Recovery - How much is enough ?

[Luv4Gym]

Hi All, im currently preparing for a comp in May and going through my hyperthrophy phase of training. Routine at the moment is a pretty simple push pull with legs in between of which has a days rest then repeated so effectively im training all body parts twice a week.

Traditionally speaking i would train each muscle group once a week. So the question i ask is do you think twice a week would be negative on the recovery and therefore growth stage. Im on creatine and have a good diet so input is fine, along with a good base of cardio and strength. But im curious on views of output. Cheers

[mike27]

can u post ur push/pull/legs routine and exercises. im starting one next week and keen to see how you do it.

i was just gonna go push mon,pull wed,legs fri and off/rest th othr days. as im planning on doing compounds only and really smashin it up

or could do less each session and do what you do i quess

mon-push

tues-pull

wed-legs

thurs-push

fri-pull

sat-legs

sun off

doesnt leave much room for rest.... but i quess if its set up correctly... then it'll be all good

someone with more knowledge may have a better view on this than me... im still learning.

[Luv4Gym]

I would move your off day to the thursday rather than the sunday to give you a rest break midweek. You'll need to manage your energy levels closely to make sure your able to make slight weight increases per session without taking the normal full weeks rest. If you find energy levels go backwards firstly split legs to quads and then later in the week hamstrings and calves.

Your right to stick to compounds try doing exercises utilizing the bulk of a muscles in that area. Keep to sets of 4 and reps of 10-12 per exercise. Try to avoid going to failure early in this program as you need to maintain consent increase in weights for the whole 6-8weeks. Thats kind of what i've been doing hope that helps any other q's feel free to ask .

[lemon]

Everyone's rest period will be different by quite a lot I'd assume. I find a 2 day gap gives me enough rest. So doing a push exercise on Monday, I'm ready again on Thursday. Unless its a new routine and new exercises I'm sore for about 5-6 days.

If you're eating good and taking supplements you should be able to keep that up. Plenty of sleep too.

I think its do-able.

Personally I like my weekends off so soon I'll be changing my routine to

Mon - Push

Tues - Pull/Legs

Wed - rest or maybe a light run.

Thur - Push

Fri - Pull/Legs

[Yeah-Buddy]

I think so often these days people stress far too much about getting enough rest/ how many rest days etc. If your only training once a day and you get enough sleep and food each day you should recover fine.

Rest becomes far more of a concern imo leading into a show because your on restricted cals so recovery is hindered. During a hypertrophy phase you should be eating enough to recover fine over the next 22-23hrs between workouts. If your not, sleep more/eat more.

[Beowulf]

I think your going to have to resort to the good old trial and error my friend you will know soon enough if your resting too little. I personally like the split Lemon laid out for Hypertrophy blocks however when I'm doing a Strength Block I move to a more comfortable Mon,Wed,Fri regime.

[mike27]

yeah pull and legs on same day cud nd up being a long session.

maybe not tho if im doing each section twice a week

[Luv4Gym]

Yeah i wold tend to agree pull and legs together would be an enormous work out if you smashing out big weights. Ive been doing the four day split for four weeks now. Push/Legs/Pull/rest and i have managed but you soon know it if you miss a meal or dont get enough sleep.

i seem to be recovering in the four days okay enough to get full value out of the session, i was doing cardio in the morning to but found it too much.

[Chemo]

Hey, thats my current split now!

If you truly give it your all, incorporating the usual drop sets, pyramids, eccentrics by Sunday you will be spent. I dont do purely compound movements, I start compound and post fatigue or finish up with muscle specific stuff.

There are ways to manage the split though, when it starts to dig into recovery time.

Cycle Max dead lift and squats to once a month or once a fort night, reason being is that the lower back doesn't get a lot of time to recover.

Modify your push pull days to alternate focus between horizontal and vertical movements

When you feel spent lower the volume / time of the session

Spend less thought on increasing intensity as the frequency will provide that too.

Its a fun split, lot of work and time go into it, and im sure at times ive been bordering on over training, but who cares at least youll be on the tip of what you most capable of.

Good luck you should totally try it, if its too harsh just back off a bit.

[mike27]

so ya reckon go

push mon

pull tues

legs wed

off thurs

push fri

pull sat

legs sun

this was my idea for the 3 day routine:

push monday:

bench press 5 sets of 8

military press 4 sets of 8

dips 3 sets of 10-15 @ body weight?

Incline CG press 3 sets of 8

pull wed:

chin up 4 sets of 8 (wide grip,weighted?)

bent over row 5 sets of 8

upright row 4 sets of 8

One arm DB row 3 sets of 10

DB shrugs 4 sets of 10

legs fri:

back squat 5 sets of 10 (15,12,10,8,5)

front squat 3 sets of 10

deadlifts 3 sets of 6-8

lunges 3 sets of 16 steps (8 steps each leg)

calf raise 4 sets of 10

sunday

rower

4mins level 6

30sec fast 30 sec rest 8 sets

2mins slow

treadmill

3mins walk @ 6.0km phr

30sec sprint 16km phr 45sec rest 8 sets

so i split the above into the 6 days right? or maybe even add a bit more.

quess ill just have to play with it for 2 weeks or so and see how i go

[nzmusclemonster]

How Hi is a chinaman....

[HarryB]

Which part of china!

[Android]

My view is you aren't listening to your body.

Anyone that fits workouts into the convenient "week" is using logic to convince themselves they are doing the right thing.

That said it would be cool if your body and workouts were in tune with the week.

Ok some tips:

All bodyparts twice a week is too much if u r natural.

Less often is better for hypertrophy, but more food and more intensity.

If u r yawning in the gym then it should have been a rest day

Don't be shy to take 2 days off occasionally

Work towards listening to your body re: growth

Good luck for May however u train

[Luv4Gym]

My view is you aren't listening to your body.

Anyone that fits workouts into the convenient "week" is using logic to convince themselves they are doing the right thing.

That said it would be cool if your body and workouts were in tune with the week.

Ok some tips:

All bodyparts twice a week is too much if u r natural.

Less often is better for hypertrophy, but more food and more intensity.

If u r yawning in the gym then it should have been a rest day

Don't be shy to take 2 days off occasionally

Work towards listening to your body re: growth

Good luck for May however u train

Thanks a lot for this post Andriod. That all makes a lot of sense and the tips are certainly things i will take on board. I am keeping a quite detailed diary while at the gym to monitor energy levels and can understand that listening to what your body is telling you is a major key. Cheers

[legacy]

I trained every day for 2 months and by the end of it was weaker than when I began, dropped to 5 days week, still too much, now i'm training Monday,Wednesday,Friday and that suits my body well giving me enough recovery time.

[Android]

I trained every day for 2 months and by the end of it was weaker than when I began, dropped to 5 days week, still too much, now i'm training Monday,Wednesday,Friday and that suits my body well giving me enough recovery time.

Yep exactly.

Although everyone is different I'd generalize and say if u r young and not much muscle then 5 days a week will induce the right amount of hunger to eat more and u will see growth. Older or more muscular and the 5 days a week might (might) b too much. Might not if u eat awesome, rest well, easy job etc ... It's so personal

I was eating as much at 88kg as I am now at 112kg and not gaining at all while training mon-fri. Once I changed that I finally made ground up to 99kg, over several years and naturally

[WANABJAKD]

I trained every day for 2 months and by the end of it was weaker than when I began, dropped to 5 days week, still too much, now i'm training Monday,Wednesday,Friday and that suits my body well giving me enough recovery time.

Yep exactly.

Although everyone is different I'd generalize and say if u r young and not much muscle then 5 days a week will induce the right amount of hunger to eat more and u will see growth. Older or more muscular and the 5 days a week might (might) b too much. Might not if u eat awesome, rest well, easy job etc ... It's so personal

I was eating as much at 88kg as I am now at 112kg and not gaining at all while training mon-fri. Once I changed that I finally made ground up to 99kg, over several years and naturally

can you elaborate on that? how many days a week are you at it now? im interested in reading about your on cycle training structure if your willing to share with it with the board :wink:

[Phedder]

I trained every day for 2 months and by the end of it was weaker than when I began, dropped to 5 days week, still too much, now i'm training Monday,Wednesday,Friday and that suits my body well giving me enough recovery time.

Yep exactly.

Although everyone is different I'd generalize and say if u r young and not much muscle then 5 days a week will induce the right amount of hunger to eat more and u will see growth. Older or more muscular and the 5 days a week might (might) b too much. Might not if u eat awesome, rest well, easy job etc ... It's so personal

I was eating as much at 88kg as I am now at 112kg and not gaining at all while training mon-fri. Once I changed that I finally made ground up to 99kg, over several years and naturally

can you elaborate on that? how many days a week are you at it now? im interested in reading about your on cycle training structure if your willing to share with it with the board :wink:

His journal should about cover it :wink:

[Android]

You won't find a "program" that I follow.

What I learnt when natural I now also use when on cycle as well and it's simple...my next workout depends on my last workout.

So example is my next Leg workout exercises depend on what my last were, quite often in my Journal i mention what the next Leg or Back will be, well that's how I decide.

Back on topic and rest, don't plan rest days take them when you feel it's time to rest. Best times are a day after a heavy Leg day or feel extra tired, or if you are rushed or unprepared, don't workout and take it as a rest day.

Hope that helps