Colostrum

[ssw]

Got given a free tub of colostrum from a mate - anyone have any personal experience with this stuff??

worthwhile supp?

[Ronin]

Supposed to be useful as an aid to general health/immunity more so than for any muscle-building properties. I take it for that reason, have done so for a couple of years now, and very rarely get sick. Is it because of the colostrum, or just a really good immune system? No fucken idea, but the people I sell it to are pretty convinced :grin:

[Richard_P]

but the people I sell it to are pretty convinced

Where do you work Ronin?

[Ronin]

I don't. Not if I can help it anyway

[Peachy]

I had to take this stuff for awhile to try and fix my excema. Duno if it helped though. Expensive and I had to take 8 tablets a day all on an empty stomach.

[Ronin]

Bugger that, the stuff I use is a vanilla flavoured shake. Yummy

[Peachy]

Weird is it like dried powder?? Mine was in capsules that had to be kept in the fridge to preserve all the goodness. The thought of what it is grosses me out too much

[Grover]

yeah used to make sure the calves got it and they grew like buggery

be interesting to see whether they are giving you human? or animal colostrum!

Mooo

[Peachy]

Its cow colostrum. They dont pump it from lactating women that would be a bit inappropriate

[Plaintiff]

Really? they still market this stuff?

As far as I'm aware, colostrum was first marketed because it conatains insulin like growth factors 1 & 2, which is the major promoter of protein synthesis in muscle tissue.

However, colostrum has been proven ineffective in adult humans for two reasons. Firstly, the adult human gut is way to acidic for a polypeptide like IGF to survive digestion. It only works in an newborn guts because their stomachs are ph neutral.

Secondly, being bovine IGF, it's chemically different from human IGF so even it could pass digestion intact your immune system would recognise it as foreign and destroy it immediately.

The meat industry spends millions on synthetic drugs to promote lean mass in cattle. If the IGF bovine colostrum grew muscle in cows don't you think they would use it?

They don't because it doesn't work.

[tomsammce]

Really? they still market this stuff?

As far as I'm aware, colostrum was first marketed because it conatains insulin like growth factors 1 & 2, which is the major promoter of protein synthesis in muscle tissue.

However, colostrum has been proven ineffective in adult humans for two reasons. Firstly, the adult human gut is way to acidic for a polypeptide like IGF to survive digestion. It only works in an newborn guts because their stomachs are ph neutral.

Secondly, being bovine IGF, it's chemically different from human IGF so even it could pass digestion intact your immune system would recognise it as foreign and destroy it immediately.

The meat industry spends millions on synthetic drugs to promote lean mass in cattle. If the IGF bovine colostrum grew muscle in cows don't you think they would use it?

They don't because it doesn't work.

Good post mate.

[Thunderhorse]

IGF is produced by the cow in response to BGH injections,[14] and it is this hormone which increases growth and milk production. Bovine and porcine IGF-I are identical to human IGF-I, while IGF-II differs among animal species.[15]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bovine_somatotropin#Human_health

[Thunderhorse]

Fairly sure IGF-1 in milk is the same as IGF-1 in humans. A lot of the anti-milk sites say that IGF-1 survives both pasteurisation, and digestion. Awesome if it does. Squats and milk = low tech extra GH and IGF-1

[nate225]

As above posts cover, low pH in the gut destroys peptides (e.g. IGF).

Save your money if thats why you're using it. As far as the other proposed benefits (eg immune response) I'm unsure, so pay to research on a med database.

BTW - Porcine IGF / GH does differ slightly in structure to the human peptides, its as close as you'll get from an animal source (cf recombinant), but it still differs.

[Thunderhorse]

Ah well. I am pretty sure something in milk and whey protein makes you secrete more GH. Maybe just protein, which would be a shame. Anecdotally, people who have grown up on lots of milk seem to be taller and larger built.

"A recent study in young growing male rats showed that feeding

whey protein increased alkaline phosphatase activity and insulinlike

growth factor-I (IGF-I) mRNA levels in ectopic bone (Kelly

et al. 2003). As alkaline phosphatase is a marker for bone formation,

whereas IGF-I is a known potent anabolic agent (Price

et al. 1994), this further indicated a possible effect of whey protein

on bone formation."

http://journals.cambridge.org/download.php?file=%2FBJN%2FBJN94_02%2FS0007114505001789a.pdf&code=5d7fb3b8dcef9b6474f024857fd4885c

If only I was a young, growing male rat, haha. I'm not sure whether this is due to an increase in dietary protein, or specific peptides in whey (which as you say should be denatured in the gut).

[nate225]

From memory very young babies can digest & utilise peptides in their functional form, however as the gut develops (very early on) we lose that ability.

[Grover]

Ah well. I am pretty sure something in milk and whey protein makes you secrete more GH. Maybe just protein, which would be a shame. Anecdotally, people who have grown up on lots of milk seem to be taller and larger built."A recent study in young growing male rats showed that feeding

whey protein increased alkaline phosphatase activity and insulinlike

growth factor-I (IGF-I) mRNA levels in ectopic bone (Kelly

et al. 2003). As alkaline phosphatase is a marker for bone formation,

whereas IGF-I is a known potent anabolic agent (Price

et al. 1994), this further indicated a possible effect of whey protein

on bone formation."

http://journals.cambridge.org/download.php?file=%2FBJN%2FBJN94_02%2FS0007114505001789a.pdf&code=5d7fb3b8dcef9b6474f024857fd4885c

If only I was a young, growing male rat, haha. I'm not sure whether this is due to an increase in dietary protein, or specific peptides in whey (which as you say should be denatured in the gut).

:nod:

grew up on a farm, drinking gallons of milk

6'2" but both brother and sister are shorter so not sure that it was the milk!

[nate225]

Ah well. I am pretty sure something in milk and whey protein makes you secrete more GH. Maybe just protein, which would be a shame. Anecdotally, people who have grown up on lots of milk seem to be taller and larger built."A recent study in young growing male rats showed that feeding

whey protein increased alkaline phosphatase activity and insulinlike

growth factor-I (IGF-I) mRNA levels in ectopic bone (Kelly

et al. 2003). As alkaline phosphatase is a marker for bone formation,

whereas IGF-I is a known potent anabolic agent (Price

et al. 1994), this further indicated a possible effect of whey protein

on bone formation."

http://journals.cambridge.org/download.php?file=%2FBJN%2FBJN94_02%2FS0007114505001789a.pdf&code=5d7fb3b8dcef9b6474f024857fd4885c

If only I was a young, growing male rat, haha. I'm not sure whether this is due to an increase in dietary protein, or specific peptides in whey (which as you say should be denatured in the gut).

:nod:

grew up on a farm, drinking gallons of milk

6'2" but both brother and sister are shorter so not sure that it was the milk!

LOL - or maybe taller & larger built people are more suited to farming! THIS IS GETTING WAY TOO UNSCIENTIFIC!!!!! But in the same vein Polynesians aren't known for being large consumers of dairy products, and lets be real they are the biggest guys around (closely followed by the Icelandic probably!). Genetic predisposition is the answer to this debate!!

[Phedder]

Correlation does not imply causation. Unfortunately so many large population based studies fail to recognise this, hence red meat causing cancer, breakfast eaters weighing less, salt intake causing high blood pressure etc.

[Grover]

Ah well. I am pretty sure something in milk and whey protein makes you secrete more GH. Maybe just protein, which would be a shame. Anecdotally, people who have grown up on lots of milk seem to be taller and larger built."A recent study in young growing male rats showed that feeding

whey protein increased alkaline phosphatase activity and insulinlike

growth factor-I (IGF-I) mRNA levels in ectopic bone (Kelly

et al. 2003). As alkaline phosphatase is a marker for bone formation,

whereas IGF-I is a known potent anabolic agent (Price

et al. 1994), this further indicated a possible effect of whey protein

on bone formation."

http://journals.cambridge.org/download.php?file=%2FBJN%2FBJN94_02%2FS0007114505001789a.pdf&code=5d7fb3b8dcef9b6474f024857fd4885c

If only I was a young, growing male rat, haha. I'm not sure whether this is due to an increase in dietary protein, or specific peptides in whey (which as you say should be denatured in the gut).

:nod:

grew up on a farm, drinking gallons of milk

6'2" but both brother and sister are shorter so not sure that it was the milk!

LOL - or maybe taller & larger built people are more suited to farming! THIS IS GETTING WAY TOO UNSCIENTIFIC!!!!! But in the same vein Polynesians aren't known for being large consumers of dairy products, and lets be real they are the biggest guys around (closely followed by the Icelandic probably!). Genetic predisposition is the answer to this debate!!

Surprisingly on Island not a lot of tall big people!

lots of short round people

[vracula]

anyone drink raw milk?

[nate225]

anyone drink raw milk?

Nope

[Grover]

anyone drink raw milk?

:nod:

Did growing up, last had some Oct last year when visited olds.

[ANGELBRAND]

i would have to say its genetic predisposition rather than milk, my brother and i are a similar build but i go that from my hutchison family, scottish that were originally vikings!

[note i'm female, my brother is average for a guy, and I'm a bit bigger than him...]