Resveratrol

[Pseudonym]

What do we think of resveratrol? Seems everywhere I go, everyone's talking about its benefits. Mostly these are people trying to flog it on the radio, but I think I've even read about bodybuilders using it post-cycle.

Anyway, my aging parents are both complaining about a lack of energy, and I'm wondering if resveratrol might be the miracle cure (and an easy Christmas pressie!). So... has anyone tried it? What do we think of it?

[ThePman]

IIRC it has very poor availability when ingested orally, so it's probably not worth the bother in pill form.

[luv.me.oats]

biotest Res-v, great stuff I rate it.

helps with fat burning getting rid of that fluid around midsection and thights, it's supposeldy an anti - e

[Pseudonym]

Pman, I think I saw that study, but I think there are other ones refuting it. And there certainly seem to be a lot of people who swear by it (not just the ones who are paid to, either). I figure it's a good Christmas present because if it works for them, great, and if not, well they didn't pay for it. And it beats socks.

it's supposeldy an anti - e

And that's ok for the ladies to take? Wouldn't want to screw up me mum's hormones. She's fierce enough as it is. :pfft:

I was initially thinking of Lani Lopez's Res-V Plus, simply because that's the one that all the advertising is for. However I just compared it to Biotest's REZ-V, and and found a huge difference in the amount of resveratrol in each capsule. Biotest has 100mg, compared to a piddling 25mg from Lani.

So I did a bit more research. Turns out Pharma Foods Ultra Renew Resveratrol has the same amount of resv, plus added extras, for half Biotest's price. And unlike Biotest, it doesn't shout "ANTI-ESTROGEN TESTOSTERONE SUPPORT FORMULA", which would certainly scare my mum!

[Nik Antunovich]

Being in the wine industry there was hype about this stuff ages ago. It's recently gained traction as production methods have become refined and as you guys know there are more and more studies everyday.

Never thought about using it as a supplement above my red wine intake... I know what is better for my soul.

[rose]

Wouldn't want to screw up me mum's hormones. She's fierce enough as it is. :pfft:

Oh man, you wanna screw with your mum's hormones? :snooty: Do you know if she's on any HRT or other medication that might interact with it?

I know that, especially if I was a woman of a certain age, I'd want to be informed about anything that *might* have an effect on hormones, whether proven or not.

I know dick shit about reservatrol, but have read some made up shit on the innuhnet that said it's chemical structure is similar to a phytoestrogen.

If I was to purchase a supplement for someone (I cared about!), I'd at least try to make sure I knew as much as possible about it before inflicting it on them, which it looks like you're trying to do...?

You might be better off buying them a kick-arse multi-vitamin Unproven research has shown that older people stop eating as much food, thereby leading to nutritional deficiencies and lowered energy levels 8)

[Pseudonym]

Yeah, funnily enough, none of the advertising I've heard mentions res-v's effect on estrogen or testosterone levels. It wasn't until I dug a little deeper that I found there might be one. :roll:

It's all a bit confusing, really. On the one hand, it's being called a phytoestrogen:

Resveratrol and trans-resveratrol are powerful phytoestrogens, present in the skins of grapes and other plant foods and wine, which demonstrate a broad spectrum of pharmacological and therapeutic health benefits. Phytoestrogens are naturally occurring plant-derived nonsteroidal compounds that are functionally and structurally similar to steroidal estrogens, such as estradiol, produced by the body.

Benefits of resveratrol in women's health.

Drugs Exp Clin Res. 2001;27(5-6):233-48.

Bagchi D, Das DK, Tosaki A, Bagchi M, Kothari SC.

Which, to my very layman's understanding, suggests it's good for the ladies, but not so great for the men. It's in the same boat as soy.

Then on the other hand, you've got all the supplement companies pushing it as an "anti-estrogen testosterone booster". How? Surely it can't be both pro- and anti-estrogen at the same time?

But, apparently it can:

In cell culture experiments resveratrol acts as an estrogen agonist under some conditions and an estrogen antagonist under other conditions (18, 19). In estrogen receptor-positive breast cancer cells, resveratrol acted as an estrogen agonist in the absence of the endogenous estrogen, 17beta-estradiol, but acted as an estrogen antagonist in the presence of 17beta-estradiol (20, 21).

Linus Pauling Institute - Micronutrient Information Center: Resveratrol (very good resource)

So does this mean that res-v boosts estrogen if you're a girl, and suppresses if you're a guy? How bizzare. How convenient. :think:

[rose]

Hmmm. My 2c. Which you probably don't want :grin:

I know some older women are averse to having soy because it is a phytoestrogen (my landlady is one!). In older women this kind of thing can be more problematic than beneficial. On the other hand it could be the elixir of life :roll:

I guess the fact that it *might* have an effect on hormones means I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole. Getting and keeping hormones in check is a fine art at the best of times. Adding adaptogenic herbs or other unproven supplements into the mix just makes it harder IMO.

