Alright, newbie needs help...

[Sandif]

Ok, so I got into this 'fitness' thing about a year ago (March 2012 to be exact)... when I was tipping the scales at 150k+

I had a gym membership that was just sitting around gathering dust, so I thought...'what the hey, lets get moving' (also was planning some surgery in April to lose weight) so I 'hired' (is that the right word??) a personal trainer AKA arse kicker....

By april, I was down about 10k (yes, optifast helped with that too) and then I had the surgery... trainer left for Oz before I got another session with him, so I hired a new one.

I have now been with this trainer since about Late May last year and am down to 104k (this arvo) ... and have heard that he is now planning a 'long trip' to Oz.

Just to clarify, the 50k I have lost on the scales is backed up by 30cm on the waist, 6 clothing sizes and some 'definite changes' in physique.

Losing the trainer ain't gonna be a biggie as I think I have outgrown him, but I do want to get a goal / serious routine / some idea where the f^$# I am going from here....

Currently I go to the gym 5-6 days a week, afternoons usually. Work out generally consists of 2k fast walk (to the gym, not treadmills) then 30 - 45 minutes of weights (I rotate through a couple of workouts, focussing on upper, then lower, push then pull.... standard stuff I guess?), then a 2 k wlk home again. After dinner, I normally do another 2-3k fast walk...

I work out with the PT once a week for 30 min and that could be anything from Cardio, to weights, to Boxing, to TRX, to .....

I don't really have time to do more as I also work full time and have two kids (11 and 7) so that keeps other hours full.... (and am studying for MBA)

I like the physical changes my body is going through, I LOVE the arms etc... that now have shape rather than being Christmas Hams... :shock: and I guess I want to continue....

If anybody out there can suggest training routines... workouts... trainers... anything, happy to take the advice (and criticism... if its polite!)

BTW - almost 40 and female, based in New Lynn, Auckland..... if that changes anything!

[Merlin]

That's some amazing progress. Well done to you :clap:

Keep doing what you're doing in my opinion. Do you have a specific goal weight?

[Sandif]

Thanks Merlin

I guess I really want to know where to go from here.... weight wise, heck, I'm impressed with what I've done and probably want to go down another 15-20k or so... I'm 5 ' 8" so the 'charts' tell me I should be 67k... like thats gonna happen...

If anyone can give me direction or point me to further goals, that would be great! At the moment, I feel like I am in free fall??!! and need a goal.

Cheers

Sandi :pray:

[teamfatboy]

:ditto: What Merlin said.... that weight loss is awesome :clap:

There's a lot of good advice to be found on here, but let's take it from the top. Here's what I got from your post:

Since you're doing an MBA in addition to parenting and a full-time job, you're clearly motivated, but you'd like some focus?

You're time-limited in the gym, so you want to get the most out of what time you do have?

You've out-grown the trainer - which happens, especially if he's not in tune with your expectations - but you want to learn and grow independent of others?

You're a thirty-something woman, down to 104kg from a lot more, and now you want to aim your efforts in the gym and with cardio at something? And yes, being hot is acceptable.

Let's start by getting some more info:

* how's your diet? Knowing your calorie load, and how to set a small calorie deficit, will probably be easy for you, at least compared to the MBA - but a faulty diet will set you up for failure. [urlhttp]This site can let you calculate that...

* how confident are you in your form with the weights? Are you able to handle some key lifts, like barbell back-squat, or bench press (don't worry 'bout the actual weight, but if you can squat and press, that's two key tools in the tool box).

* have you found the resources tab - up in the top right-hand side ?

Enough with the questions

Here's some simple rules-of-thumb, which worked for me on a not dissimilar journey:

a. a 500 calorie daily deficit (3500 cals per week deficit) is generally accepted to burn 500g of bodyfat per week - see the question above - and this order of deficit is generally held to be sustainable for weight loss - going to a higher deficit frequently results in yo-yoing, which sucks;

b. Sets of exercises in the 10-12 range, or possibly 12-15 reps per set, is what you should be aiming at - less reps will build strength, but not necessarily add muscle tone or definition, and above 15's pretty much cardio, which you get on the way to/from the gym anyway;

c. rest and hydration are your friends;

d. Ask the PT why your routine changes, and let's see what he says. It sounds like he thinks you're still at the "anything will work" stage, and you are ready for a step-up?

e. that late-night cardio - do it "fasted" - eat first, then fast walk, shower, sleep... or perhaps even better, can you swap it to first thing in the morning, before breakfast on an empty tum? That is a proven technique to get value from cardio.

