft:

It's a joke.. I can see someone asking "what's the best way to get a big chest" and Moe will recommend 6 scoops of Dymatize a day with some profight creatine.. Guy can't even spell his own last name? Every time I see him compete it has different spelling.. Talks in 3rd person as well.. lmfao.

"Big Moe going to come home with the Gold medal!" :roll:

What if someone asks "what does it take to become an IFBB pro?"

They surely can't just say

"Put your head down, and focus. Eat each meal on time and train everyday."

...? :-s

EDIT: I don't even know where I'm going with this thread, I guess I just hate it when there are people who genuinely want to do their best but these guys won't tell them the 100% truth (talking about the noobs, I know the more experienced lifters would know obviously)

[tomsammce]

moe lost 3 friends to steroid related deaths? what was cause of death exactly and was their proof it was directly from the steroids?

darren has big hands from gear? bro gear doesnt give you big hands... LOL.

its fully innpropriate for them to talk about drug use at a seminar which are all endorsed by either a federation and/or a sponser not only would the federation and sponser hit the roof. but also who is an ifbb pro to lecture a room full of people on correct steroid protocol, it would just be their opinion and personal preferences just like the advice given out on this forum by the guys.

what if an ifbb pro told a room full of people at a seminar how he uses an exact protocol for clenbuterol and the room full of people all did that and fucked themselves up... that would be irresponsible, dangerous and not to mention extremely unprofessional.

people are also entitlted to their privacy, its no ones right to know every aspect of someones bussiness. you also gotta realise that they have lots to lose and nothing to gain by telling people that kinda info.

and lastly how much of these seminars do you actually believe. i mean its all just marketing and money... that comes far before truth.

[Shutupandsquat]

The hands thing was just a joke bro. Lol, STEROIDS MAKE YOUR BONES GROW!

I get what you mean, and I understand how you can look at it from both sides. I can't blame them for not wanting to mention anything about gear, but at the same time, telling white lies is just really touching the rim hole of how to make gain.

it's a two way street and I'm not wasting time going. I wouldn't mind going to listen to Supry talk because he IS a natural and he's humble as tits. And tits are pretty damned humble.

[tomsammce]

how do you know hes natural? are you with him 24 hours of the day? can you account for everything he does or does not put into his body?

no, no and no you cant.

hes past drug tests, and thats all that means. how many years has the nzfbb/nzifbb not had drugfreenz testing at and outside of their shows?

im not saying hes not natural, but your just basing your blind assumptions on bias cause hes your mate.

then youve got darren whose twice his weight and everyone wants to know his bussiness. darrens a professional bber now, his sponsers are his livelyhood...

its really pretty obvious and uncomplicated as to why drug use wouldnt be brought up at an ifbb pro seminar. isnt it?

[Loochi]

its fully innpropriate for them to talk about drug use at a seminar which are all endorsed by either a federation and/or a sponser not only would the federation and sponser hit the roof. but also who is an ifbb pro to lecture a room full of people on correct steroid protocol, it would just be their opinion and personal preferences just like the advice given out on this forum by the guys.

what if an ifbb pro told a room full of people at a seminar how he uses an exact protocol for clenbuterol and the room full of people all did that and fucked themselves up... that would be irresponsible, dangerous and not to mention extremely unprofessional.

people are also entitlted to their privacy, its no ones right to know every aspect of someones bussiness. you also gotta realise that they have lots to lose and nothing to gain by telling people that kinda info.

and lastly how much of these seminars do you actually believe. i mean its all just marketing and money... that comes far before truth.

I like your arguments Tom, never looked at it your way.

For the bold statement;

I wasn't really concerned with dosages and what not but more so the fact that they TAKE something to help them get to where they are. I agree, if they gave out dosages and one person decides to use it could end up getting hurt. Same thing can happen with an exercise program if someone is really unfit.. (Blood pressure etc)

I agree dude, it is marketing and money which is real sad in my opinion. I know this is not a perfect world we live in either.

I can see your side and respect it. :nod:

Anyone elses input?

