creating back width

[Monarchking]

Hey people. One thing I've noticed about my progress and what pissises me off the most is my back width. (among other things )

I train back once a week, and deadlifts, bb rows, pullups and pull downs are my 4 main exercises, and I usaly mix the order of them up along with rep range now and then for 45-50minuets a sesh.

Looking to other members for a couple of 'back blaster routines' or exercises that have helped you turn your shitty lats into mega wings.

Looking through my progress they are improving, but not at the rate I would like, maybe just give it more time?

cheer

[HarryB]

Hey man.. back is definitely one of the things I struggle most with in terms of development. I have found just making sure my form is good and doing lots of thickness movements has been the key for me. Just gave me a bit more muscle to spread. I do pulldown and chins and also db pullovers to stretch your lats out. It's a time thing, back is one of the largest areas of your body and can handle such an immense workload, you just got to hammer at it week in and week out.

[Monarchking]

Hey man.. back is definitely one of the things I struggle most with in terms of development. I have found just making sure my form is good and doing lots of thickness movements has been the key for me. Just gave me a bit more muscle to spread. I do pulldown and chins and also db pullovers to stretch your lats out. It's a time thing, back is one of the largest areas of your body and can handle such an immense workload, you just got to hammer at it week in and week out.

thanks, your proli right, just give it some more time. I haven't done many pullovers b4, but could incorporate them into my routine to stretch them out from a different angle.

[HarryB]

I like them to pre exhaust my lats a little bit before I do a thickness movement. That way when I get into the rows I can feel every rep. That's the hardest thing with developing a back is finding that connection so you can feel every rep working the muscle. For the most part we either are too lose and it's just momentum moving the weight or we try and be too strict and the arms do most of the work. It's a hard balance to find.

[steak]

...try some double contraction pulldowns and paused pulldowns

[thatwaslight]

Ask kelly slater! Lol jks..

I'm not really qualified bro but I have put alot of size on my back over the years and this is my 2 cents:

IMO if you want width you can't go past chins and pulldowns, but like alot of exercises you really have to focus on targeting them with the movement.

For me this means pulling in a vertical line from top to bottom really squeezing the lats, not pulling and leaning away from the bar (keep it close to your lips) and focus on your arms being Like hooks to pull with your back rather than using your arms if you get me, I'm sure some may disagree with some of this but has worked for me

[mike27]

chin ups weighted wide grip

wide grip lat pull down

as said above 'technique and form'

maybe try dropping the weight and really concentrate on the form?

mind and muscle connection too

[PeterDolan]

Wide grips wont do a lot. Close grip chins will work a treat but as the age old adage goes, "row to grow"

[mike27]

yeah

bent over bb row

1 arm db row on a bench

[Jigga]

Wide grips wont do a lot. Close grip chins will work a treat but as the age old adage goes, "row to grow"

How can you claim wide-grip doesn't work when you are only capable of using close-grip?

[Monarchking]

might try a db pull over to pre fatigue the muscle then hit the BB row

[HarryB]

Or superset straight arm pulldowns and bb rows, that's hectic!

[Monarchking]

Or superset straight arm pulldowns and bb rows, that's hectic!

great idea!

[Optimass]

The structure of your back generally doesn't change - some guys have lats that are higher and wider others insert down low. The only variable thats open to change is thickness which you develop over time.

It's a big muscle group so can handle a lot of shit trown at it. It's worth puttng a full hour into the session - and always train heavy. Narrow and wide grip is good for a mental change but you are engaging essentially the same muscle either way.

Somethng I prefer to focus on is the contraction. Most guys don't extend the arm out in full and roll out the shoulder at the top of a lat pulldown for example. I do this on all back movements and hold for a second and then excentuate the contraction at the end of the concentric phase, again pausing if only 1/2 second to make sure I can't get any more range of motion. I try and get my scapular to touch in the middle of my back which involves stretching the shoulders back at the same time. If mentally you are focusing on your arms during the movement you'll get a nice pump there - tend to shorten your ROM and not quite completely exhaust your back before your arms cave in.

Most guys will swear wide/narrow/supine/pronated variations wil net a different result but ultimately its great form and control, intensity through resistance and stretch.

[Jigga]

Jerry Collins knocked this dude out otp and said after he can hit real hard cause he does heaps of wide-grip chins

[musclenz]

The structure of your back generally doesn't change - some guys have lats that are higher and wider others insert down low. The only variable thats open to change is thickness which you develop over time.