[teamfatboy]

Damn, missed your second post :doh:

Goals have to be about you... being a parent, having a career, they make that tough, but you've shown you're tough by tacking on an MBA :nod: so admit that you want X or Y goal.... whether it's strength, speed, shape. Or, pick a goal that puts you on the way...

When I started at the gym, the weight came off but for me, goals that resonated were sporting events - things with a date, an entry fee I couldn't back out of. I picked the Lake Taupo cycle challenge - then worked with a competent trainer to identify intermediate steps (kinda like project management). Sure enough, I nailed it - had a bet with my brother that if I finished, he'd run a marathon, which he still hasn't done!

I include strength as a goal - because you can track strength gains, week by week, and KNOW, when you leave the gym, that you're better than last week. Besides, strength training builds lean muscle, which is denser than bodyfat, so you still get slimmer...

For that same reason, DON'T pick a weight as a number - the world has too many skinny-fat chicks :nod: - the ones who look good, until they move. I know a PT who hovers around 72-73 kg, but looks like she weighs 62-63, 'cos she's lean and compact, but lower bodyfat.

Sorry, got carried away there

[Sandif]

* how's your diet? Knowing your calorie load, and how to set a small calorie deficit, will probably be easy for you, at least compared to the MBA - but a faulty diet will set you up for failure. [urlhttp]This site can let you calculate that...

um.... diet, shit, if I manage 1000 - 1200 cal a day, then I'm doing well.... some crap, but mostly lean good protein and a small amount of carbs...

how confident are you in your form with the weights? Are you able to handle some key lifts, like barbell back-squat, or bench press (don't worry 'bout the actual weight, but if you can squat and press, that's two key tools in the tool box).

Again, um, I think I'm doing it right... and no-one has ever told me otherwise... no injuries or repetitive niggles so I guess I'm good??!!!??!?!?

* have you found the resources tab - up in the top right-hand side ?

Yep, currently trying out a variation on the 'newbies guide to workouts' push, legs, pull....

As for the late night cardio, it is really not that late - about 7.30pm and more of an excuse to run the dogs (my mutt and the neighbours rotti...)

Goal ??? Not sure - hot sounds good, but I'm realistic :^o

Anyway, thanks for the tips... going to drink my 2 litres of water now

[I Declare War]

* how's your diet? Knowing your calorie load, and how to set a small calorie deficit, will probably be easy for you, at least compared to the MBA - but a faulty diet will set you up for failure. [urlhttp]This site can let you calculate that...

um.... diet, shit, if I manage 1000 - 1200 cal a day, then I'm doing well.... some crap, but mostly lean good protein and a small amount of carbs...

how confident are you in your form with the weights? Are you able to handle some key lifts, like barbell back-squat, or bench press (don't worry 'bout the actual weight, but if you can squat and press, that's two key tools in the tool box).

Again, um, I think I'm doing it right... and no-one has ever told me otherwise... no injuries or repetitive niggles so I guess I'm good??!!!??!?!?

* have you found the resources tab - up in the top right-hand side ?

Yep, currently trying out a variation on the 'newbies guide to workouts' push, legs, pull....

As for the late night cardio, it is really not that late - about 7.30pm and more of an excuse to run the dogs (my mutt and the neighbours rotti...)

Goal ??? Not sure - hot sounds good, but I'm realistic :^o

Anyway, thanks for the tips... going to drink my 2 litres of water now

I wouldn't be drinking 2L of water right now... isn't it a bit late?

[Sandif]

agreed. But water sounds better than wine or vodka!

[teamfatboy]

* how's your diet? Knowing your calorie load, and how to set a small calorie deficit, will probably be easy for you, at least compared to the MBA - but a faulty diet will set you up for failure. This site can let you calculate that...

um.... diet, shit, if I manage 1000 - 1200 cal a day, then I'm doing well.... some crap, but mostly lean good protein and a small amount of carbs...

