Pre-cycle Blood Work

[xfit]

Hi all.

 

Does anyone have any recommendations when it comes to getting blood tests as a baseline before a cycle?

 

What markers are most crucial to know, and are there any benefits in finding a "friendly" doctor to talk to?

 

Cheers.

[Dreadmouse]

Full Blood Count (FBC)

Androgen count
Estrogen count
Thyroid function t4- t3
Total Cholesterol (including HDL and LDL)
Liver function
Kidney function
Prostate (PSA)
cortisol, RT3, and vitamin D
LH FSH
prolactin

 

If you find a friendly doctor to order all these for you you want have to pay, if you go straight to Labtests and ask for self ordered blood tests these will be pretty expensive ($200+)

[jimmybro1]

Full Blood Count (FBC)

Androgen count

Estrogen count

Thyroid function t4- t3

Total Cholesterol (including HDL and LDL)

Liver function

Kidney function

Prostate (PSA)

cortisol, RT3, and vitamin D

LH FSH

prolactin

 

If you find a friendly doctor to order all these for you you want have to pay, if you go straight to Labtests and ask for self ordered blood tests these will be pretty expensive ($200+)

 

Vitamin D??? 

 

I don't know if I would get all that measured. Probably just Test free and total, E2, cholesterol, LH FSH.

 

Just so when you come off cycle you know how well you have recovered. While on get cholesterol, liver function and E2 tested. Probably no point in getting test tested as will be outside of measurable range >50 (unless bunk). Liver function if running orals and cholesterol in general.

 

I'm probably missing a few things, but I'm sure some one else will fill them in.

 

Also get blood pressure tested regularly, can get a home kit reasonably priced.

 

Maybe test pre cycle, mid cycle and post PCT.

 

I don't think your going to find a friendly doctor that is going to let you get all that tested though... just do it private. If you go on some medication like acctuane they will test your liver function and cholesterol every four weeks or something.     

[Dreadmouse]

 

Full Blood Count (FBC)

Androgen count

Estrogen count

Thyroid function t4- t3

Total Cholesterol (including HDL and LDL)

Liver function

Kidney function

Prostate (PSA)

cortisol, RT3, and vitamin D

LH FSH

prolactin

 

If you find a friendly doctor to order all these for you you want have to pay, if you go straight to Labtests and ask for self ordered blood tests these will be pretty expensive ($200+)

 

Vitamin D??? 

 

I don't know if I would get all that measured. Probably just Test free and total, E2, cholesterol, LH FSH.

 

Just so when you come off cycle you know how well you have recovered. While on get cholesterol, liver function and E2 tested. Probably no point in getting test tested as will be outside of measurable range >50 (unless bunk). Liver function if running orals and cholesterol in general.

 

I'm probably missing a few things, but I'm sure some one else will fill them in.

 

Also get blood pressure tested regularly, can get a home kit reasonably priced.

 

Maybe test pre cycle, mid cycle and post PCT.

 

I don't think your going to find a friendly doctor that is going to let you get all that tested though... just do it private. If you go on some medication like acctuane they will test your liver function and cholesterol every four weeks or something.     

 

 

My Reasoning is that you might as well get everything done before you cycle so you know exactly what your normal levels are. Obviously don't need to get all these tests done every time you get a blood test.

[Kalidane]

By the same reasoning, it is a good idea to have annual checkups and comprehensive bloods too.  It builds a much better picture of what your baseline, or normal, numbers are.  

 

It won't often matter, but a one-off bunch of tests could give wonky numbers.  Maybe you had the flu a week ago, or ran a marathon or blah blah blah.  If it's worth getting a warrant for your car, then I'd say it's an even better idea to do so for your body.  You'll have that for longer.

 

And it's an excuse to graph something...

[xfit]

Ok, had the bloods done. Here are the results:

 

27 Jan 2015, Liver Function Tests

Total Bilirubin:               10 umol/L ( < 25 )

Alk. Phosphatase:              61 U/L ( 40 - 110 )

GGT:                           29 U/L ( < 60 )

ALT:                           19 U/L ( < 45 )

Total Protein:                 73 g/L ( 66 - 84 )

Albumin:                       45 g/L ( 34 - 48 )

Globulin:                      28 g/L ( 25 - 41 )

 

27 Jan 2015, Diabetic Profile

HbA1c:                         34 mmol/mol ( < 41 )

 

 

27 Jan 2015, Renal Function Tests

Sodium:                        140 mmol/L ( 135 - 145 )

Potassium:                     4.3 mmol/L ( 3.5 - 5.2 )

Creatinine:                    102 umol/L ( 60 - 105 )

eGFR:                          86 mL/min/1.73m2 ( > 90 ) 

Comment:                       An eGFR > 60 mL/min/1.73m2 suggests normal kidney function, in the absence of other evidence (e.g. hypertension, albuminuria, haematuria) of kidney damage. It is less reliable in patients with extremes of body weight, muscle disease or severe liver disease.

 

 

27 Jan 2015, Lipid Tests

Fasting status:                Non-fasting

Cholesterol:                   6.4 mmol/L ( < 5.0 ) H

Triglyceride:                  1.3 mmol/L ( < 2.0 )

HDL Cholesterol:               1.52 mmol/L ( > 1.00 )

LDL cholesterol:               4.3 mmol/L ( < 3.4 ) H

Chol/HDL Ratio:                4.2 ( < 4.5 )

Comment:                       For established CVD risk (including diabetes) NZGG optimal levels are Cholesterol < 4.0, LDL < 2.0 and Chol/HDL ratio < 4.0.

Raised cholesterol, consider acquired causes: hypothyroidism, diabetes, nephrotic syndrome, liver disease.

 

27 Jan 2015, Total Psa

Total PSA:                     0.6 ug/L ( 0.0-2.5 )

 

 

27 Jan 2015, Testosterone

Testosterone:                  26.3 nmol/L ( 8.0 - 29.0 )

 

 

27 Jan 2015, Reproductive Hormones

FSH:                           2.3 IU/L ( 2.0 - 12.0 )

LH:                            7.0 IU/L ( 2.0 - 9.0 )

Oestradiol:                    114 pmol/L ( < 161 )

Prolactin:                     265 mIU/L ( 70 - 300 )

 

27 Jan 2015, Cortisol

Serum Cortisol:                659 nmol/L

Comment:                       A serum cortisol higher than 400 nmol/L, in an unstressed person, excludes adrenal insufficiency in the vast majority of cases. If there is clinical concern, contact an endocrinologist.

 Cortisol (Morning Peak) 200 - 700 nmol/L

 

 

27 Jan 2015, Thyroid Function Tests

TSH:                           2.0 mIU/L ( 0.30 - 4.00 )

Comment:                       Consistent with euthyroidism.

 

27 Jan 2015, Complete Blood Count

Haemoglobin:                   163 g/L ( 130 - 175 )

RBC:                           5.36 x10e12/L ( 4.30 - 6.00 )

HCT:                           0.48 L/L ( 0.40 - 0.52 )

MCV:                           89 fL ( 80 - 99 )

MCH:                           30.4 pg ( 27.0 - 33.0 )

Platelets:                     215 x10e9/L ( 150 - 400 )

WBC:                           6.4 x10e9/L ( 4.0 - 11.0 )

Neutrophils:                   2.64 x10e9/L ( 1.90 - 7.50 )

Lymphocytes:                   2.93 x10e9/L ( 1.00 - 4.00 )

Monocytes:                     0.67 x10e9/L ( 0.20 - 1.00 )

Eosinophils:                   0.18 x10e9/L ( < 0.51 )

Basophils:                     0.01 x10e9/L ( 0.00 - 0.20 )

 

 

Thoughts? Safe to proceed with a (first cycle ever) test-e only run?

[maccaz]

you'll need someone more knowledgeable to comment, but at a glance might wanna get that cholesterol in check before starting, also nice natty test level, don't reckon mine is that high..

[Leeroid]

Nice high levels of LH and natty testosterone. What are ur stats? All AAS has a negative effect on lipids so it's best to have ur lipids in normal range at least. Did you fast before getting the bloods drawn? If you took the test after eating then results might be skewed by what you ate.

[xfit]

Nice high levels of LH and natty testosterone. What are ur stats? All AAS has a negative effect on lipids so it's best to have ur lipids in normal range at least. Did you fast before getting the bloods drawn? If you took the test after eating then results might be skewed by what you ate.

 

Thanks for your input -- My stats are nothing impressive, pretty regular at the moment. 28 years, 184cm, 83kg and probably around 17% BF. Been training for a long time with varying degrees of intensity. I'm not massive at the moment but have a decent base to build on I think.

 

I've been on a high-fat low-carb diet for a while which may explain the lipid profiles somewhat. Others on similar diets are seeing the same results but argue that it's the ratios that matter more than the overall amounts (though I don't claim to be an expert by any means so have no real idea whether that's accurate).

 

You're right about eating -- I gave blood after breakfast which is generally always a cup of coffee with MCT oil and butter so this may have affected it somewhat?

[atrollappears]

 

Nice high levels of LH and natty testosterone. What are ur stats? All AAS has a negative effect on lipids so it's best to have ur lipids in normal range at least. Did you fast before getting the bloods drawn? If you took the test after eating then results might be skewed by what you ate.

 

Thanks for your input -- My stats are nothing impressive, pretty regular at the moment. 28 years, 184cm, 83kg and probably around 17% BF. Been training for a long time with varying degrees of intensity. I'm not massive at the moment but have a decent base to build on I think.

 

I've been on a high-fat low-carb diet for a while which may explain the lipid profiles somewhat. Others on similar diets are seeing the same results but argue that it's the ratios that matter more than the overall amounts (though I don't claim to be an expert by any means so have no real idea whether that's accurate).

 

You're right about eating -- I gave blood after breakfast which is generally always a cup of coffee with MCT oil and butter so this may have affected it somewhat?

