Mixability of protein decreasing?

[Pete]

Has the mixability of whey protein powder decreased recently?

I'm talking about powders which used to mix perfectly but now leave disgusting lumps, even after a vigorous shake.

The Pharmasports chocolate used to mix perfectly but now leaves lumps and the 3 Balance products I've used recently have all left lumps, as has the Horleys ICE Strawberry (not as bad in the chocolate).

[laurasaur]

Tbh I find all NZ protein powder mixes like crap. But no everything else I try mixes perfectly. Try Optimum Nutrition for easy mixing in water.

Plus I suggest getting a shaker with a grate at the top

[two_phat]

I've got horleys ICE at the moment along with another type of of powder and I can say without a doubt that the mixability in the horleys one is terrible in comparison - kinda disappointing considering the price I paid for an 800g horleys container was similar to 2kgs of my other protein powder which I find is better!

[orange]

That’s one of the differences between New Zealand products that use Fonterra whey protein and imported American brands that use cheap whey protein from China. The Chinese whey mixes easily because of the fine melamine powder. :pfft:

The other difference is the long term effect on your kidneys.

I’ll stick with the lumpy local stuff! Go New Zealand made!

[laurasaur]

That’s one of the differences between New Zealand products that use Fonterra whey protein and imported American brands that use cheap whey protein from China. The Chinese whey mixes easily because of the fine melamine powder. :pfft:

The other difference is the long term effect on your kidneys.

I’ll stick with the lumpy local stuff! Go New Zealand made!

Lol thats a bit misleading. Most of the imported stuff you buy is better Instantized than the NZ stuff you will find which is the cause of the poor mixability.

You would also be surprised at where NZ whey turns up

[orange]

I said to the guy at Health 2000 is this EAS protein made from whey that comes from China? And he goes yeah it is, and I say so it’s got melamine in it? And he says, yeah but only a little bit, and melamine is only dangerous to babies – and your not a baby are ya! Ok I didn't buy the EAS

[orange]

I avoid all the US stuff anyway - but I did read something on melamine and mixibility!

http://diabetesupdate.blogspot.com/2008 ... nated.html

[laurasaur]

lol!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you realise the milk powder that was contaminated with melamine was Fonterra subsidiary produced right? There is absolutely no logic that US protein powder is contaminated with Melamine, and yes, it is very toxic to all people not just babies, consuming it even in small quantities can cause liver damage.

You really shouldn't believe what people tell you, and that guy at Health 2000 needs a talking to lol

[orange]

Sanlu (a Fonterra subsidiary) were not the only ones adding melamine to milk - it is/was a common practice in the Chinese milk industry.

There is good logic. It's common knowledge that many (most) US brands import all their whey protein from China because it is extremely cheap. And there is a reason it is extremely cheap and will continue to be dead cheap for at least the next few years (until the contaminated stock pile is reduced anyway).

[Flex]

There is good logic. It's common knowledge that many (most) US brands import all their whey protein from China because it is extremely cheap. And there is a reason it is extremely cheap and will continue to be dead cheap for at least the next few years (until the contaminated stock pile is reduced anyway).

I think you've been talking to too many Eat me sales reps.

[orange]

I'll ask eat me for a discount cause i've advertised their product!

In the meantime I'll buy from Depont Industrial - they make three times as much whey protein powder as Fonterra each year so it must be good stuff.

http://www.made-in-china.com/showroom/d ... otein.html

I wonder where it all ends up?

[Optimass]

Another interesting point about Horleys is they always put their price up before the others and quote it is because the international price has gone up on raw product / shipping cost etc. But they get their protien locally??? ICE is a great product - I have seen the label certification report and it's consistantly tested at 91% protein.

For mixablity I prefer PVL Whey Maxx. Works great in a shaker.

[Dragon]

I've been reading in the paper that dairy prices have been falling month on month but milk and cheese prices at New World haven't budged and whey protein is only going up. What gives!

[Flex]

In the meantime I'll buy from Depont Industrial - they make three times as much whey protein powder as Fonterra each year so it must be good stuff.

http://www.made-in-china.com/showroom/d ... otein.html

I wonder where it all ends up?

Really, 3 times as much whey as Fonterra? Deponts turnover is $5 - $10 million per year and they are making 50 tonnes of whey a month or 600 tonnes a year. Strange then that this little independent dairy factory in NZ made 8000 tonnes of whey in 2007 - http://www.ruraldelivery.net.nz/absolut ... &print=yes

Fonterra's turnover is $19.5 billion/yr and they sell 350 Tonnes of dairy products every hour - that's 8400 tonnes a day of dairy products, over 250,000 tonnes a month. I could be wrong but I'm sure they get more than 50 tonnes of whey out of that.

[mr natural]

hahaha, always got to be mr right don't ya flex :pfft:

[HQ308]

More news of dairy prices down again today - http://www.stuff.co.nz/4781434a13.html

[Flex]

hahaha, always got to be mr right don't ya flex :pfft:

Sort of. I know China is producing more dairy than NZ does, but as far as quality, food grade whey goes I'd say NZ, USA and Canada would produce a lot more than China. Orange is making some pretty big claims by saying that the majority of US brands use china manufactured whey but I just don't think that is the case.

China has traditionally only produced very low percentage whey protein (through high heat processing) due to the extra manufacturing costs involved in low heat processing. I can almost 100% guarantee Optimum use US whey, and I can also give a pretty good guarantee that PVL use US and Canadian whey. As to other big brands - Dymatize, Cytosport, EAS, BSN, Prolab etc unless orange can point me in the direction of information that proves otherwise, I'd be pretty confident to say they are china free. (In saying that US whey may not be all that flash anyway when compared to NZ dairy due to the use of antibiotics, rBGH etc so sticking to NZ made whey probably is the best idea). I guess they could be exporting US whey to China, manufacturing product there and reimporting it but with high tariffs on imported goods I don't think that would be very feasible.

