Dead Squats

[Android]

Has anyone done these and seen gains directly attributed to them?

They seem to assist with deadlifts as well...am hearing alot about box squats is this a similar thing guys? Cheers

[BeastBuilder]

Has anyone done these and seen gains directly attributed to them?

They seem to assist with deadlifts as well...am hearing alot about box squats is this a similar thing guys? Cheers

Are you talking about Pause Squats ? Like where you squat down and wait for a 2 count or whatever before you push back up ?

Coach used to do these and was telling me the other night he used to swear by them for power out of the hole and tightness.

Box Squats are epic ! I just came off a 6 week cycle of doing Box Squats and can definitely vouch for them to inspur new growth and strength increases in the posterior chain. Doing them without a rocking motion just pausing on the box and exploding back up is definitely the safer and more beneficial way to perform them, have a look in my journal I have a video of me doing a heavy triple, it's from the front so the technique is hard to see but you get the idea

[Android]

I'll check out your vid cheers mate !

I was reading this:

http://articles.elitefts.com/articles/training-articles/how-to-win-meets-and-influence-squats-and-deadlifts/

[BeastBuilder]

I'll check out your vid cheers mate !

I was reading this:

http://articles.elitefts.com/articles/training-articles/how-to-win-meets-and-influence-squats-and-deadlifts/

Oh I call those Pin Squats but yea I have heard good things ! Could be interesting to try and see what happens, I'd be very interested to see how they worked for a Bodybuilder, see if they helped with Posterior Chain development or if you could do them with more of a High Bar Squat position and they could help with Quad Growth ? I don't think I've ever heard of a bodybuilder performing these (feel free to prove me wrong )

[runveerun]

I'm pretty sure either Drizzt or MT were doing these at some point? I think? Good for getting out of the hole and there is no momentum, so would be a great strength and confidence builder in the squat.

I'm sure one of them will post their wisdom on this!

[tinytraps]

I did bottom position pin squats last year for a bit and definetley felt they increased my strength out of the bottom. They are a bit of a pain to set up but once you get the hang of them they are good money

[Android]

ok I'll give them a go tomorrow and see how they feel.

Am guessing I can't load the bar up with my max weight but if I do these twice a week I should notice some benefit in a couple weeks (fingers crossed)

thanks for the replies all :-)

[steak]

I didnt like them. Felt if my body wasnt in just the right position it was awkward to start and I couldnt use much tin. I found reverse band pretty good and the same with pause squats. Like anything it will take a while to see any carryover (6-12 weeks)

[Android]

I didnt like them. Felt if my body wasnt in just the right position it was awkward to start and I couldnt use much tin. I found reverse band pretty good and the same with pause squats. Like anything it will take a while to see any carryover (6-12 weeks)

The starting point has crossed my mind, it's different crouching under a bar than it is going down to that position. Will see, I've never done box squats so if this seems weird I might change over, cheers Steak.

6-12 weeks carryover!! What does the body wait for, another full moon to rise?

[drizzt]

I didnt like them. Felt if my body wasnt in just the right position it was awkward to start and I couldnt use much tin.

The starting point has crossed my mind, it's different crouching under a bar than it is going down to that position. Will see, I've never done box squats so if this seems weird I might change over, cheers Steak.

That would be my concern with this, you can adjust position until you're comfortable under the bar while it is on the pins, but it could be (and I'd say probably will be) different to where you'd end up had you come down from the eccentric phase. So you may be training slightly different muscles to fire than what you would actually use in a full squat.

/pessimism

Although one part of me is thinking that what you could find, is if you get into the most powerful position under the bar for a dead squat (which would potentially take some learning), you could be training those muscles to chip in on a full squat, making it stronger. Would be interesting to see someone go at it for a solid period of training.