[DANIEL8]

its fully innpropriate for them to talk about drug use at a seminar which are all endorsed by either a federation and/or a sponser not only would the federation and sponser hit the roof. but also who is an ifbb pro to lecture a room full of people on correct steroid protocol, it would just be their opinion and personal preferences just like the advice given out on this forum by the guys.

what if an ifbb pro told a room full of people at a seminar how he uses an exact protocol for clenbuterol and the room full of people all did that and fucked themselves up... that would be irresponsible, dangerous and not to mention extremely unprofessional.

people are also entitlted to their privacy, its no ones right to know every aspect of someones bussiness. you also gotta realise that they have lots to lose and nothing to gain by telling people that kinda info.

and lastly how much of these seminars do you actually believe. i mean its all just marketing and money... that comes far before truth.

I like your arguments Tom, never looked at it your way.

For the bold statement;

I wasn't really concerned with dosages and what not but more so the fact that they TAKE something to help them get to where they are. I agree, if they gave out dosages and one person decides to use it could end up getting hurt. Same thing can happen with an exercise program if someone is really unfit.. (Blood pressure etc)

I agree dude, it is marketing and money which is real sad in my opinion. I know this is not a perfect world we live in either.

I can see your side and respect it. :nod:

Anyone elses input?

atleast kevin levrone admits he used gear, probably didnt at the time of use though. thats the closest we will ever get to a real pro admiting their use

[Shutupandsquat]

its fully innpropriate for them to talk about drug use at a seminar which are all endorsed by either a federation and/or a sponser not only would the federation and sponser hit the roof. but also who is an ifbb pro to lecture a room full of people on correct steroid protocol, it would just be their opinion and personal preferences just like the advice given out on this forum by the guys.

what if an ifbb pro told a room full of people at a seminar how he uses an exact protocol for clenbuterol and the room full of people all did that and fucked themselves up... that would be irresponsible, dangerous and not to mention extremely unprofessional.

people are also entitlted to their privacy, its no ones right to know every aspect of someones bussiness. you also gotta realise that they have lots to lose and nothing to gain by telling people that kinda info.

and lastly how much of these seminars do you actually believe. i mean its all just marketing and money... that comes far before truth.

I like your arguments Tom, never looked at it your way.

For the bold statement;

I wasn't really concerned with dosages and what not but more so the fact that they TAKE something to help them get to where they are. I agree, if they gave out dosages and one person decides to use it could end up getting hurt. Same thing can happen with an exercise program if someone is really unfit.. (Blood pressure etc)

I agree dude, it is marketing and money which is real sad in my opinion. I know this is not a perfect world we live in either.

I can see your side and respect it. :nod:

Anyone elses input?

atleast kevin levrone admits he used gear, probably didnt at the time of use though. thats the closest we will ever get to a real pro admiting their use

May I introduce you to Jay Cutler?

[DANIEL8]

yeah, send me the link of him saying "i use anabolic steroids"

[Shutupandsquat]

[Loochi]

Kevin is the MAN! Won my respect with this video.

http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A ... 0mZ-uXZPbQ

Oh yeah, I remember Jay admitting to it... Hopefully the police aren't up his ass :pfft:

[DANIEL8]

iv seen that, the most he says is " i have the edge"

[tomsammce]

its fully innpropriate for them to talk about drug use at a seminar which are all endorsed by either a federation and/or a sponser not only would the federation and sponser hit the roof. but also who is an ifbb pro to lecture a room full of people on correct steroid protocol, it would just be their opinion and personal preferences just like the advice given out on this forum by the guys.

what if an ifbb pro told a room full of people at a seminar how he uses an exact protocol for clenbuterol and the room full of people all did that and fucked themselves up... that would be irresponsible, dangerous and not to mention extremely unprofessional.

people are also entitlted to their privacy, its no ones right to know every aspect of someones bussiness. you also gotta realise that they have lots to lose and nothing to gain by telling people that kinda info.

and lastly how much of these seminars do you actually believe. i mean its all just marketing and money... that comes far before truth.

I like your arguments Tom, never looked at it your way.

For the bold statement;

I wasn't really concerned with dosages and what not but more so the fact that they TAKE something to help them get to where they are. I agree, if they gave out dosages and one person decides to use it could end up getting hurt. Same thing can happen with an exercise program if someone is really unfit.. (Blood pressure etc)

I agree dude, it is marketing and money which is real sad in my opinion. I know this is not a perfect world we live in either.

