Whats wrong with NZBB

[diamond]

I was not meaning that last post to be taken as negatively as it may has come across.

NZBB is really the only decent forum in NZ and i think that people should not be able to abuse it as much as they have been. There have been some good points raised about ways to stop the spread of rubbish on here, and i think a couple would be excellent ideas. Paying a small yearly membership which would then enable members to be able to post comments would be a good idea.

I'm sure there would be a lot of companies ( certainly ours ) that would be happy to support this sort of a concept by offering people with NZBB memberships a discounted rate on purchases.

Anyway i know that Pseudo is working on coming up with a solution so i'm sure something will be done soon which will make things a lot better.

[sponge]

If you stay out of the playground most of the forum is friendly and free from the rubbish. Yes it does get out from time to time and it has been worse over the last few days.

We are taking steps to address this by a number of different ways. It is a small number of members though that create much if the problems. So have patience and hopefully we will see an improvement in the days to come

Maybe so, but I've been a member here for years and as it is I don't feel like logging on much these days. Just seems like everytime I do I come across some immature crap, regardless of where I look in the forum.

I feel that there need to be more moderators and perhaps a harder approach should be taken to crap. In saying that I noticed that Pseudoynm banned a couple members in the last couple days straight away just for creating several accounts - brilliant. In the past that wouldn't have been done and I think it should be kept up.

[auck_builder]

everybody has diff tastes when it comes to what makes them laugh, i dont think it makes them immature. i think alot of members find the playground very funny or :pfft: so its a good thing. u can only talk about protien powder for so long before it becomes boring

[VampireChick]

:ditto:

While it may get out of control at times, I'll admit I'm one of the first to laugh. 1day and Boosting crack me up!

As a newbie to this site, I believe these forums have given me a wealth of information, and have made my introduction to this sport a little easier. I think its fantastic to see other like-minded people here, when a good 99% of people around you don't understand what you're doing and are always willing to bring you down (even if I am doing this at a lower level). I'll be honest when I say I'll otherwise be a little too, hmmm, shy to approach body builders/sculptors for advice.

I agree with TFB too, perhaps some IT issues need to be sorted before we hit the fee idea.

[Optimass]

I'd hope that the operators can avoid making the site pay-to-join, as it'd probably put off some of the new entrants who (like me!) are the ones who really get the benefit of the wisdom which can still be found here, but if it has to be, it has to be. Realistically, while Bodybuilding.com and other boards I've used (runnersworld.com and bicycling.com) manage without it, they have huge publishing revenue bases to sustain the operations.

I think one of the points made earlier was that some of the more experienced contributors are not logging back in because of the quality of some the threads. A small charge would certainly reduce the amount of bogus accounts and also provide a revenue stream to upgrade and develop the site - in turn would encourage more to stay longer.

Perhaps the current format can be kept and may be a paid membership grants the member a "Gold Class Membership" which would give those members full access. i.e access to post in certain forums or read the workout journals, post my pics & diet and nutrition for example would be restricted. The annual transformation would also be members only - this way the memberships cover the cost of running the comp.

I think with a bit of work it wouldn't be hard to set up an online hub where a registered member enters their personal stats in each week and is bench marked against others in the forum of the same age / body type etc ... similar to nikes running site.

There is a lot to be gained ... and to be fair I'd like to see it stay free but if we can provide a more professional environment for those who are wanting to use the resources of the forum to thier best (whom are serious) - having a restricted area(s) would certainly provide a better option.

[Optimass]

everybody has diff tastes when it comes to what makes them laugh, i dont think it makes them immature. i think alot of members find the playground very funny or :pfft: so its a good thing. u can only talk about protien powder for so long before it becomes boring

You could join facebook for that ... but then some of the content in the playground you wouldn't post in face book against your own name though would you --- (not meaning you personally AB just making a generalisation to everyone) --- My point is many of the post are extra inflammetory and get quite personal ...

Take Ramy for example ... paid particular attention to my workout journal and others and got grief for being a know it all ... end result he ticked off a few key members in the playground and then everyone changed their avatars and went on the attack. To be honest the guy pissed me off but you have to tollerate the small things in life sometimes - and given his pictures it was obvious that he needed help of his own.