/optimism

That being said, I'd probably rather a long pause squat - sit in the hole for 1-2 seconds before heading back up. The length of the pause would hopefully negate most of any energy you'd utilise to get out of the hole at normal speed, which is the point of the dead squat. It'd also put you in your more "natural" position in the hole, so you'd be developing the exact muscles you'd want to fire in that situation.

Box squats would also be a good alternative, but I'd suggest learning how to do these properly, as people new to the movement can tend to rock a bit when getting up, negating the "dead" part of the squat.

Just out of curiousity too - this part of the article (at the bottom) doesn't concern the bodybuilding side of ya? Or are you mainly looking at strength gains for the moment?

If your primary goal is muscle hypertrophy, this exercise doesn’t have a real big benefit in your program.

[Android]

I didnt like them. Felt if my body wasnt in just the right position it was awkward to start and I couldnt use much tin.

The starting point has crossed my mind, it's different crouching under a bar than it is going down to that position. Will see, I've never done box squats so if this seems weird I might change over, cheers Steak.

That would be my concern with this, you can adjust position until you're comfortable under the bar while it is on the pins, but it could be (and I'd say probably will be) different to where you'd end up had you come down from the eccentric phase. So you may be training slightly different muscles to fire than what you would actually use in a full squat.

/pessimism

Although one part of me is thinking that what you could find, is if you get into the most powerful position under the bar for a dead squat (which would potentially take some learning), you could be training those muscles to chip in on a full squat, making it stronger. Would be interesting to see someone go at it for a solid period of training.

/optimism

That being said, I'd probably rather a long pause squat - sit in the hole for 1-2 seconds before heading back up. The length of the pause would hopefully negate most of any energy you'd utilise to get out of the hole at normal speed, which is the point of the dead squat. It'd also put you in your more "natural" position in the hole, so you'd be developing the exact muscles you'd want to fire in that situation.

Box squats would also be a good alternative, but I'd suggest learning how to do these properly, as people new to the movement can tend to rock a bit when getting up, negating the "dead" part of the squat.

Just out of curiousity too - this part of the article (at the bottom) doesn't concern the bodybuilding side of ya? Or are you mainly looking at strength gains for the moment?

If your primary goal is muscle hypertrophy, this exercise doesn’t have a real big benefit in your program.

Thanks for your thoughts on this, makes sense what you've stated there.

I'll keep that in mind re: box squats as I can see myself doing just what you said and rocking myself out of the hole. Will try dead squats for squats and then also as suggested in the article try it for sumo deads as well since that movement should be as much Leg as possible.

Some good points there mate.

I'm building a "new me" so to speak.

Rather than come in as a bigger version of myself in last years Nationals I'm trying to produce a different shape.

In order to do that I have to change my training style completely and although I don't know exactly how it's going to change or where it will change until I've done it for a while, I'm sure it'll be a thicker, denser physique with the heavier weights.

Am hoping that once I plateau with the PBs that I can maintain those lifts and carry that strength into the bodybuilding routines. But right now...no bodybuilding and no going to failure.

Best lifts so far: 190kg Bench (no pause yet), 240kg Squat, 230kg Deadlift

Would like to see me hit a 200kg Bench (a paused 180kg), a 250kg Squat, and a 270kg Deadlift...before I plateau

[drizzt]

I'm building a "new me" so to speak.

Rather than come in as a bigger version of myself in last years Nationals I'm trying to produce a different shape.

In order to do that I have to change my training style completely and although I don't know exactly how it's going to change or where it will change until I've done it for a while, I'm sure it'll be a thicker, denser physique with the heavier weights.

Am hoping that once I plateau with the PBs that I can maintain those lifts and carry that strength into the bodybuilding routines. But right now...no bodybuilding and no going to failure.