Okay... that would explain the weight loss... using that Harris-Benedict calculator and your stats (gender, height (1m75), age (under 40) and weight), it would seem that your basal metabolic load should be around 1780 calories, and if you work out 3-5 times a week, you multiply that by 1.55, suggesting that maintenance calories should be around 2600. Now, I don't claim to understand the effect of the surgery, but if you're getting 1000 cals/day then you're quite likely running a massive deficit.

That points to two things for some thinking... where's the loss coming from, and what happens when you hit goal weight?

The major drawback is that, with a deficit as high as that, you do run the risk of catabolism - use of muscle tissue as fuel. So, whilst the weights work promotes muscle definition, tone and lean muscle growth, the rest of the time, the vast deficit's causing your body to erode those gains to keep the metabolism firing because almost inevitably, some lean muscle mass will get consumed along with bodyfat. Net result: when you approach that goal weight, the changes in body composition are less (the lean-muscle to bodyfat ratio) than they might have been if you'd been able to conserve lean muscle mass with a sound calorie load.

I'm personally not a fan of huge deficits, because they promote a false sense of "what's enough food". Better, perhaps, to stick closer to reality and accept the slower rate of loss. This is purely my 2c worth, though - not knocking the great progress you've made, or commenting on your approach.

how confident are you in your form with the weights? Are you able to handle some key lifts, like barbell back-squat, or bench press (don't worry 'bout the actual weight, but if you can squat and press, that's two key tools in the tool box).

Again, um, I think I'm doing it right... and no-one has ever told me otherwise... no injuries or repetitive niggles so I guess I'm good??!!!??!?!?

Now this is an area where your PT might start to earn his fee... promoting a safe environment where you can push yourself, and pick up good lifting habits. If you can't get lifting advice from that PT who does the random circuits, pick another one. There are women on here from the Auckland area who could help with names.

As for the late night cardio, it is really not that late - about 7.30pm and more of an excuse to run the dogs (my mutt and the neighbour's rotti...)

any cardio's better than couch time - but there's a couple of metabolic windows that are timed around the daily routine - cardio works well right after weights, when you've depleted your energy stores lifting stuff, the cardio draws on bodyfat for fuel (simplistically put), and also last thing at night, or before breakfast. Just sayin', whatever fits with real life is good.

Goal ??? Not sure - hot sounds good, but I'm realistic :^o

Goals are good - pick something that helps keep you focussed, that's time-limited (drop another size in two months, add 10kg to a lift, run an extra km or two by next month). Otherwise, how will you define success? Break the goal down into chunks - warm by May, hot by August, sizzlin' by summer

One other thing to consider, although everyone knows it's hard to fit a diet around a family... everyone gets their best results with a different proportion of their calories from protein, carbs and fats - I know I do a lot better on a high-protein, low-carb, high-fat diet (fats being good oils like olive oil, flaxseed or fish oil) than the normal ratios, or even those recommended for the stick-people long-distance runners.... so, when you get a chance, post up a typical day's diet..

[Pseudonym]

Great posts, TFB! :salute:

[Sandif]

Hey TFB

Thanks for your replies! I am aware of the high deficit and hope that by the time I hit 'goal weight' I have managed to increase or at least stabilise my calorie intake...

Typical days eating goes something like this...

Coffee and Up and go or similar for breakfast

Muesli Bar mid morning

Soup or quiche, rice crackers, cheese and some fruit for lunch

Nuts (large handful, mixed premium- no peanuts) mid arvo

Aussie Body Protein Bar (small) post workout about 5.30pm

Meat - lamb is easiest for me to eat (100 g max) and some potatoes (again 100 g max) and some cooked veg (tomatos, capsicum etc...) for dinner

1-2 glasses wine

1-2 choc biscuits

Not the best, I know, but I have a few 'food' issues that i have to work around (no pasta, rice or bread as it don't go down... no pork as it don't go down.... veges have an interesting effect on my lower digestive system (TMI???)

Also, I can't drink any liquids 15 min before and at least 30 min after any food, so I need to plan my water intake carefully!

I should probably also say that although I have averaged 1k a week for the last year, in the last 2-3 months, this has been more like 0.5k but with very visible physical changes... I think the plateau is over now and I seem to be losing at the higher rate again....

As for the form, yeah, the PT has been a bit slack, so I'm gonna start asking some of the 'grunters' at my gym for tips.... I'll let you know how that goes :grin: (and if some random chick asks you for help.... that'll be me!!)

Cheers

sandif

[teamfatboy]

Hey Sandif

Yep, I can totally relate to some of those issues, well, perhaps not the pork one... nomnomnom.

Having said that, your protein intake doesn't look too bad, and the limitations around pasta, rice and bread will likely work to your advantage... as they clearly have done. I'm trying to find the reference which refers to some of the vegetables in particular which have high water or fibre content, and negligible carbs, things like capsicum, cucumber, celery, tomato, and so on... essentially, they're a great source of antioxidants and other maconutrients, so good that some books call them "free" vegetables.

I think nutrition timing could work pretty well for you - in particular, a couple of observations:

a. get your post-workout meal, comprising both protein and (fast-acting) carbs in right after you finish the walk home from the workout. There's a 30-40 minute "metabolic window" where that nutrition can be made to work for you, rather than going to storage;

b. late at night, either the vino or the biccies... both are empty calories that'll go directly against your goals.

How do you go on cottage cheese ? Cottage cheese, which is largely casein, is a great source of protein: casein, in particular, is metabolised slowly, compared with whey (which is what's in a lot of protein shakes) and is a popular way of topping up the day's protein ratio, particularly last thing at night.

The body's a marvellous thing, it can adapt to any abuse - so if the upper/lower, push-pull thing is slowing down, switch it up (that resource tab again). Working different muscle combinations, or even going from three sets of twelve to four sets of nine, can help restore your progress.

If the PT's been slack - and you're the customer paying the bill - talk to him, tell him about the plateau and then give him a bit of a deadline to tailor something for you.

[teamfatboy]

One last thing from me, a sage piece of advice my trainer gave me.... after I'd had the quick gains, and hit a plateau, i was counselled that 500g/week's a sustainable rate of loss for the long term, and to shift the focus away from the scales, towards numbers... girths and skinfolds (the dread calipers of doom), and even the magic test-pants.... i.e. how well do things fit?.

As I mentioned, muscle's denser than fat, and if you're building lean muscle and shifting your body composition, the scale may not move as fast as the tape.

Particularly if, in your weights sessions, you're hitting the 10-12 reps per set range which is widely held to be the optimum for promoting lean muscle growth, you might find that your bodyfat continues to drop, whilst lean muscle stays the same, or even increases. The bonus is that, as bodyfat reduces, the lean muscle provides definition.

One last thing from me - levels of effort: in your weights work outs, do you complete the sets easily, fail on the last rep of the last set, or fail halfway through? Put simply, to help you hit that goal (size 12 or x kg, doesn't matter), the goal is to lift as much weight as possible - to expend calories, remember that "energy is mass moved over distance" - so too easy and too hard are not your friends here.

Aim to pick weights that let you fail within a rep or two of the end. Write them down, and next time, nail them all. Then, next time, move up a notch... 3kg to 4kg or 35 to 40, doesn't matter as long as you move up. With good form for safety (and to cut out the "little helper movements"), you'll promote lean muscle mass, burn energy, and test yourself.

Do weights first - so slow walk TO the gym, fast home. Why? Because if you "empty the gas tank" getting to the gym, you won't have enough glycogen in the energy stores to be strong, won't lift as much, won't burn as much energy, won't get as good a result. So, conservative on the way in, then after the workout, fast as you like Your muscles will have used the ready-use glycogen, so they'll draw on the energy stores... which is what we want.

[livetolift]

nice work

[Sandif]

TFB. Thanks for the advice.

As I move forward on my journey I will look up some of your suggested contacts.

See you all around the forums as well as in person one day.

Cheers

Sandif

[maccaz]

nice one tfb, few potential POTM's in there 8)

[Sandif]

Update:

Started with the new trainer. First session = 50 sets of stairs! FMD!

Anyway. New goal is 20 k loss in 20 weeks then move on from there.

Week 1 was ok. 1.7 k loss. Will see how I go for the next 5 months!

[teamfatboy]

Stairs are te evil - any time you finish and you've still got a heartbeat, that's a win right there :nod: