Help with diet!

[Phantomb]

I've just decided to change my breakfast meal from Toasted muesli and tinned peaches, to eggs (1 whole + 3 whites) and toast.

So I thought I'd work out a whole day's stats for what I'm currently doing and add in the eggs now.

Here's how it ended up.

Breakfast

4 eggs

2 slices toast

coffee.

P: 29g

C: 44g

F: 5g

Cal: 364

Morning

Protein Shake (Powder, oats, milk, dash of choc flavour)

P: 44

C: 35

F: 3

Cal: 430

Lunch

Chicken Breast (250 -300g)

White Rice (3/4 cup)

Veges (225g)

P: 75

C: 70

F: 10

Cal: 842

Afternoon

Rump Steak (250 - 300g)

2 slices bread

P: 85

C: 34

F: 20

Cal: 770

Workout

Protein Shake (Powder, oats, milk, dash of choc flavour)

P: 44

C: 35

F: 3

Cal: 430

Total for the day (BEFORE DINNER?!?)

P: 272g

C: 218g

F: 39g

Cal: 2836

On my workout days I do a pre-breakfast HIIT cardio.

The morning and afternoon may be interchanged depending on my timetable/how hungry I am.

I still have to add on my flatmates dinner.

At the moment I'm 89.0kg at 24%BF.

Am I going to lose any fat at all on this diet?

I'm keen to put on some muscle, but I'd rather not add to my 24%....

[Pseudonym]

That looks pretty good to me. It's hard to say how a diet will affect you, since we can't know what your metabolism's like, but that looks like a good starting point. See what happens with it, then tweak as necessary.

Let us know how you get on!

[Marcus]

I agree. It's a good starting point & you have set yourself a benchmark now. Stick to it for 4-6weeks & see how it goes.

How many days cardio & weight training?

[Phantomb]

I have a workout journal, but in a nutshell it's Mon, Tue, Thu, Fri.

HIIT before breakfast and workout late afternoon.

[Marcus]

Well in that case I'd say you're definitely on the right track. Keep training heavy at the weights too.

[Paul]

I was at avery similar weight and body fat% .IMO calories are to high if you want to lose fat you have to run at a deficet. I know its hard to lose fat and gain muscle .Howver initially you have to make a choice.I would rip some fat off which wouldnt be hard reducing cals would acheive this.I aimed for around 2500 cals a day I have a reasonably average metabolisim howver so possibly you could go a little higher.I am assuming your not digging trenches all day.And your of average size.

[Wynton]

I would do your HIIT on non workout days. HIIT makes your body work damn hard. If your also training hard in the afternoon you may find that overtraining could set in. Just my opinion though.

What's your training experience like?

[Flex]

First thing - your calculator is seriously broken because your calorie totals are way off.

Breakfast

4 eggs

2 slices toast

coffee.

P: 29g x4

C: 44g x4

F: 5g x9

Cal: 337

Morning

Protein Shake (Powder, oats, milk, dash of choc flavour)

P: 44 x4

C: 35 x4

F: 3 x9

Cal: 343

Lunch

Chicken Breast (250 -300g)

White Rice (3/4 cup)

Veges (225g)

P: 75 x4

C: 70 x4

F: 10 x9

Cal: 670

Afternoon

Rump Steak (250 - 300g)

2 slices bread

P: 85 x4

C: 34 x4

F: 20 x9

Cal: 656

Workout

Protein Shake (Powder, oats, milk, dash of choc flavour)

P: 44 x4

C: 35 x4

F: 3 x9

Cal: 343

Total for the day (BEFORE DINNER?!?)

P: 277g (4 cals per g)

C: 218g (4 cals per g)

F: 41g (9 cals per g)

Cal: 2349 - not 2836

Secondly 300g of steak might be a little bit much for one serve and is pretty high in saturated fats - your probably looking at around 30g of fat in that much rump steak.

Drop the saturated (animal) fats and add some decent essential fats to your diet - olive oil, flaxseed oil, nuts, seeds, avocado etc.

I'm not too sure where the breakdowns (P/C/F) for your food came from but if they are correct your fat intake is too low - you should aim for around 20% - 30% fat (20% fat calories would be 52g of fat at your current calorie level of 2346 ) from mainly essential (unsaturated) fats, and small amount of saturated fat . I assume all of these are uncooked values - 300g chicken, 3/4 cup of rice etc

If your dinner is anything like your other wholefood meals, and if your macronutrient breakdowns are correct your current macro breakdown is

47% protein

37% carbs

16% fat

You could get away with a lot less protein . You are at over 3g per kilo/day at the moment. You could easily drop it back to 2g/kilo by reducing the volume of steak/chicken, or reducing the size of your protein shakes. Add some more fats in and a little more carbs to balance it out a bit more.

[Marcus]

I don't agree there Flex. I think dropping the protein would be detrimental to the muscle gains he's wanting.

I would keep protein high & fiddle round with your carbs & fats until you find what works for you best.

[Phantomb]

I would do your HIIT on non workout days. HIIT makes your body work damn hard. If your also training hard in the afternoon you may find that overtraining could set in. Just my opinion though.

What's your training experience like?

Overtraining?

The HIIT is 4 mins warm-up, 4 mins workout, 4 mins cool-down.

Add that to my afternoon programme and I'm not even in the gym for an hour. 4 hours a week with 3 rest days is not overtraining in my book.

P = 4 cal per g

C = 4 cal per g

F = 9 cal per g.

OK....is this a universal standard?

My calorie counting was largely off packaging plus some off the net.

eg. The rice serving I have was straight off the packet. With your calculations it adds up to 211cal. On the packet it was 219cal....

Hmmm I think I may have miscalculated the kilojoules to calories conversion. I was dividing by 4 instead of 4.2.

But having said that the above still doesn't add up.

Secondly 300g of steak might be a little bit much for one serve and is pretty high in saturated fats - your probably looking at around 30g of fat in that much rump steak.

The steak I buy is pretty cheap stuff and again I went off a mixture of the packaging versus info off the net.

At this very moment I have marinated porterhouse in front of me. Two pieces, each a bit smaller than the size of my hand, 330g by weight.

If I go by the Pak'n'Save info, each steak will give me

P: 14.4/100g

C: 7.5/100g

F: 4.2/100g (saturated 1.1g)

The King Steak Farmlands info is much the same but with only 1.5g carbs.

Overall I'd say the calories are somewhere between my estiomate and yours Flex. Maybe 2500-2600. I take Omega3 supplements and I'd definitely get fats from dinner.

[Wynton]

Overtraining?

The HIIT is 4 mins warm-up, 4 mins workout, 4 mins cool-down.

Add that to my afternoon programme and I'm not even in the gym for an hour. 4 hours a week with 3 rest days is not overtraining in my book.

Well previously you didn't state how long you were doing it for. I thought it would be for 20-30 mins workout like most HIIT programs that I know of. HIIT is aerobic as well as anaerobic exercise the same as weight training. Therefore it works the muscular system very hard. Meaning that you are doing 2 muscular workouts a day which could lead to overtraining especially if you're on a calorie reduced diet. But if you're only doing it for 4 mins then you probaly won't have a problem.

[Flex]

Normally up to 3g may not be too much to recommend but having 280g of protein per day at 24% bodyfat/89kg is over 4 times your lean mass of 67kg - and that was excluding dinner. I think you would benefit by dropping your protein intake a bit as you just don't need that much. If you were a bit leaner - say 10-12% at 90kg then you could eat a bit more per kilo, but not at 24% bf. Excess protein will still be stored as bodyfat. It may be the last thing to be stored and may take more calories to digest, but if you eat too much protein you will still get fat.

As far as the calorie counts - yes 4/4/9 is universal. Unfortunately labels seem to have a certain amount of error so can't be relied on to be all that exact. However they probably won't be more than maybe 10 or 20 cals out, which at the end of the day isn't a big deal.

[Phantomb]

Overtraining?

The HIIT is 4 mins warm-up, 4 mins workout, 4 mins cool-down.

Add that to my afternoon programme and I'm not even in the gym for an hour. 4 hours a week with 3 rest days is not overtraining in my book.

Well previously you didn't state how long you were doing it for. I thought it would be for 20-30 mins workout like most HIIT programs that I know of. HIIT is aerobic as well as anaerobic exercise the same as weight training. Therefore it works the muscular system very hard. Meaning that you are doing 2 muscular workouts a day which could lead to overtraining especially if you're on a calorie reduced diet. But if you're only doing it for 4 mins then you probaly won't have a problem.

Fair enough.

My HIIT routine is done on a stationary cycle.

Once I hit the 4 min mark it's 20 sec sprints, 10 seconds casual etc. until

8 min rolls around. Then cool-down until 12minutes. It's a killer on the lungs....and the butt :-)

[Varven]

DUDE, either me or you have got our nutrition count seriously messed up.

First and foremost:

eggs have a total of 6g of protein in them ( whole eggss- from a chicken mind you ).

half of that protein is in the yellow.

So, for breakfast, 1 whole egg and 3 whites gives you about

18g protein.

Secondly 250 - 300 chicken, is that the weight before or after cooking.

Because after cooking 300g of chicken, there is considerable weight difference.

Now the amount of protein in it from memory is 7 - 8g of protein per 50g of COOKED chicken.

so say 250g cooked chicken should have 40g protein , NOT 75g protein.

[Phantomb]

DUDE, either me or you have got our nutrition count seriously messed up.

First and foremost:

eggs have a total of 6g of protein in them ( whole eggss- from a chicken mind you ).

half of that protein is in the yellow.

So, for breakfast, 1 whole egg and 3 whites gives you about

18g protein.

I had 3 eggwhites at 4g protein

http://www.nutritiondata.com/facts-B00001-01c201o.html

PLUS 2 slices of Freyas Soy and Linseed at 5.1g protein each....

Secondly 250 - 300 chicken, is that the weight before or after cooking.

Because after cooking 300g of chicken, there is considerable weight difference.

Now the amount of protein in it from memory is 7 - 8g of protein per 50g of COOKED chicken.

so say 250g cooked chicken should have 40g protein , NOT 75g protein.

So planning chicken at say, 25g/100g is totally false?

Surely the weight loss would be fluid in the form of water and fat, hence meat is always dryer when cooked?

Or is it the same for cooked red meat as well....

I'm a little confused.

*does some Web searching"

Found one source that claims 45-80% of protein is destroyed with cooking.

Many others say protein is "denatured" by cooking ie. is useless.

If that is the case then it would seem that the majority of my nutritional data is wrongly based on raw foods.

There's an interesting anti-protein page here..

http://www.collusion.org/Article.cfm?ID=328

[Varven]

Theyre quite a few of those web based calorie counters around. Enter in what you eat and they calculate macro totals as well as calorie totals. Cant remember the site url, but i know a few ppl here use it..

[Wynton]

http://www.phlex.co.nz

Is a great site for your calorie calculation needs. It lists the macronutrients for virtually any food you can think of.

Look under the nutrition section

[Phantomb]

www.phlex.co.nz

Is a great site for your calorie calculation needs. It lists the macronutrients for virtually any food you can think of.

Look under the nutrition section

They've just copied the info from the site I mentioned earlier

http://www.nutritiondata.com

Pretty ridiculous. A NZ site having data for "Egg, white, dried, flakes, glucose reduced"?

Is there even such a product in New Zealand?

[lazyone]

Overtraining?

The HIIT is 4 mins warm-up, 4 mins workout, 4 mins cool-down.

Add that to my afternoon programme and I'm not even in the gym for an hour. 4 hours a week with 3 rest days is not overtraining in my book.

Well previously you didn't state how long you were doing it for. I thought it would be for 20-30 mins workout like most HIIT programs that I know of. HIIT is aerobic as well as anaerobic exercise the same as weight training. Therefore it works the muscular system very hard. Meaning that you are doing 2 muscular workouts a day which could lead to overtraining especially if you're on a calorie reduced diet. But if you're only doing it for 4 mins then you probaly won't have a problem.

???

HIIT is f'n HARD. How do you do your HIIT in 12 mins??

EDIT: I just saw your post on how you do HIIT (had a minties moment there sorry). I also do my HIIT on the stationary bike or sprints outside on the track:

5 mins warmup

20 secs: sprint (all out)

40 secs: rest/recovery

repeat, repeat, repeat... 12-15 intervals.

5-10 mins cooldown

** Or 30secs/60secs intervals.

This takes about 20-25mins

After this I usually wanna vomit. You treat HIIT as you would a weight training, and hence - EAT something before doing it.

Saweet.

[lazyone]

First thing - your calculator is seriously broken because your calorie totals are way off.

Breakfast

4 eggs

2 slices toast

coffee.

P: 29g x4

C: 44g x4

F: 5g x9

Cal: 337

Morning

Protein Shake (Powder, oats, milk, dash of choc flavour)

P: 44 x4

C: 35 x4

F: 3 x9

Cal: 343

Lunch

Chicken Breast (250 -300g)

White Rice (3/4 cup)

Veges (225g)

P: 75 x4

C: 70 x4

F: 10 x9

Cal: 670

Afternoon

Rump Steak (250 - 300g)

2 slices bread

P: 85 x4

C: 34 x4

F: 20 x9

Cal: 656

Workout

Protein Shake (Powder, oats, milk, dash of choc flavour)

P: 44 x4

C: 35 x4

F: 3 x9

Cal: 343

Total for the day (BEFORE DINNER?!?)

P: 277g (4 cals per g)

C: 218g (4 cals per g)

F: 41g (9 cals per g)

Cal: 2349 - not 2836

Secondly 300g of steak might be a little bit much for one serve and is pretty high in saturated fats - your probably looking at around 30g of fat in that much rump steak.

Drop the saturated (animal) fats and add some decent essential fats to your diet - olive oil, flaxseed oil, nuts, seeds, avocado etc.

I'm not too sure where the breakdowns (P/C/F) for your food came from but if they are correct your fat intake is too low - you should aim for around 20% - 30% fat (20% fat calories would be 52g of fat at your current calorie level of 2346 ) from mainly essential (unsaturated) fats, and small amount of saturated fat . I assume all of these are uncooked values - 300g chicken, 3/4 cup of rice etc

If your dinner is anything like your other wholefood meals, and if your macronutrient breakdowns are correct your current macro breakdown is

47% protein

37% carbs

16% fat

You could get away with a lot less protein . You are at over 3g per kilo/day at the moment. You could easily drop it back to 2g/kilo by reducing the volume of steak/chicken, or reducing the size of your protein shakes. Add some more fats in and a little more carbs to balance it out a bit more.

Awesome post.

Definitely need some healthy fats in there... as well as those that Flex mentioned, fish oil tabs are also a great way of getting in some good fats. Theres no advantage in having too much protein... the body will just use the amount it needs and the rest will just end up as bodyfat!

[Phantomb]

???

HIIT is f'n HARD. How do you do your HIIT in 12 mins??

EDIT: I just saw your post on how you do HIIT (had a minties moment there sorry). I also do my HIIT on the stationary bike or sprints outside on the track:

5 mins warmup

20 secs: sprint (all out)

40 secs: rest/recovery

repeat, repeat, repeat... 12-15 intervals.

5-10 mins cooldown

** Or 30secs/60secs intervals.

This takes about 20-25mins

After this I usually wanna vomit. You treat HIIT as you would a weight training, and hence - EAT something before doing it.

Saweet.

I treat HIIT as a fat-burning exercise and hence DON"T eat before it. By doing it first thing in the morning, the only thing my body will burn is fat.

I'm kinda surprised you take 2 times as much rest as you do exercise.

My 20 sec cycle sprints are in the 130's, the final two climb to 150's. I sweat, I cry, I burn. Then I cool-down and limp to the car.

Definitely need some healthy fats in there... as well as those that Flex mentioned, fish oil tabs are also a great way of getting in some good fats

I'll quote myself...

..I take Omega3 supplements and I'd definitely get fats from dinner.

Theres no advantage in having too much protein... the body will just use the amount it needs and the rest will just end up as bodyfat!

If what Varven said "Now the amount of protein in it from memory is 7 - 8g of protein per 50g of COOKED chicken.

so say 250g cooked chicken should have 40g protein , NOT 75g protein." is true then I should be fine with my protein.

[lazyone]

???

HIIT is f'n HARD. How do you do your HIIT in 12 mins??

EDIT: I just saw your post on how you do HIIT (had a minties moment there sorry). I also do my HIIT on the stationary bike or sprints outside on the track:

5 mins warmup

20 secs: sprint (all out)

40 secs: rest/recovery

repeat, repeat, repeat... 12-15 intervals.

5-10 mins cooldown

** Or 30secs/60secs intervals.

This takes about 20-25mins

After this I usually wanna vomit. You treat HIIT as you would a weight training, and hence - EAT something before doing it.

Saweet.

I treat HIIT as a fat-burning exercise and hence DON"T eat before it. By doing it first thing in the morning, the only thing my body will burn is fat.

I'm kinda surprised you take 2 times as much rest as you do exercise.

My 20 sec cycle sprints are in the 130's, the final two climb to 150's. I sweat, I cry, I burn. Then I cool-down and limp to the car.

Definitely need some healthy fats in there... as well as those that Flex mentioned, fish oil tabs are also a great way of getting in some good fats

I'll quote myself...

..I take Omega3 supplements and I'd definitely get fats from dinner.

Theres no advantage in having too much protein... the body will just use the amount it needs and the rest will just end up as bodyfat!

If what Varven said "Now the amount of protein in it from memory is 7 - 8g of protein per 50g of COOKED chicken.

so say 250g cooked chicken should have 40g protein , NOT 75g protein." is true then I should be fine with my protein.

Ok... if it aint broke...

[Delpreet]

ggod effort.... keep goin hard.....

[poos_n_wees]

just a sidenote... HIIT on the bike. VERY taxing on the quads. almost like another leg day even. this might be a bit durrrrr but I had to switch from doing them on the bike to sprints 'cos my quads got too big compared to everything else im just showing off here lol. sprints (teamed wit weight training of course) seemed to even things out more.

Anyway yeah. As you were.

[Phantomb]

Diet comments?

Thumbs up or thumbs down..

Caffeine Pill

Banana

Workout

Protein shake

Breakfast

2 x toast

7 x eggs (5 whites)

coffee

Morning

185g can tuna

400g can baked beans (budget brand, 66% less sugar than watties)

Lunch

300g mixed veg

100g chicken

1 cup oats

1/2 serve of protein

Afternoon

300g mixed veg

100g chicken

1 cup oats

1/2 serve of protein

Tea

100g meat

300g veg

Close

Protein

Flaxseed Oil

On non training day I cut the oats in half and obviously skip the prebreakfast protein/nana