As far as dairy prices go I don't think the end consumer is going to see much of a drop in whey and dairy prices:

http://www.dairyreporter.com/Industry-m ... ive-future

Global dairy price rises back on the horizon: Rabobank

By Stephen Daniells, 01-Dec-2008

Despite an expected recovery in the price of dairy ingredients, significant price swings are still expected, according to a new report from Rabobank.

Inflated prices, volatile markets, and shifting trade patterns are all predicted to characterise a new era for the dairy market, according to the ‘Global Dairy Industry – Reshaping in a New Market Era’ report.

“In the medium-term, we expect to see more frequent shocks to the demand and supply side of the market, given more volatile costs of grain and fertiliser, climate change and the more prominent role played by less stable import and export regions like China and Brazil,” says the report.

“These shocks are expected to unleash the latent volatility inherent in dairy product markets due to the short-term unresponsiveness of demand and supply to price.”

And for users of dairy ingredients, this means a reconsideration of supply to ensure security and to ride out the volatility, while also balancing reformulation costs with savings from substitution, says the report.

“As the global dairy industry contemplates life in this new market era, players all along the supply chain will need to re-evaluate their strategies,” says the report.

“Those who adjust best will be well placed to reap the benefits that market change will bring.”

The rate of dairy demand growth has been pegged back recently, said the report’s co-author Tim Hunt, an analyst at Rabobank. “Demand has been heavily impacted by the combination of high retail dairy prices, poor income growth and substitution at ingredient level,” he said.

“While supply growth is slowing in the US and EU, that is being offset for now by increased contributions from Southern Hemisphere suppliers. As a result, supply growth will struggle to slow quick enough to create any price tension in coming months given weak demand conditions,” he added.

Medium term future

The first six months of 2009 are likely to see a continuation of below trend global dairy demand based on the assumption of continued weak economic conditions, said the report. Rabobank expects a turnaround later in the year, however, spurred by an eventual improvement in the global economy, and an increase in consumer demand due to more competitive pricing and cultural trends favourable to dairy consumption.

Recent supply growth is also expected to be tempered by a change of tactics by farmers to rein in investment in response to lower milk prices.

“Global demand for milk at any price point has shifted upwards. Essentially income growth and favourable demographic and cultural trends have increased the number of people that are aware of dairy, have access to dairy, want to consume it and can afford to do so,” said Hunt.

However, matching this demand growth will only occur if the price is right, said the report.

The situation is complicated by supply growth concerns in low-cost dairy regions, such as Oceania, Argentina and Brazil due to factors such as limited land or natural resource (water) availability, poor supply chains or unfavourable government policy settings.

“This means that to meet demand in future, additional supply will be required from regions with higher costs of primary production, less efficient supply chains or greater structural impediments – such as the EU, Latin America or the US,” said Hunt.

“The world will need to pay higher milk prices to ensure that supply growth is forthcoming, and that will push global commodity prices back into a higher trading range,” he added.

[laurasaur]

flex you are my hero

[bjf]

what powders should i take if any, i want to lose fat not get too massive so dont want any with steroids in them please, i heard some do and make you really massive fast so just the natural ones please let me know and how to take them

[orange]

Nice post Flex.

I agree, NZ, USA and Canada combined export more whey protein than China. But I’m only interested in the high grade whey protein.

You mentioned Open Country Cheese as an example. These guys manufacture and supply 'low grade' whey protein (30% protein) as food for New Zealand farm animals. There’s a big difference in the required processing, milk volumes and cost to produce the high protein, low fat product suited to the nutrition industry. That’s my point.

Depont and Guangzhou Zeyu are only two of many manufacturers in China that supply huge volumes of very cheap ‘high grade’ whey protein powder to supplement brands in the USA. Those USA brands package the whey and export it all over the world.

And yes, I acknowledge that some of the whey protein from China was also bought by pet food manufacturers in the USA. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/10/06 ... ine_scare/

And here is where we disagree.

You say, until I (or anyone else) can show you otherwise, you are confident the major US brands are free of product from China.

I say, until the major US brands publicly state they are free of product from China – I won’t buy them.

I support 'country of origin' product labelling and New Zealand made.

[2guns]

flex you are my hero

same...

:oops:

[Dragon]

That article makes me feel sick! I hope the big US protein companies were not as greedy as the big US pet food companies or I'm gonna need a new liver :shock:

[Flex]

You say, until I (or anyone else) can show you otherwise, you are confident the major US brands are free of product from China.

I say, until the major US brands publicly state they are free of product from China – I won’t buy them.

Hmmm sounds like a good idea....Open the attachment.

And those that haven't you could try contacting yourself?

I support 'country of origin' product labelling and New Zealand made.

Funny you should say that - aren't you using horleys creatine? Where do you suppose that comes from? I could be wrong but there's no NZ based creatine manufacturer - as far as I'm aware it's only Germany(creapure), USA (pfanstiehl) and China that make it. And they aren't using Creapure or Pfanstiehl creatine (I'm pretty sure Pfanstiehl have stopped manufacturing creatine).

optimum.pdf

[aaa]

what powders should i take if any, i want to lose fat not get too massive so dont want any with steroids in them please, i heard some do and make you really massive fast so just the natural ones please let me know and how to take them

funny are u serious

[orange]

Yep you are right, creatine is not made in New Zealand and the Horleys product is from China. My creatine container doesn't have a country of origin label. It just says 'packed in New Zealand'.