[teamfatboy]

I think one of the points made earlier was that some of the more experienced contributors are not logging back in because of the quality of some the threads. A small charge would certainly reduce the amount of bogus accounts and also provide a revenue stream to upgrade and develop the site - in turn would encourage more to stay longer.

Perhaps the current format can be kept and may be a paid membership grants the member a "Gold Class Membership" which would give those members full access. i.e access to post in certain forums or read the workout journals, post my pics & diet and nutrition for example would be restricted. The annual transformation would also be members only - this way the memberships cover the cost of running the comp.

I think with a bit of work it wouldn't be hard to set up an online hub where a registered member enters their personal stats in each week and is bench marked against others in the forum of the same age / body type etc ... similar to nikes running site.

There is a lot to be gained ... and to be fair I'd like to see it stay free but if we can provide a more professional environment for those who are wanting to use the resources of the forum to thier best (whom are serious) - having a restricted area(s) would certainly provide a better option.

All good points, Opti - you convinced me.

[boostinggtir]

I would pay a fee, but I don't have but $2 to my name.

[Pseudonym]

Ok, first of all, my apologies for not posting in any of these topics sooner. It seemed like most of yesterday was spent replying to mountains of emails and PMs, and by the time I got to the last one just before midnight, my brain was officially mush.

Thanks to everyone who’s contacted me over the last few days. I’ve tried to reply to you all, but if there’s someone I’ve missed, I’m sorry. Whether you got a reply or not, I have read everything, and taken your suggestions on board for consideration and discussion.

A number of times this last year I’ve seriously questioned why I’d want to continue with the site. At the risk of sounding soppy, your feedback here (even the bits that made me go “Ouch!”) has reminded me why.

When I started this site, Bodybuilding.com had a reputation for being nasty and full of rubbish posts. People came to NZBB and commented on how friendly it was. It hurts to think that the positions might be reversed now. Keats, your point about us no longer taking the time to answer the “dumb” questions is an excellent one. On the bright side, if Bodybuilding.com can turn themselves around, so can we. Being smaller, it should be easier for us.

Diamond, in another topic you mention how many people have multiple usernames. How they bait other friends for fun, and post from different houses, with different emails and IP addresses. It’s fair to say I was gutted after reading that. It left me reeling. Sure, there were one or two cases we knew about and banned, but I’d had no idea it was so widespread. The worst thing is, under the current system, there’s not a damn thing we can do about it.

Deegee, Poos_n_wees, Marcus and Biggurl all do a fantastic job (I’m pretty sure Marcus spent at least an hour cleaning up after one user yesterday) but we can’t check everyone, and even if we could, IP addresses are not a foolproof check. There really is no guaranteed method to prevent multiple logins.

We can and will increase the number of mods, but no matter how many we have, they will always be the ambulance at the bottom of the cliff. By the time the mods can react, the damage is done.

So what can we do?

Sending out TradeMe-style postal address verification is a great idea, but it comes with a couple of problems. First is the cost – both in postage, and my time. Until this site starts paying its way, I can’t afford to spend any more time on it than I am now. Second is the reliability of the verification. There’s nothing to stop people from giving their parents’ or girlfriend’s address. (Even the NZSDA encounters this problem when it tries to track down people for drug tests.)

We could possibly do something with verification via mobile phone. There’s still a cost, but it’s smaller, and the process could at least be automated. There’s still the issue of reliability though.

So it’s interesting that a fee-based system was suggested. I’d been chewing over the same idea. Logging in with multiple usernames is much less attractive if you have to pay for it. We might even be able to check the credit card numbers to make sure they’re only used once.

Here’s how it could work:

Registering an account and browsing the forums would remain free. Maybe posting an event in the Event Calendar would be free too. But sending PMs and posting messages in other forums would require you to pay a one-off (annual?) fee first.

The fee has to be small enough not to discourage new members, but big enough to dissuade repeat offenders. The question is, can we find that balance? If you’re a new member, would you pay to post in this forum (which hopefully will be attracting quality members again), or would you go somewhere else where you could ask your question for free?

