nzfbb testing

[michaelk]

Keep the drug testing out of the sport. If you cannot fully eliminate it and you know that you never will, what is the real point? It's not like its the olympics or anything > people expect it! -

i dnt see why the users just cant stick to the nabba ? its like some of them are worried about being up againt other big guys ,were as they know they got it in the bag if they stick with nzbb?

i thought the nzbb was suppose to give the natural guys a shot(obviously not at the big time, but at least to not get blown off the stage by monsters). :?

why don't the natural guys stick to INBA-because they're all inocent :wink: ?

[michaelk]

People have their own reasons for which organization they align with, some of those may be geographical, calander timing or a preference to competing in a weight category instead of height etc

Can I highlight that since 2001 of the overall nationals winners in NZFBB only 2 have failed on the test, and Supri who was 2nd in 05 beat the 3rd place getter who failed the test by a mile. Admittedly in the past two years they weren't tested, but knowing what I know about both of them...they would have with Flying colours- the same could not be said about some of the guys they beat.

Simply if your good enough, your good enough.

There is a difference between being natural and passing a test, I've made it clear before I've never considered myself natural- but I passed the test x3

the NZFBB is a tested organization (or at least one attempting to adhere to the IFBB testing protocols) NOT a natural bodybuilding organization.

[1day]

why don't the natural guys stick to INBA-because they're all inocent :wink: ?

point taken :pfft:

the NZFBB is a tested organization (or at least one attempting to adhere to the IFBB testing protocols) NOT a natural bodybuilding organization.

so ur sayin if ur smart enuff to pull it off(pass test), ur sweet :wink:

[michaelk]

so ur sayin if ur smart enuff to pull it off(pass test), ur sweet :wink:

I wouldn't put it exactly like that as that would mean I'd be saying those that have passed the test have done that...and that is definatly NOT what I believe.

It also doesn't cover the out of competition testing (which I among many others also passed) and there was no way of planning for that.

[1day]

It also doesn't cover the out of competition testing (which I among many others also passed) and there was no way of planning for that.

so u mean u dnt keep a cup of pee in the work fridge :pfft:

[Andrew]

Keep the drug testing out of the sport. If you cannot fully eliminate it and you know that you never will, what is the real point? It's not like its the olympics or anything > people expect it! -

i dnt see why the users just cant stick to the nabba ? its like some of them are worried about being up againt other big guys ,were as they know they got it in the bag if they stick with nzbb?

i thought the nzbb was suppose to give the natural guys a shot(obviously not at the big time, but at least to not get blown off the stage by monsters). :?

Not everyone in NABBA is geared up monster... far from it infact if you look at the athletic class! you could almost rename it the "natural" class (bar a few exceptions)

[michaelk]

It also doesn't cover the out of competition testing (which I among many others also passed) and there was no way of planning for that.

so u mean u dnt keep a cup of pee in the work fridge :pfft:

I did, but there was an unfortunate roasting hot day and dying of thirst incident....it's too uncomfortable to talk about but I'm getting help :cry:

[bigmd]

Keep the drug testing out of the sport. If you cannot fully eliminate it and you know that you never will, what is the real point? It's not like its the olympics or anything > people expect it! -

i dnt see why the users just cant stick to the nabba ? its like some of them are worried about being up againt other big guys ,were as they know they got it in the bag if they stick with nzbb?

i thought the nzbb was suppose to give the natural guys a shot(obviously not at the big time, but at least to not get blown off the stage by monsters). :?

You should check the results of some of the shows if you think that big NABBA boys will Have it in the Bag Over NZFBB!

[bigmd]

Not everyone in NABBA is geared up monster... far from it infact if you look at the athletic class! you could almost rename it the "natural" class (bar a few exceptions)

You would be suprised, just remember not all drugs are to get you massive, lots are to get you lean, or to get you under a weight class. when people talk drugs its always aimed at "the big guys" there are heaps of drugs used by the little guys and girls also to be freaky lean or to scrape in under the weight height restrictions. And to be honest these are the drugs which can very quickly give people some pretty nasty health issues.

[bigmd]

I did, but there was an unfortunate roasting hot day and dying of thirst incident....it's too uncomfortable to talk about but I'm getting help :cry:

I feel i know you well enough to say "ÿou are past help"

[musclenz]

Keep the drug testing out of the sport. If you cannot fully eliminate it and you know that you never will, what is the real point? It's not like its the olympics or anything > people expect it! -

i dnt see why the users just cant stick to the nabba ? its like some of them are worried about being up againt other big guys ,were as they know they got it in the bag if they stick with nzbb?

i thought the nzbb was suppose to give the natural guys a shot(obviously not at the big time, but at least to not get blown off the stage by monsters). :?