I can see your side and respect it. :nod:

Anyone elses input?

so your just looking for a confession to his steroid use? not for indepth info to help you like your first post suggested?

what im saying is if he just says yeah i use testosterone and dbol then all hes done is admit he uses it... thats not really helping anyone?

for the advice to actually be of any use to someone especially a newbie the topic would need to go into massive depths to make it worthwhile and more importantly to make it as safe as possible (dosages, side effects, pct) or otherwise its really just doing more damage than good... people would go away from the seminar worse of than they were before...

"ITS BETTER TO KNOW NOTHING THAN TO HALF KNOW MANY THINGS"

[Shutupandsquat]

iv seen that, the most he says is " i have the edge"

That is blatantly admitting to it

[Loochi]

its fully innpropriate for them to talk about drug use at a seminar which are all endorsed by either a federation and/or a sponser not only would the federation and sponser hit the roof. but also who is an ifbb pro to lecture a room full of people on correct steroid protocol, it would just be their opinion and personal preferences just like the advice given out on this forum by the guys.

what if an ifbb pro told a room full of people at a seminar how he uses an exact protocol for clenbuterol and the room full of people all did that and fucked themselves up... that would be irresponsible, dangerous and not to mention extremely unprofessional.

people are also entitlted to their privacy, its no ones right to know every aspect of someones bussiness. you also gotta realise that they have lots to lose and nothing to gain by telling people that kinda info.

and lastly how much of these seminars do you actually believe. i mean its all just marketing and money... that comes far before truth.

I like your arguments Tom, never looked at it your way.

For the bold statement;

I wasn't really concerned with dosages and what not but more so the fact that they TAKE something to help them get to where they are. I agree, if they gave out dosages and one person decides to use it could end up getting hurt. Same thing can happen with an exercise program if someone is really unfit.. (Blood pressure etc)

I agree dude, it is marketing and money which is real sad in my opinion. I know this is not a perfect world we live in either.

I can see your side and respect it. :nod:

Anyone elses input?

so your just looking for a confession to his steroid use? not for indepth info to help you like your first post suggested?

what im saying is if he just says yeah i use testosterone and dbol then all hes done is admit he uses it... thats not really helping anyone?

for the advice to actually be of any use to someone especially a newbie the topic would need to go into massive depths to make it worthwhile and more importantly to make it as safe as possible (dosages, side effects, pct) or otherwise its really just doing more damage than good... people would go away from the seminar worse of than they were before...

"ITS BETTER TO KNOW NOTHING THAN TO HALF KNOW MANY THINGS"

Lol, I better go re-read my OP cause I don't remember 'indepth' except for training and nutrition maybe

You're right, it's not helping anyone but it gives them an idea..? Right? You can also argue the same thing with nutrition.. "Eat heaps of protein and don't drink water before your contest for the next 2 days, small sips only!" which can do more damage than good as well.

I like your quote at the end, It's true in a way but I disagree. Like for instance bodybuilding, there's so much more to learn than what we know already.. Some people think they know every aspect of it but it's just so broad and there's always something new to learn.

I guess it can go either way this topic. I can understand the risks that are associated with telling people about from what you've posted Tom, but I can also see how it's stupid to do the seminar in the first place. But money and marketing comes first.

I'll reply after I finish this assignment lol :grin:

[Ryno33]

bump for the friends and how they passed away

[thatwaslight]

SUAS, steroids STOP your bones growing, what you are referring to is HGH this can cause bone growth not gear!!!!!!!!!!

Also yes to everything tom has said.

[Shutupandsquat]

SUAS, steroids STOP your bones growing, what you are referring to is HGH this can cause bone growth not gear!!!!!!!!!!

Like I said bro, I was just joking. I know that it's HGH that does it. I'm not an idiot.

[tomsammce]

bro..

pro bodybuilding is full of lies, corruption and it relys on naieve people to generate all its money through them purchasing overpriced and overrated supplements. the supplement companies who sponser these guys are the only ones with money... no one else has got any money mate. cash is king and they own them. and what they want theyre pro bodybuilders to tell people, thats exactly what they tell them.

so when u go to a seminar and the guy juiced up to the gills who really doesnt wanna be there is sitting up the front and hes telling you what he does and this and that... i doubt it completly true. its big bussiness and there is a strategy in place at every seminar so the people walk out buying shit..

thats my opinion anyway... decide for yourself..

[thatwaslight]

SUAS, steroids STOP your bones growing, what you are referring to is HGH this can cause bone growth not gear!!!!!!!!!!

Like I said bro, I was just joking. I know that it's HGH that does it. I'm not an idiot.

Missed the part where it was a joke lol.

Personally if I was a pro I wouldn't bother going unless they were talking compounds and doses (I'm sure behind closed doors they do) but again what do you believe....I'm sure most would lie and say 500mg test 40mg dbol...LOL

Like Tom said it all just boils down to $ that's it. And to every other post I couldn't put it better myself

[Loochi]

bro..

pro bodybuilding is full of lies, corruption and it relys on naieve people to generate all its money through them purchasing overpriced and overrated supplements. the supplement companies who sponser these guys are the only ones with money... no one else has got any money mate. cash is king and they own them. and what they want theyre pro bodybuilders to tell people, thats exactly what they tell them.

so when u go to a seminar and the guy juiced up to the gills who really doesnt wanna be there is sitting up the front and hes telling you what he does and this and that... i doubt it completly true. its big bussiness and there is a strategy in place at every seminar so the people walk out buying shit..

thats my opinion anyway... decide for yourself..

Great post dude. I agree, I guess I am pissed cause I remember asking some big guy when I first started if I weighed the same as him, would I look like him and he was convinced I could lol. Nek minit...

Sorry if I gave you a headache :pfft:

alright no more forum.. lol

[HumanPerformance]

I attended a seminar years ago that Flex wheeler held and he let it be known at the start of the seminar that he would talk about anything including drug use. He made it clear (in a round about way) he would discuss his own drug use but for legal reasons he would always answer a question with "this is what the other pros do". And so people asked and he talked about AAS use GH use and clen, blah blah blah, I never really learnt anything but yes it was interesting to hear non the less. But as I said the whole thing was undertaken in the guise that he was talking about other pros. Which is completly understandable, as as Tommace has pointed out pros cannot just "come out" and admit to being "on steroids" without the possibility of losing all sponsorship and evaporating all future income.

Case in point, there was a pro in the 80s (cant remember his name offhand) who did and add for Mcdonalds. He was like a greek stone statue and this little kid comes up and puts a Big mac up to his lips and the bodybuilder statue comes to life and walks off hand in hand with the kid. It was a famous add and made the pro alot of money. But he made the mistake of admitting he had taken steroids during an interview when asked, and immediatley the add was pulled. Mcds dropped him like a hot potatoe and sued him not only for all the money they had paid him but for damages to the brand as well.

[Calvin]

I attended a seminar years ago that Flex wheeler held and he let it be known at the start of the seminar that he would talk about anything including drug use. He made it clear (in a round about way) he would discuss his own drug use but for legal reasons he would always answer a question with "this is what the other pros do". And so people asked and he talked about AAS use GH use and clen, blah blah blah, I never really learnt anything but yes it was interesting to hear non the less. But as I said the whole thing was undertaken in the guise that he was talking about other pros. Which is completly understandable, as as Tommace has pointed out pros cannot just "come out" and admit to being "on steroids" without the possibility of losing all sponsorship and evaporating all future income.

Case in point, there was a pro in the 80s (cant remember his name offhand) who did and add for Mcdonalds. He was like a greek stone statue and this little kid comes up and puts a Big mac up to his lips and the bodybuilder statue comes to life and walks off hand in hand with the kid. It was a famous add and made the pro alot of money. But he made the mistake of admitting he had taken steroids during an interview when asked, and immediatley the add was pulled. Mcds dropped him like a hot potatoe and sued him not only for all the money they had paid him but for damages to the brand as well.

And don't forget Christian Boveing getting dropped from Muscletech after admitting steroids got him where he is/was.

[Pseudonym]

A few years back Lee Priest came out to guest pose and do a seminar. From memory he was pretty upfront about his gear use - although I can't remember just how detailed he got.

Muscle Imaging filmed the seminar, and we put up a short extract here, although it doesn't mention gear use.

(Excuse the radio voice at the end... :pfft: :oops:)