It's a big muscle group so can handle a lot of shit trown at it. It's worth puttng a full hour into the session - and always train heavy. Narrow and wide grip is good for a mental change but you are engaging essentially the same muscle either way.

Somethng I prefer to focus on is the contraction. Most guys don't extend the arm out in full and roll out the shoulder at the top of a lat pulldown for example. I do this on all back movements and hold for a second and then excentuate the contraction at the end of the concentric phase, again pausing if only 1/2 second to make sure I can't get any more range of motion. I try and get my scapular to touch in the middle of my back which involves stretching the shoulders back at the same time. If mentally you are focusing on your arms during the movement you'll get a nice pump there - tend to shorten your ROM and not quite completely exhaust your back before your arms cave in.

Most guys will swear wide/narrow/supine/pronated variations wil net a different result but ultimately its great form and control, intensity through resistance and stretch.

I agree Opti with this comment. I think far too many people I see sacrifice form in back movements for weight. We have all seen the guy doing lat pulls or seated rows with the whole stack & almost bending back parallel to the floor to get it up. Total waste of time IMO. Lower the weight in half or less stay upright & target the rhomboids, Terres major/ minor, Infraspinatus & lats to really put V width on. Train your traps because they are a big component in back muscle. Do DL's & BB rows for lower & middle back. Its not a bad idea also to just train lats every few wks on back day. Just hammer them with rows, DB one arms, pulls, pullovers & lat machine.

[PeterDolan]

Wide grips wont do a lot. Close grip chins will work a treat but as the age old adage goes, "row to grow"

How can you claim wide-grip doesn't work when you are only capable of using close-grip?

I never said they didn't work

[Android]

Back width limited but even skinny clavicles can produce an adequate back. If you take the insertion point and build up muscle around that and below it then your back will look nice and wide. Add big rear delts to that and it's even wider.

Wide grip pulldowns with a vertical pull downwards only and NOT heavy have worked for me. Every workout I remind myself not to use arms and this is near impossible with a heavy weight. Pulldowns leaning back are great btw, but not for a wide back.

Chinups only if u r a light person, else can't do them without using arms, too heavy.

Oh and rows, rows, rows

Finally, once u obtain a v-taper take a photo and compare it next to someone like Nassar and see what's next to make the back freaky awesome. It's a humbling thing to see :-/

[Monarchking]

hey thanks guys. Just had a fucken wicked back sesh. Took your advice and

1) did some pre exsuast, 2) went a bit lighter on the row and full squeezed super hard, 3) went a bit lighter on the puldown and squeezed n controlled the shit out of the muscles/weight. and yea, was really good.

Basicly just reminded myself not to get carried away with numbers.

And focus hardcore on contracting the f*ck out of those bad boys.

Peace

[langerrox]

Yup, dont be afraid to drop a few plates on bent over rows and T bar rows, too often i see people load up the bar and use nothing but their legs and then momentum to get the bar up, its alright to do a few cheats reps to really squeeze them out at the end of a set but try stay strict. And id have to say wide grip chins to absolute failure if you want some bat wings

[soundsgood]

Surprised no one has mentioned rack pulls yet.

Just started adding these into back days last couple of months and the low rep, heavy sets have shocked my lats into growing!

[Chemo]

Yeah broooo!

I started doing rack pulls like 4 months ago, think someone on NZBB mentioned it and I ran with it. Got awesome development round the upper back! Feels awesome moving big weight too!

Gotta agree with TWL too, the more I train the more I learn that the mind muscle connection actually means something. Especially for the back, my pulldowns when i started were basically bicep exercises lol. Pull the shoulder blades together, drop the shoulders down before bringing the bar down focusing on that muscle contracting first and holding the shoulders in the same place. Way different feeling.

One think I've noticed from myself and my training (I have no width (yet)) is training the rear and medial delts makes you look quite a bit different. As i said I have generally been quite narrow, and really only been into the weights for the last 2-3 years. When I pull my shoulders down and back, I actually have a little width nowdays, and a peak on the shoulders. It definitely adds to the illusion of being bigger/wider.

[thatwaslight]

Surprised no one has mentioned rack pulls yet.

Just started adding these into back days last couple of months and the low rep, heavy sets have shocked my lats into growing!

This 8)

[Sifo-Dyas]

Back width was an issue for me 7 years ago. No problem with strength just lacked width. Optimass hit the nail on the head. Focused on form and isolation. and finished with heave az T-bar row oldskool and heavy pullovers. My back is now actually a strength and I never thought that would ever happen :shock:

[Optimass]

Rack pulls are so yesterday :roll: