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The Vote - should we tax unhealthy food?

Pseudonym

By Pseudonym
in General chitchat

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Should we tax unhealthy food?  

39 members have voted

  1. 1. Should we tax unhealthy food?

    • Yes
      11
    • No
      28

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Phedder Veteran member

Phedder

Posted
Posted

I haven't watched it, but my biggest concern is how do we decide exactly what food is unhealthy?

Total sugar content, so fizzy drinks like Coke etc are included, then what about sports drinks?

I think adding taxes to 'unhealthy' foods is the wrong approach, I fully support removing or lowering GST on fruits, vegetables and meat. Give an incentive to eat healthier, not a punishment for choosing otherwise. Though of course this way the government actually has to spend money on subsidies instead of make it through increased taxes, so chances are slim there.

I know I'll be pretty miffed when I have to pay more for my chocolate milk :evil:

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nate225 Veteran member

nate225

Posted
Posted

Point made by Phedder - what is unhealthy food?

I personally believe any food can be part of a healthy diet - its the sum of the oarts that counts not the individual pieces.

To make it more complex there are the schools of thought about what is a healthy diet? High fat low carb vs traditional food pyramid, cholesterol conspiracy stuff rtc etc. All too hard!

Maybe no gst on fresh fruit n veges or something simple might work? Unsure all seems a bit hard....

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Android Veteran member

Android

Posted
Posted

unhealthy food is sugar-spiking drinks regardless of your intention to consume.

They're not going to tax your intentions LOL, just the sugar

I think our personal tax rates should be our body fat %. Simple, motivating...and before everyone thinks I'm taxing the poor fat people, there's as many skinny poor people as there are fat, there's as many fat rich people as well, and the fat people regardless of their income are a burden on our health system.

What better way to motivate everyone to be slim, they control their own destiny, their own tax rate.

A high tax rate can still have a ceiling of 40%, but I'm sure 99% of people would try and get their tax rate down (can't help idiots I suppose)

just a thought. And yes, income from tax would go down...along with obesity, perhaps...perhaps along with things like drinking heavily....hmmm maybe smoking will take-off again since it's quite slimming LOL

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tomsammce Veteran member

tomsammce

Posted
Posted

Tax brackets gauged on bodyfat percentages?

Wow strong Thursday morning brain.

At the end of the day it's people's right to consume what they please food and drink wise, as it is to be whatever bodyfat they want to be.

Why should a fat person pay more tax than a lean person, that doesn't make any sense.

Inb4 I wasn't being serious, I was joking, my name is IDW.

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cruxis Member

cruxis

Posted
Posted

I hate how they try to use the obesity cost the tax payer more crap. Obesity prevention may be an important and cost-effective way of improving public health, but it is not a cure for increasing health expenditures.

Theres a dutch study shows that healthy people cost more over their lifetime than obese people.

Alot of healthy people live well past 65 and into the 80s,90s thus drawing a pension for 20+ years. That's alot of money. Healthy people are more likely to be active, and get injured playing sports ACC costs. Becuase healthy people live longer they also need old age care services.

From the study.

a. The healthy individuals live longer. Hence there is more years of health maintenance required.

b. Healthy individuals eventually die of diseases that take longer to kill them or are attacked on fewer fronts, which is easier to manage, unlike obese people who tend to have multiple diseases which they are less likely to survive.

Example.Lung cancer for a smoker is less expensive to handle as the patient survives for few years after diagnosis, than say Alzheimer’s that can have deeper costs with lifestyle management, family distruption and extended medical services.

It is therefore a common misconception that preventing obesity and smoking in our society, as it stands today, is not necessarily a solution to bring down our healthcare expenses.

Maybe Tax healthy lifestyles too. Put a tax on gyms and Sports fees.

http://www.plosmedicine.org/article/inf ... ed.0050029

Healthy people health care costs > Obese people health care costs.

They may be obese people who live into the 70s I never met that person.

