liver checks

[b3h3m0th666]

Hey all, just wondering if you have had a liver check after your cycle.

Mine came back at 53 and the norm is 40 - they want to retest. Iv been told by other bbrs not to worry.

Just wondering what if at all you have had 'high' results.

The cycle was test e @ 500mg pw/10weeeks.

Thanks,

B3.

[hhhh1]

you mean liver enzyme test right? If it was for alanine transaminase or

aspartate transaminase enzyme (im guessing it was one of these) that is higher than normal yes, but not high enough for real concern. High levels are in the hundreds or thousands of IU/L

[b3h3m0th666]

you mean liver enzyme test right? If it was for alanine transaminase or

aspartate transaminase enzyme (im guessing it was one of these) that is higher than normal yes, but not high enough for real concern. High levels are in the hundreds or thousands of IU/L

Erm... I guess?

I hit doc up and said I had done a cycle and blah blah can you do a check for me. Came back with these results. He said he wants me to come back in a few weeks to get a hep test done 0.o

Will take milk thistle or whatever it's called and hopefully that will help out...

Guessing he just wants to be safe that sorry?

[hhhh1]

did it say 'ALT' or 'AST' on the piece of paper or did the useles c*nt not give you your actual results?

[b3h3m0th666]

did it say 'ALT' or 'AST' on the piece of paper or did the useles c*nt not give you your actual results?

He called me. I did have a form which If handed to the nurse, but I paid no attention.

[Riccardo]

It will be either ALT or AST, its nothing to worry about, I wouldn't bother with the second blood test. If it is AST it can even be elevated due to heavy weight training.

[bulking4ever]

After running a heavy cycle of 1gr Sust250/week plus 40mg Dbol/week and finishing with 6 weeks Winstrol 100mg/eod one of these enzymes, can't remember exactly which one, was 356 and the normal range should be max 50 something. Althouhg I was scared as f*ck the doctor didn't seem so concerned. Had a liver scan done and aparently it was alright. Took heaps of liver detox stuff. Need to go for another exam anytime soon.

[Hone]

Good to see guys getting blood tests etc, well worth the cost if it can stop problems surfacing a few years from now.

On the subject of compounds that protect or detox the liver well that is a matter of opinion of whether they work or not. In fact there is also a school of thought that the liver is already having to cope say with an ASS and then you add in say milk thistle so the liver ends up having to work even harder to process not one compound but two.

I invite anyone reading this to produce any clinical study that shows milk thistle, liver 52 etc to acutally assist or detox the liver.

Drink plently of water and keep cycles to a sensible amount and length is the key IMO.

[musclenz]

Good to see guys getting blood tests etc, well worth the cost if it can stop problems surfacing a few years from now.

On the subject of compounds that protect or detox the liver well that is a matter of opinion of whether they work or not. In fact there is also a school of thought that the liver is already having to cope say with an ASS and then you add in say milk thistle so the liver ends up having to work even harder to process not one compound but two.

I invite anyone reading this to produce any clinical study that shows milk thistle, liver 52 etc to acutally assist or detox the liver.

Drink plently of water and keep cycles to a sensible amount and length is the key IMO.

For those Gym Rats amongst us :grin:

The effects of milk thistle on hepatic fibrosis due to methotrexate in rat.Ghaffari AR, Noshad H, Ostadi A, Ghojazadeh M, Asadi P.

SourceDepartment of Internal Medicine, Sina hospital, Tabriz University of Medical Sciences, Liver and Gastrointestinal Research Center, Tabriz, IR Iran.

Abstract

BACKGROUND: Extracts of milk thistle (MT), Silybum marianum, have been used as medical remedies since the time of ancient Greece. Methotrexate is a potentially hepatotxic drug.

OBJECTIVES: To clarify the hepatoprotective effects of MT on methotrexate.

MATERIALS AND METHODS: From January 2010 to April 2010, 30 male rats were recruited into three 10-rat subgroups in Tabriz University of Medical Sciences. Normal saline was injected intraperitoneally in the first group (A; the controls); intraperitoneal methotrexate plus oral MT extract were administered to the second group (B) and intraperitoneal methotrexate alone was given to the third group ©. Pre- and post-interventional measuring of serum parameters were carried out every 15 days. After six weeks, the rats were decapitated and histopathological evaluation of liver was done.

RESULTS: Serum liver enzymes (AST, ALT), alkaline phosphatase, total and direct bilirubin, creatinine and BUN were measured on days 0, 15, 30, 45. They were significantly higher in the group C, comparing with other two groups. Serum albumin was the least in group C animals as well. There were no significant differences between groups A and B. The mean±SD fibrosis score using semi-quantitative scoring system (SSS) was 1.25±0.46, 1.40±0.52 and 6.70±0.82, in groups A, B and C, respectively (p<0.001).

CONCLUSIONS: MT extract can effectively prevent methotrexate-induced liver dysfunction and fibrosis in rats.

[olympia]

Good to see guys getting blood tests etc, well worth the cost if it can stop problems surfacing a few years from now.

On the subject of compounds that protect or detox the liver well that is a matter of opinion of whether they work or not. In fact there is also a school of thought that the liver is already having to cope say with an ASS and then you add in say milk thistle so the liver ends up having to work even harder to process not one compound but two.

I invite anyone reading this to produce any clinical study that shows milk thistle, liver 52 etc to acutally assist or detox the liver.

Drink plently of water and keep cycles to a sensible amount and length is the key IMO.

For those Gym Rats amongst us :grin:

The effects of milk thistle on hepatic fibrosis due to methotrexate in rat.Ghaffari AR, Noshad H, Ostadi A, Ghojazadeh M, Asadi P.

SourceDepartment of Internal Medicine, Sina hospital, Tabriz University of Medical Sciences, Liver and Gastrointestinal Research Center, Tabriz, IR Iran.

Abstract

BACKGROUND: Extracts of milk thistle (MT), Silybum marianum, have been used as medical remedies since the time of ancient Greece. Methotrexate is a potentially hepatotxic drug.

OBJECTIVES: To clarify the hepatoprotective effects of MT on methotrexate.

MATERIALS AND METHODS: From January 2010 to April 2010, 30 male rats were recruited into three 10-rat subgroups in Tabriz University of Medical Sciences. Normal saline was injected intraperitoneally in the first group (A; the controls); intraperitoneal methotrexate plus oral MT extract were administered to the second group (B) and intraperitoneal methotrexate alone was given to the third group ©. Pre- and post-interventional measuring of serum parameters were carried out every 15 days. After six weeks, the rats were decapitated and histopathological evaluation of liver was done.

RESULTS: Serum liver enzymes (AST, ALT), alkaline phosphatase, total and direct bilirubin, creatinine and BUN were measured on days 0, 15, 30, 45. They were significantly higher in the group C, comparing with other two groups. Serum albumin was the least in group C animals as well. There were no significant differences between groups A and B. The mean±SD fibrosis score using semi-quantitative scoring system (SSS) was 1.25±0.46, 1.40±0.52 and 6.70±0.82, in groups A, B and C, respectively (p<0.001).

CONCLUSIONS: MT extract can effectively prevent methotrexate-induced liver dysfunction and fibrosis in rats.

Woah woah woah english please. Are you saying milk thistle is good?

[b3h3m0th666]

Yes please dumb down for the ones who don't understand ...

[Hone]

Good to see guys getting blood tests etc, well worth the cost if it can stop problems surfacing a few years from now.

On the subject of compounds that protect or detox the liver well that is a matter of opinion of whether they work or not. In fact there is also a school of thought that the liver is already having to cope say with an ASS and then you add in say milk thistle so the liver ends up having to work even harder to process not one compound but two.

I invite anyone reading this to produce any clinical study that shows milk thistle, liver 52 etc to acutally assist or detox the liver.

Drink plently of water and keep cycles to a sensible amount and length is the key IMO.

For those Gym Rats amongst us :grin:

The effects of milk thistle on hepatic fibrosis due to methotrexate in rat.Ghaffari AR, Noshad H, Ostadi A, Ghojazadeh M, Asadi P.

SourceDepartment of Internal Medicine, Sina hospital, Tabriz University of Medical Sciences, Liver and Gastrointestinal Research Center, Tabriz, IR Iran.

Abstract

BACKGROUND: Extracts of milk thistle (MT), Silybum marianum, have been used as medical remedies since the time of ancient Greece. Methotrexate is a potentially hepatotxic drug.

OBJECTIVES: To clarify the hepatoprotective effects of MT on methotrexate.

MATERIALS AND METHODS: From January 2010 to April 2010, 30 male rats were recruited into three 10-rat subgroups in Tabriz University of Medical Sciences. Normal saline was injected intraperitoneally in the first group (A; the controls); intraperitoneal methotrexate plus oral MT extract were administered to the second group (B) and intraperitoneal methotrexate alone was given to the third group ©. Pre- and post-interventional measuring of serum parameters were carried out every 15 days. After six weeks, the rats were decapitated and histopathological evaluation of liver was done.

RESULTS: Serum liver enzymes (AST, ALT), alkaline phosphatase, total and direct bilirubin, creatinine and BUN were measured on days 0, 15, 30, 45. They were significantly higher in the group C, comparing with other two groups. Serum albumin was the least in group C animals as well. There were no significant differences between groups A and B. The mean±SD fibrosis score using semi-quantitative scoring system (SSS) was 1.25±0.46, 1.40±0.52 and 6.70±0.82, in groups A, B and C, respectively (p<0.001).

CONCLUSIONS: MT extract can effectively prevent methotrexate-induced liver dysfunction and fibrosis in rats.

Gym rats!!, outstanding :grin: :grin: kudos to you Rod. Bet the rats were not keen on the decapitation part

[Hone]

Good to see guys getting blood tests etc, well worth the cost if it can stop problems surfacing a few years from now.

On the subject of compounds that protect or detox the liver well that is a matter of opinion of whether they work or not. In fact there is also a school of thought that the liver is already having to cope say with an ASS and then you add in say milk thistle so the liver ends up having to work even harder to process not one compound but two.

I invite anyone reading this to produce any clinical study that shows milk thistle, liver 52 etc to acutally assist or detox the liver.

Drink plently of water and keep cycles to a sensible amount and length is the key IMO.

For those Gym Rats amongst us :grin:

The effects of milk thistle on hepatic fibrosis due to methotrexate in rat.Ghaffari AR, Noshad H, Ostadi A, Ghojazadeh M, Asadi P.

SourceDepartment of Internal Medicine, Sina hospital, Tabriz University of Medical Sciences, Liver and Gastrointestinal Research Center, Tabriz, IR Iran.

Abstract

BACKGROUND: Extracts of milk thistle (MT), Silybum marianum, have been used as medical remedies since the time of ancient Greece. Methotrexate is a potentially hepatotxic drug.

OBJECTIVES: To clarify the hepatoprotective effects of MT on methotrexate.

MATERIALS AND METHODS: From January 2010 to April 2010, 30 male rats were recruited into three 10-rat subgroups in Tabriz University of Medical Sciences. Normal saline was injected intraperitoneally in the first group (A; the controls); intraperitoneal methotrexate plus oral MT extract were administered to the second group (B) and intraperitoneal methotrexate alone was given to the third group ©. Pre- and post-interventional measuring of serum parameters were carried out every 15 days. After six weeks, the rats were decapitated and histopathological evaluation of liver was done.

RESULTS: Serum liver enzymes (AST, ALT), alkaline phosphatase, total and direct bilirubin, creatinine and BUN were measured on days 0, 15, 30, 45. They were significantly higher in the group C, comparing with other two groups. Serum albumin was the least in group C animals as well. There were no significant differences between groups A and B. The mean±SD fibrosis score using semi-quantitative scoring system (SSS) was 1.25±0.46, 1.40±0.52 and 6.70±0.82, in groups A, B and C, respectively (p<0.001).

CONCLUSIONS: MT extract can effectively prevent methotrexate-induced liver dysfunction and fibrosis in rats.

Woah woah woah english please. Are you saying milk thistle is good?

Yes milk thistle is good for rats

[musclenz]

Good to see guys getting blood tests etc, well worth the cost if it can stop problems surfacing a few years from now.

On the subject of compounds that protect or detox the liver well that is a matter of opinion of whether they work or not. In fact there is also a school of thought that the liver is already having to cope say with an ASS and then you add in say milk thistle so the liver ends up having to work even harder to process not one compound but two.

I invite anyone reading this to produce any clinical study that shows milk thistle, liver 52 etc to acutally assist or detox the liver.

Drink plently of water and keep cycles to a sensible amount and length is the key IMO.

For those Gym Rats amongst us :grin:

The effects of milk thistle on hepatic fibrosis due to methotrexate in rat.Ghaffari AR, Noshad H, Ostadi A, Ghojazadeh M, Asadi P.

SourceDepartment of Internal Medicine, Sina hospital, Tabriz University of Medical Sciences, Liver and Gastrointestinal Research Center, Tabriz, IR Iran.

Abstract

BACKGROUND: Extracts of milk thistle (MT), Silybum marianum, have been used as medical remedies since the time of ancient Greece. Methotrexate is a potentially hepatotxic drug.

OBJECTIVES: To clarify the hepatoprotective effects of MT on methotrexate.

MATERIALS AND METHODS: From January 2010 to April 2010, 30 male rats were recruited into three 10-rat subgroups in Tabriz University of Medical Sciences. Normal saline was injected intraperitoneally in the first group (A; the controls); intraperitoneal methotrexate plus oral MT extract were administered to the second group (B) and intraperitoneal methotrexate alone was given to the third group ©. Pre- and post-interventional measuring of serum parameters were carried out every 15 days. After six weeks, the rats were decapitated and histopathological evaluation of liver was done.

RESULTS: Serum liver enzymes (AST, ALT), alkaline phosphatase, total and direct bilirubin, creatinine and BUN were measured on days 0, 15, 30, 45. They were significantly higher in the group C, comparing with other two groups. Serum albumin was the least in group C animals as well. There were no significant differences between groups A and B. The mean±SD fibrosis score using semi-quantitative scoring system (SSS) was 1.25±0.46, 1.40±0.52 and 6.70±0.82, in groups A, B and C, respectively (p<0.001).

CONCLUSIONS: MT extract can effectively prevent methotrexate-induced liver dysfunction and fibrosis in rats.

Woah woah woah english please. Are you saying milk thistle is good?

As Hone has said there are Very few clinical studies done to support the fact that Milk Thistle detoxes the liver effectively. However, its been used for centuraries to promote good liver health & as BBers we have used it to support liver function when using gear particularly, oral steroids. Here is a Rat Study that uses a compound that is used medically to treat cancer patients in chemotheraphy (& we know how that stuff is toxic to the body) amongst other treatments, where in Group B the rats were given oral Milk Thistle together with the Methotrexate & they came out looking much better in a post mortum evalulation than the group that wwere given only the Methotrexate. So it was concluded that liver dysfunction as reduced by using MT. Not a human study but then there are definately a few Dirty Rats in our midst

[Grover]

:nod:

Agree with Hone though re drinking lots of water