NZIFBB Pro-Am Champs 2016

[HarryB]

Well apply it to yourself and your powerlifting. You started competing. Nek minit you're doing the world's. Bombed. But you qualified for it and so of course you deserved to be there. You learnt a lot and no doubt next time you'll be much improved because of the experience. Now maybe you could have waited longer but why? For the experience? What's the point? I'd say you got 5 years of experience rocking up to one world's. It's like that for the pro guys I imagine. Lol I have no actual idea but I imagine there's a hell of a lot to gain. Got to grab the opportunities while you can. 

 

And as to what do they gain from being pros? Well if nothing else it's good for their pt business :)  

 

It doesn't effect any one else if they bomb it's on them and if they clean up it's on them too. You're putting them down because they don't live up to your standards? I don't get that. They followed a process and that's all there is to it. It might be a flawed process but that's not their fault. 

[Realtalk]

I was on target for a medal and would have come down to the last deadlift, but then I retore my pec which I tore 3 weeks before going. What's your point? Cause I'm not seeing it. Maybe more people should do that, go overseas and compete at an amatuer level instead of blindly turning pro. 

 

 

[Realtalk]

Does what I said about John meadows and the judo example not resonate with you? Can you not see the correlation to the way the pro cards are given out internationally on such an inconsistent standard? So being an ifbb pro isn't elite it's just a right of passage? That's what I reading.

[HarryB]

45 minutes ago, Realtalk said:

Does what I said about John meadows and the judo example not resonate with you? Can you not see the correlation to the way the pro cards are given out internationally on such an inconsistent standard? So being an ifbb pro isn't elite it's just a right of passage? That's what I reading.

 

I agree with that aspect but it's not the athletes fault. And as for John Meadows, amazing condition, not so amazing aesthetics. The judo thing I get completely. However let's take that and expand on it. Say in another country the judo standard is less. Well they still send their best judoka to the Olympics. . Then that person comes last but they were there and earned their right by being the best in the nation. It isn't fair but ummm.. well what your friend should do is stay in nz til she gets citizenship then she can do something here she couldn't do in Slovenia. Or maybe she doesn't even make top 5 in nz. I don't know how strong judo is in nz. 

 

And as to my point relating to your powerlifting who cares what you were on target to do. You didn't do it. No one's saying you shouldn't have been there though are they? You were the best in your class nz had to offer at that point in time is what I'm getting at. Regardless of how you performed on the day. 

[Realtalk]

The qualification process for judo is international comps and you gather points over the years leading up to the games. In the big scheme of things being best in your country is irrelevant because the comps for qualification are international comps... World champs, European champs, Oceania etc. If two people qualify from same country then country chooses. 

The same stupid thing happened here with Drysdale and Waddell in the rowing and they had that race to decide who would go when in reality they both should have gone. Olympics are pinnacle but world champs are the toughest.

 

Anyway getting way off topic here. But it's always good discussing subjects with you Harry. We will agree to disagree :)

[Bigmikedifbbpro]

You argue so many angles on this, if we look at John Medows he didn't perform that well at the recent arnolds  (I'm not banging him as I'm a fan) condition fantastic aesthetically  terrible. Until athletes are shoulder to shoulder you can't judge them realtalk and Michael Knight arguments are that non of the nz 212 are standards to be pro, but as I have said before the fact in a call out I have been put beside the 3x ifbb overall heavywt world champ for a comparison. Where he placed 15 th in his first pro show. u also mentioned going to world events rather than turning pro, been there did that went twice been selected 4 x. I'd be really interested in real talks eyes someone like me what would I have to do to be worthy of a pro card??? I have told u what I have done in past so you have all the info

[nate225]

Great to see a robust discussion without it degenerating into personal attacks!

I see a few edits so congrats for holding it together lol

 

[Riccardo]

Lol, It's just funny that there is this massive double standard, I don't think anyone would bat an eyelid at a discussion around whether or not Israel Dagg should be selected for the All Blacks or if Josef Parker is ready for a title fight. Yet when it comes to BB, everyone loses their shit and takes it as some sort of personal attack. You put yourself on stage to be judged on your physique, you'd think BBers would have a thicker skin.

 

I'd say the only pro worthy physique in The NZIFBB is probably Steve Orton. Having said that, I don't know every BBer in NZ. 

[Riccardo]

3 hours ago, Bigmikedifbbpro said:

I'd be really interested in real talks eyes someone like me what would I have to do to be worthy of a pro card??? I have told u what I have done in past so you have all the info

I think thats the whole point of this debate. The fact that many competitors in the US who miss out on pro cards would kill 99% of NZ pro card holders on stage. This is obviously due to the criteria for obtaining a pro card resulting in a situation where there is relatively less competition to get one in NZ than in the US. that's just a fact. Because the criteria is not about ypur physique per se but about what you've achieved in your own competitive career as an amateur.

 

Generally when people talk about a physique being "pro worthy" they mean that there is a certain level of size, conditioning and symmetry required to be considered a pro. 

[Bigmikedifbbpro]

8 hours ago, Riccardo said:

I think thats the whole point of this debate. The fact that many competitors in the US who miss out on pro cards would kill 99% of NZ pro card holders on stage. This is obviously due to the criteria for obtaining a pro card resulting in a situation where there is relatively less competition to get one in NZ than in the US. that's just a fact. Because the criteria is not about ypur physique per se but about what you've achieved in your own competitive career as an amateur.

 

Generally when people talk about a physique being "pro worthy" they mean that there is a certain level of size, conditioning and symmetry required to be considered a pro. 

Ok so if i could beat say a nth American NPC  super heavyweight and Overall champion then we would be getting there???

[Realtalk]

Fair comments re John, I was just outlining the fact how hard it is to turn pro in some countries compared to NZ. Just an example. Daniel Hibbs wasn't very aestically, He beat some aesthetic people namely grant who probably has one of the nicest shaped physiques in nz... What if he had gone pro, he did more than salah and grant.

 

no disrespect mike, but maybe you beat that champion under the same circumstances teina beat you... Just a possibility... I guess that's just one of the things you gotta accept with bbing. Judging seems awfully inconsistent at times I just look at mike k and salah competing in consecutive weeks in 2008 or whenever it was... Melb/auck. Beats me.

 

Anyway my recent post wasn't about you man, more about the younger guys who have gone pro before they have done really anything, I said in my post I thought you were similar to John in the matter of doing your time and giving to the amatuer stage and probably you got lots back from that. I didn't mean to come across as attacking you in my first posts so I'm sorry if it came across that way. I respect your achievements and thanks for posting and saying what you have done. I didn't know some of that.

 

will you do another nzifbb promoted pro show?

 

 

[soundsgood]

List of NZ IFBB pro bodybuilders from 2006ish

Salah Ibrahim

Mike Kingsnorth

Mike Debenham

Grant Pieterse (handed back)

Darryn Onekawa

Kenny Omalley

Joe Ulberg (was this official?)

Teina Omalley

Mateo Vaihu

Steve Orton

 

2 x Overall winner Daniel Hibbs wasnt offered pro card or didnt accept?

Nathan Ohearn offered pro card but didn't accept
Am I missing any?

[nate225]

Dave Smith

Jon Davies (possibly qualified in Australia)

BJ Johns

Sonny Schmidt 

Moe ElMoussawi  (qualified in Lebanon)

[nate225]

Kevin O'Grady

[nate225]

Justin Rhys

 

Or were you just looking at since NZIFBB took the reigns from NZIFBB? 

[soundsgood]

1 hour ago, nate225 said:

 

 

Or were you just looking at since NZIFBB took the reigns from NZIFBB? 

 

I said since 2006ish as you would only expect a pro career to span 10 years or so right?

 

Getting a pro card is the start of the journey not the end isn't it?

[PETN]

Will there be any GPC pro cards up for grabs at this years nationals? 

 

[DIANABOL]

4 hours ago, soundsgood said:

 

Getting a pro card is the start of the journey not the end isn't it?

 

Christ I lost my shit reading this comment. LOL. 

For some guys it definitely is. 

[HarryB]

16 minutes ago, DIANABOL said:

 

Christ I lost my shit reading this comment. LOL. 

For some guys it definitely is. 

 

I read an interview with Dennis Wolf and he said when he got his pro card he knew he'd be going from winning everything he entered to being lucky to make top 6. Luckily he didn't give up cos he's made an awesome career from it.

 

It would be stupid to think that someone like a Teina or his brother can't keep improving and be competitive. Guys put Daz O down and write him off, yet he's literally the biggest fucking guy I have ever seen walking around and I've seen a lot of really big guys and when he gets in shape he's peeled like a lightweight. The fitx he did he was the hardest guy in the show and over 110 shredded with a tiny waist. Mike D is always competitive and even as a 212 guy he looks large. You talk about his height but umm... he doesn't exactly look stringy next to anyone. More than held his own next to the most thickly muscled 212 in the world. I've known Mike for years and I've followed his competitive career with a lot of interest. He was the best I've seen of him at this show just gone and he's what? 40ish. 

 

I don't know, I see guys representing in any sport and I try and support them cos they're out there doing it and I'm eating chips and watching cartoons. Hell I'm impressed by anyone who has the nuts to compete in anything. 

[soundsgood]

7 minutes ago, HarryB said:

 I'm impressed by anyone who has the nuts to compete in anything. 

 

Even physique? 

[HarryB]

25 minutes ago, soundsgood said:

 

Even physique? 

 

Even physique. The way it stands those guys are usually the hardest in the comps. Men's bikini is getting very competitive. 

[Realtalk]

I didn't say teina or his brother wouldn't or couldn't improve. And im

not thinking that they couldn't either. All I was basically saying was why not wait until you have improved some more before going pro. Take advantage of being an amatuer and win some shit or at least come close. Whats the rush? Surely competing often makes you a better bodybuilder?  What do you think? 

 

 

[Michael Knight]

They do it so they can put "IFBB Pro" at the end of their name on facebook. 

 

Everyone knows you're a success at life when you can do that. 

[amitnz]

imo  Daniel Hibbs  looked amazing! Seen his routine on Youtube

[Matrix]

I agree Harry, Big D is a friend of mine and I remember being at FILEX a few years ago and he literally had randoms hitting him up for photos the moment he walked through the Sydney Airport right the way through to the shows gates. I was talking to him outside the expo and got interuppted several times by complete strangers wanting photos, he was that impressive/head turning large and ripped.

He even signed more photos than Branch that week as he was tanned and still in contest shape from his last show. Very impressive width, as wide as any top pro I can think of and (from memory) around 118kg on stage peeled at 5 foot 10" . 

Most people don't see a local pro that big very often buts its head turning when you see them up close. Same as when he came to watch the NZIFBB Auckland (I think) at Auckland Girls years ago. There were some big guys in the que (like Andorid who used to post here) but all everyone could say was "look at that huge $%#@!* in the red T Shirt) the guy is massive!

 

Same as seeing Big Ron in his prime in 2000 2001ish when he guest posed in Auckland. I saw him walking down Queen Street from the Town Hall with some huge Island Body Guard and he was the biggest/thickest human I have ever seen. From the side his legs looked as thick as a truck tire, people were walking past him then turning on the spot and gapping in shock/awe/horror/amazement.