You should check the results of some of the shows if you think that big NABBA boys will Have it in the Bag Over NZFBB!

Thats because your boys go off a bit earlier

[gazza]

is it correct that in the states, to be classed 'natural' you have to have been off drugs for 12 months?

[nate225]

Discussed this further with some wise heads in the game (such BBers are a bit few and far between at times!), and came up with some points to consider.

Firstly what is the aim of NZFBB in terms of "higher honours", is it to get BBers to the World Champs or to get guys to go IFBB Pro. Probably worth considering that in our little country we actually have very few that have a shit show of footing it with Kai Greene and co, Moe being the obvious exception at this point. World Champs probably a better option IMO for a larger number of athletes to attend and have a realistic chance of a placing.

Maybe in this case the testing could be strategically targetted for atheletes heading to the Worlds (as I believe the Worlds are tested, correct me if I'm wrong??).

If the strategic aim is to get Pro Cards, dump all testing, and lets see the freaks! Managing an inhouse programme and testing the 3rd placegetter in the 56kg Fitness Novice Ladies isn't fooling anyone!

I guess an alternative that considers the needs of all athletes would be to split the testing to allow athletes both the opportunity to compete as a "natural" within a solid testing programme, and allow the "elite" a clear run for a Pro Card. Maybe have NZFBB events tested, including Nationals / OCT, but have an "elite class" which athletes may nominate that excludes them from the OCT testing and their class isn't tested at events (with proviso that an elite cannot compete in any other class). Win/Win maybe??

Nate

[Optimass]

is it correct that in the states, to be classed 'natural' you have to have been off drugs for 12 months?

2 years

[Optimass]

Discussed this further with some wise heads in the game (such BBers are a bit few and far between at times!), and came up with some points to consider.

Firstly what is the aim of NZFBB in terms of "higher honours", is it to get BBers to the World Champs or to get guys to go IFBB Pro. Probably worth considering that in our little country we actually have very few that have a shit show of footing it with Kai Greene and co, Moe being the obvious exception at this point. World Champs probably a better option IMO for a larger number of athletes to attend and have a realistic chance of a placing.

Maybe in this case the testing could be strategically targetted for atheletes heading to the Worlds (as I believe the Worlds are tested, correct me if I'm wrong??).

If the strategic aim is to get Pro Cards, dump all testing, and lets see the freaks! Managing an inhouse programme and testing the 3rd placegetter in the 56kg Fitness Novice Ladies isn't fooling anyone!

I guess an alternative that considers the needs of all athletes would be to split the testing to allow athletes both the opportunity to compete as a "natural" within a solid testing programme, and allow the "elite" a clear run for a Pro Card. Maybe have NZFBB events tested, including Nationals / OCT, but have an "elite class" which athletes may nominate that excludes them from the OCT testing and their class isn't tested at events (with proviso that an elite cannot compete in any other class). Win/Win maybe??

Nate

Is this similar to how fake NABBA have their international class. I.E You can compete in any comp - qualify for Nationals and compete there -> but tick the international class if you are available for competing at the worlds (guaranteed testing) or leave it blank as you have too many commitments outside of the sport to travel and therefore a test is not required. This will allow athletes to still take out top honours and qualify for cards and will allow those wanting to move on to the worlds and therefore undergo testing.

[rigger]

A few random thoughts. It used to be if you went to the World's you had to pass a test "before" you went and presented the associated paper work to the IFBB. However I would say the last couple of years seeing there has been no testing by NZSDA in the NZFBB that there has been no testing for those that have gone to the Worlds. I doubt they paid the 600 to $1000 and did it themselves. However if required they would have had to do a test at the Worlds if asked to. Also why pick on those that represent the NZFBB overseas and let everyone else to do what they like. It should be the same for all one way or the other. From what I have seen the latest WADA code certainly reminds me of big brother and to hell with your privacy.

[Optimass]

I guess we are never going to find a balanced option with the federation in its current format. All the more reason to hold off on testing until a level and proven platform can be integrated.

[michaelk]

I guess we are never going to find a balanced option with the federation in its current format. All the more reason to hold off on testing until a level and proven platform can be integrated.

that would sound like a testing program designed by bodybuilders for bodybuilders hhmmmmmmmmm wacky crazy concept,

perhaps we better go leave it in the hands of the other bodies to determine, you know- bulgarian weightlifting; jamaican athletics; chinese swimming :wink: :wink: :wink:

[michaelk]

The point behind setting our own standard is that the IFBB constitution requires we MUST have a policy, however the world has hardly fallen behind our strict adhearance (much like the nuclear free thing) and in the meantime our athletes are up against an uneven playing field.

[nate225]

The point behind setting our own standard is that the IFBB constitution requires we MUST have a policy, however the world has hardly fallen behind our strict adhearance (much like the nuclear free thing) and in the meantime our athletes are up against an uneven playing field.

I hardly think there has been any "strict adhearance" of late Mike, and as such the playing field is looking pretty even from where I'm sitting. Compare the relatively strict WADA testing that NZ Powerlifters adhere to & then head to the Worlds where the Russians, Ukranians etc have been routing the system for years - now thats an uneven playing field. Luckily the IPF has been taking action of late against non-compliant nations (i.e. suspending them).

By having no testing in place you are creating an internal uneven field within the NZFBB. Those who want to compete clean have about as much chance as me against Kai Greene!! :pfft:

Find a solution that caters to the needs of both lots of athletes, again I suggest a class that is non-tested that once a competitor enters does not allow them to compete in other classes (this class would be seen as the pathway to Pro status). All other classes should resume full WADA testing. I guess this would be much like the amateur / pro distinction with IFBB but on a national basis.

Your thoughts Mike??

[Optimass]

Find a solution that caters to the needs of both lots of athletes, again I suggest a class that is non-tested that once a competitor enters does not allow them to compete in other classes (this class would be seen as the pathway to Pro status). All other classes should resume full WADA testing. I guess this would be much like the amateur / pro distinction with IFBB but on a national basis.

Perhaps a formal ELITE CLASS. With qualification being - 1st, 2nd or 3rd placing in any of the physique classes at Nationals (Excluding novice - will stop any of the lip sinkers getting through for sure ).

[Android]

Find a solution that caters to the needs of both lots of athletes, again I suggest a class that is non-tested that once a competitor enters does not allow them to compete in other classes (this class would be seen as the pathway to Pro status). All other classes should resume full WADA testing. I guess this would be much like the amateur / pro distinction with IFBB but on a national basis.

Perhaps a formal ELITE CLASS. With qualification being - 1st, 2nd or 3rd placing in any of the physique classes at Nationals (Excluding novice - will stop any of the lip sinkers getting through for sure ).

Oh great, so a Novice wins Overall at Nationals because he or she is the best in the country that year, and still can't get into Elite :-| ... great

[1day]

Oh great, so a Novice wins Overall at Nationals because he is the best in the country this year, and still can't get into Elite :-| ... great

its ok Android, i wasnt that keeen on the elite anyways :wink:

[nate225]

Find a solution that caters to the needs of both lots of athletes, again I suggest a class that is non-tested that once a competitor enters does not allow them to compete in other classes (this class would be seen as the pathway to Pro status). All other classes should resume full WADA testing. I guess this would be much like the amateur / pro distinction with IFBB but on a national basis.

Perhaps a formal ELITE CLASS. With qualification being - 1st, 2nd or 3rd placing in any of the physique classes at Nationals (Excluding novice - will stop any of the lip sinkers getting through for sure ).

Oh great, so a Novice wins Overall at Nationals because he or she is the best in the country that year, and still can't get into Elite :-| ... great

Good to see some ideas coming forward - maybe the Exec could hold a session with the athletes to thrash out some ideas and find a solution that works for the majority?

[michaelk]

I hardly think there has been any "strict adhearance" of late Mike, and as such the playing field is looking pretty even from where I'm sitting. Compare the relatively strict WADA testing that NZ Powerlifters adhere to & then head to the Worlds where the Russians, Ukranians etc have been routing the system for years - now thats an uneven playing field. Luckily the IPF has been taking action of late against non-compliant nations (i.e. suspending them).

By having no testing in place you are creating an internal uneven field within the NZFBB. Those who want to compete clean have about as much chance as me against Kai Greene!! :pfft:

Find a solution that caters to the needs of both lots of athletes, again I suggest a class that is non-tested that once a competitor enters does not allow them to compete in other classes (this class would be seen as the pathway to Pro status). All other classes should resume full WADA testing. I guess this would be much like the amateur / pro distinction with IFBB but on a national basis.

Your thoughts Mike??

The uneven playing field I meant was the tested NZ bodybuilders going to the IFBB worlds against athletes of other countries who are not tested at all- I wouldn't have any valuable contribution to make about the PL situation as I have no knowledge of their practices.