Best lifts so far: 190kg Bench (no pause yet), 240kg Squat, 230kg Deadlift

Would like to see me hit a 200kg Bench (a paused 180kg), a 250kg Squat, and a 270kg Deadlift...before I plateau

Awesome... not that we powerlifters need more Bodybuilders that are stronger than us :pfft:

But good luck mate, those are some good starting PBs, keen to see how you get along :nod:

[Android]

starting PBs ... :oops:

errr it's taken me 6 weeks to get there

[drizzt]

6 weeks is all but "starting" Good numbers so far anyway 8)

[Wookie]

Not a fan of pin squats, cause it's easy to wind up straining in an unnatural position. Prefer pause squats so the weight stays on your back and you stay in groove. Make sure you don't rest hams on calves as it defeats the purpose and overloads the knees.

[Android]

Not a fan of pin squats, cause it's easy to wind up straining in an unnatural position. Prefer pause squats so the weight stays on your back and you stay in groove. Make sure you don't rest hams on calves as it defeats the purpose and overloads the knees.

Cheers Wookie, will see how the dead and pin squats go first and if they're awkward will try the pause.

To me sitting in the hole with a pause seems like you're just draining energy? (well it would drain my energy much like a pause bench press does...and draining energy means can only handle less weight), whereas pin and dead you're fresh under the bar until you start going up...just trying to get out of that hole.

[Wookie]

Not a fan of pin squats, cause it's easy to wind up straining in an unnatural position. Prefer pause squats so the weight stays on your back and you stay in groove. Make sure you don't rest hams on calves as it defeats the purpose and overloads the knees.

Cheers Wookie, will see how the dead and pin squats go first and if they're awkward will try the pause.

To me sitting in the hole with a pause seems like you're just draining energy? (well it would drain my energy much like a pause bench press does...and draining energy means can only handle less weight), whereas pin and dead you're fresh under the bar until you start going up...just trying to get out of that hole.

In a sense you are, but you only need to pause for a second or two to kill the stretch reflex. If you paused for 5 seconds, then that's different.

[tinytraps]

Not a fan of pin squats, cause it's easy to wind up straining in an unnatural position. Prefer pause squats so the weight stays on your back and you stay in groove. Make sure you don't rest hams on calves as it defeats the purpose and overloads the knees.

Cheers Wookie, will see how the dead and pin squats go first and if they're awkward will try the pause.

To me sitting in the hole with a pause seems like you're just draining energy? (well it would drain my energy much like a pause bench press does...and draining energy means can only handle less weight), whereas pin and dead you're fresh under the bar until you start going up...just trying to get out of that hole.

You wont be able to use a lot of weight on pin squats either. Because there is no stretch reflex its all starting strength. Like a deadlift with the bar on your back. If you could do 90% of your max from the bottom position that is very strong

[Android]

I'm looking forward to it, 2hrs from now will know and feel everything you guys have told me :-)

Prolly b way less than 90% I still want to do my normal Squats first get to 2-3 sets of 4 or something like that done. Then do the pin, dead or box Squats will just see what feels right.

Carbing up now and going in with coke to keep my energy levels up, must get some of that salts u guys snort too :pfft:

[steak]

re: box squats

Ive been having some success abusing myself by putting a 100mm foam pad (soft) on the box. It soaks up part of the eccentric and makes for a pretty brutal assault on the lower posterior chain...might be worth looking at - foams cheap 8)

[Android]

Foam padding, for powerlifting ... and I thought BBers were soft :-) is that why Opti changed sides, for soft foam and massages?

I did box squats in the end guys, since it's most common I figured if I had issues you'd know what they were like. Didn't try pins at all although we used pins, sat on the box stopped our heads under the bar and got it into position for a lift.

I did Squats first and ended up with 3 sets of 2 at 220kg.

Then for box squats worked up to 140kg and did 3 sets of 5, not to failure but until I thought it was enough. I stood up, sat down., stood up etc without any momentum or swaying. Really felt the upper Quads firing hard on take off and tomorrow will tell me if Hammies felt it too.

If fresher I reckon I could have done 160kg but happy with 3pps virgin box squatter.

I like these tbh. Feels like you can really feel the muscle working to get you up.

Cheers for all the advice hope I did ok