[runveerun]

hmmm good point Pseudo, If I was totally new to the site I prolly wouldn't want to pay to ask a question. BUT that would make me go through old topics and try and find my answer for free, which would stop people asking the same questions time after time in some respect.

I would pay to use the site now as I think it's a great site and has kept me motivated. I think it might be 'off putting' to some people but it would clear up the crazy people logging in.

[1day]

hmmm good point Pseudo, If I was totally new to the site I prolly wouldn't want to pay to ask a question. BUT that would make me go through old topics and try and find my answer for free, which would stop people asking the same questions time after time in some respect.

I would pay to use the site now as I think it's a great site and has kept me motivated. I think it might be 'off putting' to some people but it would clear up the crazy people logging in.

:ditto: bang on

[VampireChick]

hmmm good point Pseudo, If I was totally new to the site I prolly wouldn't want to pay to ask a question. BUT that would make me go through old topics and try and find my answer for free, which would stop people asking the same questions time after time in some respect.

I would pay to use the site now as I think it's a great site and has kept me motivated. I think it might be 'off putting' to some people but it would clear up the crazy people logging in.

Well said!

[musclearmor]

I tend to support the notion of user pays to wean out the bad apples, however- recommend a tangible benefit for doing so- tied to a timeline of good behavior and contribution.

I suggest a fee for joining around $30 that is either reimbursable for good behavior after 6 months (including more than a dozen positive posts) or redeemable for "supplements or accessories" from nzbb partnered online retailers and/ or gyms/ trainers (who support the forum) in exchange for good behavior after a period of time?

Mud slinging = immediate dismissal

Perhaps even a point system for number of posts thus rewarding both the inquisitive and those experienced posters offering valuable advice?

I'm sure you could receive support from commercial players in the industry (gyms, trainers, supplement suppliers, online retailers, physical retailers, fitness equipment retailers, health magazines etc.) to drive this type of program?

A time limit would be required (6 months) before you could receive such "benefits".

This way the Body building industry grows and benefits those developing it. And those who abuse the system lose their "investment" and privileges that evolve over time.

If you develop a decent investment over significant time- like a good trading history on "trademe", you are going to be more likely to do the right thing and protect it.

Next suggestions?

[keats]

I think the issue with the playground it that it opens the door for shit slinging in other forums, if people kept the mocking to only the playground then there would not be a problem. NZBB is the best bodybuilding site in NZ, we should be proud of it and its members, we are all here for a common purpose so lets be supportive.

The fee scenario would probably work with current members however like myself when I am browsing forums looking for some information and there is the option to pay for it I generally skip the site and move to another where the advice, movie or song *allegedly* is free.

A few more mods, the Mud slinging = immediate dismissal, all great ideas.

[Optimass]

I suggest a fee for joining around $30 that is either reimbursable for good behavior after 6 months (including more than a dozen positive posts) or redeemable for "supplements or accessories" from nzbb partnered online retailers and/ or gyms/ trainers (who support the forum) in exchange for good behavior after a period of time?

Not sure about the reimbursement - like pseudo says ... his time and operating costs need to be weighed up. I'd be keen to make the installment permanent - its only $30, - .................... and the fee should be made annually - but perhaps reduced for a re-subscribe the following year to show benefit of long term association.

Perhaps even a point system for number of posts thus rewarding both the inquisitive and those experienced posters offering valuable advice?

:clap:

I'm sure you could receive support from commercial players in the industry (gyms, trainers, supplement suppliers, online retailers, physical retailers, fitness equipment retailers, health magazines etc.) to drive this type of program?

....

Easier said than done - most gym owners and importers in the industry are starting to batten down the hatches .... but it is possible >>> may be. Ideally the forum needs to be self funding. Subscriptions would make this a reality.

[The Legend Killer]

I think it's great that this forum has some life, I have seen some other NZ bodybuilding forums that are pretty much dead. Having a few idiots (who can make for entertaining reading) is a small price to pay for an active forum I reckon.

[BANNER]

having some life is one thing but I joined up the forum to know who was who in the bodybuilding scene. It provided a drive and excitement to know that others had been through or were going through the same trials and tribulations. It seems those who seem to know each other personally outside the forum use it as a get smart so everyone can see sort of base. I for one was always checkin the forum when I first got on to read how people had progressed in their journals and how peoples diets changed during comps. Seems like all the shit talk that appears come from those who dont even train or aspire to get better in their training. All the smack talk about who is the most hated member and all that meaningless shit can go. I come on here to here different training, diet and anabolic approaches from a Kiwi perspective that I can research further, compare and maybe utilize with my own training. Its turning into a phukin bebo site that I have lately skimmed past endless titles of polls and random shit that I couldn't care less about and end up leaving as soon as Ive signed in. Some may disagree but thats the way the cookie crumbles in my hood.

[Luigi]

Lots of good ideas in here, ill add my 2c worth then...

what about a sort of self-regulating forum, similar to bodybuilding.com...

say every user upon joining starts with 100 points,

every post made has a +1 or -1 next to it,

if you like it you can give them a point or if its misleading information or shit stirring take away a point, a lot of people read these forums but dont post...

so say if someone created an account to intentionally shit-stir it would only take 4 posts that 25 people have disliked before all there points are gone putting them on 0 which would result in a automated 1 week suspension and which the mods can then choose to delete it or let them have another chance.

on the positive side, new members would soon be able to tell who to listen to and who to avoid.

of course mods would still be needed to delete accounts/threads and oversee things but it would make there job a lot easier.

[Pseudonym]

Thanks Luigi. It's a good thought. I'd been toying with a "reputation"-based system, but I hadn't got as far as the automated ban. I was concerned about people competing to get the lowest rep score (got to be careful with that reverse psychology!) but following it with an automated ban would help.

My only other concern is if this gets used on newbies asking "dumb" questions.

But of all the ideas so far, this one is probably going to be the quickest to get up and running, and it would work well with whatever else we do too. I'll start looking into it.

[jono]

The forum has changed a huge amount in terms of the amount of slagging that goes on since i was last on here (4 years ago)

[orange]

I have seen points based systems fail on stock market forums.

Generally this is either:

When a low scoring (new or discredited) member posts a real gem of information but it is overlooked because of their low status.

Or, people generate extremely high scores over time to gain credibility, then promote buying a particular share or product to their own benefit (read someone elses loss).

[deegee]

Thanks Luigi. It's a good thought. I'd been toying with a "reputation"-based system, but I hadn't got as far as the automated ban. I was concerned about people competing to get the lowest rep score (got to be careful with that reverse psychology!) but following it with an automated ban would help.

My only other concern is if this gets used on newbies asking "dumb" questions.

But of all the ideas so far, this one is probably going to be the quickest to get up and running, and it would work well with whatever else we do too. I'll start looking into it.

I know we talked about the reputation system some time ago and I can't remember if the forum software supported this or not.

I do support the the reputation system though it also needs to be monitored , look no further that bb.com to see that it does get abused also by cliques ganging up on members who disagree with one of them.

Jono so good to see you post here. The site has changed so much since those early days when we didn't even need any Mods ! And I still haven't caught up to your post count either!

[EZcurl]

I like the site as is.

1day and others add humor and provide a motivating draw card to return. Surely it is better to lock the odd thread (like the combined bench-press) and suspend the odd member (Ramy) than have a dying site with few visitors and members who seldom post. There are a enough of those already in New Zealand! This site is dynamic and fun.

I have learnt a lot simply by reading answers to dumb questions. Many of the same questions I was too chicken to ask myself.

But the nasty PMs bug me. I posted an article and immediately received a threatening PM from a since banned member. And I get spam! Did anyone else get the persistent Lamborghini offering cheap Horleys, or this recent one from fitnessfiend?

Hey there.

I see you are pretty new here like me.

Another site you may be interested in is [MOD EDIT: No need to provide spammers with free advertising!]

Dumb

[deegee]

If you are being spammed by PM let any of the Mods know and we will deal with it the same way as any other spam on the board. If you are receiving abuse we will also look into it and take appropriate action.

[boostinggtir]

http://www.gymjunkie.co.nz

Dumb

Haha, 2guns is on that website.