[ThePman]

It could bind to the receptor without activating it. Similar to something like tamoxifen.

But I'm not familiar enough with the chemistry to even start making those kinds of guesses. The body doesn't always respond to things based on our gut reaction to the name.

[rose]

The body doesn't always respond to things based on our gut reaction to the name.

Yep. And in an older lady, I'd probably be more cautious about it having the 'desired' effect.

[HumanPerformance]

Yes anti estrogens (AE) and Aromatase Inhibitors (AI) affect men and women differently, and so a male can take an AE such as Nolvadex or Clomid to increase his tetosterone (which is standard procedure after a AAS cycle) but a women taking the exact same drug will not raise her testosterone at all. This is because alot of AEs increase the production of FSH (follicle stimulating hormone) and LH (luteinizing hormone). The higher production of LH stimulates the Leydigs cells in the testes to produce more testosterone (T). Of course women to not have leydig cells so this does not happen. What little T is produced in females is produced in the adrenal glands.

In thoery Rez -V is supposed to raise T levels in men through the same biofeed back mechanism so will not raise T levels in females either.

Then on the other hand, you've got all the supplement companies pushing it as an "anti-estrogen testosterone booster". How? Surely it can't be both pro- and anti-estrogen at the same time?

Yes a compound can be both an estrogen agonist and antagonist at the same time. The forementioned Nolvedex is both as well ,just like REZ-V.

Nolvadex is often the first line of defense perscribed by a physician when breast cancer is first diagnosed (often changing to AIs if this does not work) this is because it works as an estrogen antagonist at the site of problem (breast tissue) by binding to the estrogen receptors in the breast tissue thus blocking the bodys own estrogen, but works as an estrogen agonist in the liver activating the estrogen receptors there. So as you can see it is both "pro and anti estrogen at the same time".

Another good example of this contrictory action of the same compound that we will all recognise is the action of DHT (dihydrotestosterone). As a male gets older (or uses AAS) more and more T is converted to DHT (through alpha reductase) this DHT causes a man to lose hair on his scalp but to increase hair production in other parts of his body- back,shoulders,out of his nose and ears etc.

[ThePman]

Since the stuff has nil oral availability, most of this discussion is redundant in the first place.

[rose]

most of this discussion is redundant in the first place.

Including comparing apples and oranges.

[HumanPerformance]

Since the stuff has nil oral availability, most of this discussion is redundant in the first place.

I think you my be confused. Yes although it has a high absorption rate it does indeed have a very low bioavailability. But very low is completely different from nil. Its low bioavalability is the reason it is sold in such high dosage pills as studies have shown that only a small amount (or its metabolites) remains in the system.

Here is an extract from a Oral Dose Escalation Pharmacokinetic Study in Healthy Volunteers of Resveratrol-

Abstract

The red grape constituent resveratrol possesses cancer chemopreventive properties in rodents. The hypothesis was tested that, in healthy humans, p.o. administration of resveratrol is safe and results in measurable plasma levels of resveratrol. A phase I study of oral resveratrol (single doses of 0.5, 1, 2.5, or 5 g) was conducted in 10 healthy volunteers per dose level. Resveratrol and its metabolites were identified in plasma and urine by high-performance liquid chromatography-tandem mass spectrometry and quantitated by high-performance liquid chromatography-UV. Consumption of resveratrol did not cause serious adverse events. Resveratrol and six metabolites were recovered from plasma and urine. Peak plasma levels of resveratrol at the highest dose were 539 ± 384 ng/mL (2.4 μmol/L, mean ± SD; n = 10), which occurred 1.5 h post-dose. Peak levels of two monoglucuronides and resveratrol-3-sulfate were 3- to 8-fold higher. The area under the plasma concentration curve (AUC) values for resveratrol-3-sulfate and resveratrol monoglucuronides were up to 23 times greater than those of resveratrol. Urinary excretion of resveratrol and its metabolites was rapid, with 77% of all urinary agent-derived species excreted within 4 h after the lowest dose

As you can see 77% of the rez v was excreted over a four hour period, but that still leaves 23% which is not exactly nil. It does suggest though that to get optimal benifits from REZ V it would be best to take it 2 or 3 times a day.

Heres the link if you want to read the whole study

http://cebp.aacrjournals.org/content/16/6/1246.full

[ThePman]

Heres the link if you want to read the whole study

http://cebp.aacrjournals.org/content/16/6/1246.full

Read the discussion. This paper isn't saying what you think it does.