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Chemo Senior member

Chemo

Posted
Posted
I hate how they try to use the obesity cost the tax payer more crap. Obesity prevention may be an important and cost-effective way of improving public health, but it is not a cure for increasing health expenditures.

Theres a dutch study shows that healthy people cost more over their lifetime than obese people.

Alot of healthy people live well past 65 and into the 80s,90s thus drawing a pension for 20+ years. That's alot of money. Healthy people are more likely to be active, and get injured playing sports ACC costs. Becuase healthy people live longer they also need old age care services.

From the study.

a. The healthy individuals live longer. Hence there is more years of health maintenance required.

b. Healthy individuals eventually die of diseases that take longer to kill them or are attacked on fewer fronts, which is easier to manage, unlike obese people who tend to have multiple diseases which they are less likely to survive.

Example.Lung cancer for a smoker is less expensive to handle as the patient survives for few years after diagnosis, than say Alzheimer’s that can have deeper costs with lifestyle management, family distruption and extended medical services.

It is therefore a common misconception that preventing obesity and smoking in our society, as it stands today, is not necessarily a solution to bring down our healthcare expenses.

Maybe Tax healthy lifestyles too. Put a tax on gyms and Sports fees.

http://www.plosmedicine.org/article/inf ... ed.0050029

Healthy people health care costs > Obese people health care costs.

They may be obese people who live into the 70s I never met that person.

nice post bro

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Leeroid Veteran member

Leeroid

Posted
Posted

I think this is a bad idea due to a number of reasons. Its intention is noble but its just one of those things that are unrealistic.

I doubt that manipulating the cost of foods will influence the diets of NZers for the better. Its a personal issue that wont be fixed by simply increasing prices. More should be done to educate people, and nutrition should be a bigger part of the school curriculum.

Like others have said, defining unhealthy foods will be very problematic and this alone would spark a lot of debate.

And the fact that the government is now trying to forcefully manipulate our eating habits verges on the edge of authoritarianism. Maybe an exaggeration but its encroaching on our freedom of choice. What if they decided high protein diets were bad and taxed all sources of protein?

Not to mention the fact that the food companies would never allow this to happen. A tax on unhealthy foods would mean less margin, reduced sales and a lot of money that they would miss out on. So I think its reasonable to say that the companies most likely to be affected would do everything in their power to stop this idea.

Most importantly, KFC is expensive enough as it is :grin:

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Diab0lic Senior member

Diab0lic

Posted
Posted
I think our personal tax rates should be our body fat

lol, or DEXA scans at the checkout to determine what you pay for the beers and chips in your trolley :pfft:

And no, "unhealthy" food should not be taxed more as there is no such thing as unhealthy food, just unhealthy diets and poor nutritional education. Better to remove GST from fruits and vegetables IMO if you must go down this kind of route route

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Lunchie Junior member

Lunchie

Posted
Posted

If the aim is to lessen the pressure on the health system and in turn help improve the health of society then perhaps we could take leaf out of washington states book and make pot legal thus allowing the state to tax the crap out of it. I know this is a departure from the original debate but it is one way to increase funds to the health system potentially.

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Pseudonym Veteran member

Pseudonym

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  • Author
Posted

The tax that was being suggested for unhealthy foods was 20%. That sounds like a lot (certainly Guyon Espiner thought so... he spent the rest of the program shouting, "20 percent?! 20 percent?!") but is it really enough to make a difference?

A 20% tax would increase a 2.25L bottle of fizzy drink from $2.79 to $3.35. I doubt that's going to deter the fat young people this tax is aimed at. A similar-sized bottle of water is only $1.89, yet they still choose the fizzy stuff - so obviously price is not the overriding factor.

The poll results on The Vote were interesting. Before the show, the studio audience were dead evenly split - 44% each for Yes and No. After the show, 42% said Yes, and 57% said No. However, the results from the live polling they were doing via txt, Facebook, Twitter, etc were quite the opposite - something like 56% said Yes, and 44% said No. :shock:

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Riccardo Senior member

Riccardo

Posted
Posted

Unhealthy food doesnt make people fat. Excess consumption of food makes you fat. You can get fat off brown rice and chicken breast if you eat enough of it, should we tax that too? Also where is the cut off for being healthy/unhealthy? Its too arbitrary. Maybe we should tax stupidity instead?

The best thing we could do to encourage healthy eating is not tax "unhealthy" food but subsidize fresh foods and produce. This is a far smarter move as I suspect people make poor dietary decisions because a $4.99 pizza or a pack of frozen chicken nuggets is cheaper than bread, milk, veges and chicken breast.

A fat tax didnt work in Denmark and if they ever implimented such a thing here I will leave the country because it will prove we are being run by idiots.

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tomsammce Veteran member

tomsammce

Posted
Posted
It's easy. Make it cheaper to buy some fresh chicken breast and vegetables than to buy a big mac with chips and a soft drink.

It is cheaper to do that. Do the math.

A Big Mac combo is one meal, the equivalent dollar worth of chicken and vege is multiple meals for the average person. Therefore it is more economical.

A Big Mac combo is expensive for what u are getting.

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FellowshipOfTheRon Veteran member

FellowshipOfTheRon

Posted
Posted
It's easy. Make it cheaper to buy some fresh chicken breast and vegetables than to buy a big mac with chips and a soft drink.

It is cheaper to do that. Do the math.

A Big Mac combo is one meal, the equivalent dollar worth of chicken and vege is multiple meals for the average person. Therefore it is more economical.

A Big Mac combo is expensive for what u are getting.

yeah eating healthy definitely already cheaper, especially if you get your meats from butchers, veges from local markets/the chinese vege stores which are often significantly better priced than the supermarkets for meats/fresh goods. can do even better if you buy stuff like potatoes/onions/flour/rice in bulk sizes. the big mac combo is all about being lazy. feed a family of 2 kids and 2 adults is like $20~$40 at McDonalds (depends how fatbig everyone is I guess). feed them with some sauces, rice and chicken at home and it's easily within $10 with far better macros for everyone.

also i was just being discriminatory and wondering, aren't a lot of these fat ones the same ones who get their money/supermarket vouchers from govt., therefore they probably don't care if they pay more or less tax on unhealthy stuff? could be good to start with monitoring/regulating spending habits of those on various stay at home benefit packages and slowly expand outward from there.

and what's going on tom, i thought you only just got un-suspended lol

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Donald Duck Member

Donald Duck

Posted
Posted

Oooooooh. So the BIG FAT problem is that people are too lazy. You bet your sweet ass that extra tax will not make them less lazy. Maybe this "taxing unhealthy food" is just another way for the government to earn some extra cash. Don't you just hate that word, T-A-X. :computer:

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Optimass Veteran member

Optimass

Posted
Posted

Fat people should just pay more tax - problem solved. I choose to eat healthy, exercise and educate myself. If people lack the self control to regulate and manage what goes in their mouths - or the mouths of their children then they should pay a premium when seeking support for health issues relating to their obesity.

Not suggesting an out right income or gst type payment - but if you go into a hospital or medical establishment and your illness is in direct correlation to your dietary habits and lifestyle then you should have to pay back the a portion of the treatment. Much the same as cancer treatment relating to long term smoking should not be subsidized and reimbursed by the individual. Injuries treated by hospitals and A&Es of drunk people from fighting etc should also not fall within the realms of ACC - if you drink and act like a douche bag then why should everyone else have to pay to fix you up.

So may be not a tax but an understanding if you choose to make poor choices and not look after yourself then you will have to pick up the bill.

You can screen for where obesity is caused through a genuine medical condition - and if you are active in sport and require excess body weight - it's not hard to prove or determine these situations. In saying that - even if you are large and fit you still carry some risks and again IMO can still be lean and strong. It not hard for government to engage communities and arrange support groups that will help educate these people that didn't pay attention at school in making the right choices.

Why should my kids have to pay for people being ignorant of the personal obligations to themselves to stay healthy.

Just my opinion.

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