 

 

Your high fat diet could have influenced blood cholesterol readings, if you are concerned about lowering lipids, you could modify your dietary fat intake and take another test...

Everything else looks fine..!!

[maccaz]

daz wasn't there some studies done that debunked connection between dietary cholesterol and blood cholesterol? or maybe im thinking of something completely different, dunno not my field of expertise

[crazyfacials]

did you do this through your doctor or did you have to pay for it?

[xfit]

daz wasn't there some studies done that debunked connection between dietary cholesterol and blood cholesterol? or maybe im thinking of something completely different, dunno not my field of expertise

 

A bit lengthy, but I found this (and the subsequent parts of the article) very helpful in understanding things.

 

http://eatingacademy.com/nutrition/the-straight-dope-on-cholesterol-part-i

 

 

did you do this through your doctor or did you have to pay for it?

 

I was honest with my doctor, told him what I was considering doing and asked for his help with the blood tests. He was concerned but obliged.

[maccaz]

daz wasn't there some studies done that debunked connection between dietary cholesterol and blood cholesterol? or maybe im thinking of something completely different, dunno not my field of expertise

A bit lengthy, but I found this (and the subsequent parts of the article) very helpful in understanding things.

http://eatingacademy.com/nutrition/the-straight-dope-on-cholesterol-part-i

did you do this through your doctor or did you have to pay for it?

I was honest with my doctor, told him what I was considering doing and asked for his help with the blood tests. He was concerned but obliged.

Lucky to find a doc like that.

I went in told them id been taking my gfs accutane 3 months and its working mean can i get a script for myself cos running out. He gave me a look like id just asked him for a handy or something. After lots of haggling he gave me them in the end but def some doctors more understanding than others

[atrollappears]

daz wasn't there some studies done that debunked connection between dietary cholesterol and blood cholesterol? or maybe im thinking of something completely different, dunno not my field of expertise

 

I have recently read in my coursework somewhere, ingestion of fats prior to testing can effect your lipid profile, whether this impacts on health long term is another matter:

 

There was a huge paper about dietary fats and cholesterol... 

 

 

The Oiling of America

Mary G. Enig 

Presented by Sally Fallon

Margarine is the bad guy and butter and eggs are the good guys

For fifty years, big business, government agencies and medical organizations have campaigned deceptively against animal fats, meat, eggs, butter and other nutritious, traditional foods, leading to huge profits from the sale of toxic margarine, shortenings and liquid vegetable oils, and the foods that contain them. Scientific data contradicting current anti-animal fat public health policy was suppressed and censored for many years. Dr. Enig and Sally Fallon now tell you the truth about how that happened.

The Oiling of America will open your eyes to fraud and deception behind the lipid hypothesis of heart disease.  Topics include:

• How scientists cheat in scientific studies
• Why cholesterol is not the cause of heart disease
• The dangers of cholesterol-lowering diets and drugs
• Why trans fatty acids and liquid vegetable oils are so dangerous to human health

http://www.drcranton.com/nutrition/oiling.htm

[daywalker]

those are nice test levels! when I got mine done pre cycle, I was 12 or less I think and that was when I was 21. but the weird thing was I had no problems getting hard ons and felt sweet. also I had a lot more muscle than most on my frame pre cycle so I don't know what to read into those numbers.

[xfit]

Partial results after ~8 weeks on. Only thing I can see that's concerning is an increase in Alanine Aminotransferase (ALT) but from what I'm reading this can be increase due to how often I'm working out (ref).

 

 

23 Mar 2015, Cortisol

Serum Cortisol:                442 nmol/L

Comment:                       A serum cortisol higher than 400 nmol/L, in an unstressed person, excludes adrenal insufficiency in the vast majority of cases. If there is clinical concern, contact an endocrinologist.

 Cortisol (Morning Peak) 200 - 700 nmol/L

 As of the 2nd March 2015, Cortisol will be analysed using a

 re-standardised Centaur XP assay. There is no change to results but the

 lower level will now be reported as <14 nmol/L.

 

23 Mar 2015, Renal Function Tests

Sodium:                        138 mmol/L ( 135 - 145 )

Potassium:                     4.5 mmol/L ( 3.5 - 5.2 )

Creatinine:                    102 umol/L ( 60 - 105 )

eGFR:                          86 mL/min/1.73m2 ( > 90 ) 

Comment:    An eGFR > 60 mL/min/1.73m2 suggests normal kidney function

 

23 Mar 2015, Liver Function Tests

Total Bilirubin:               16 umol/L ( < 25 )

Alk. Phosphatase:              58 U/L ( 40 - 110 )

GGT:                           26 U/L ( < 60 )

ALT:                           39 U/L ( < 45 )

Total Protein:                 70 g/L ( 66 - 84 )

Albumin:                       42 g/L ( 34 - 48 )

Globulin:                      28 g/L ( 25 - 41 )

 

 

23 Mar 2015, Lipid Tests

Fasting status:                Fasting

Cholesterol:                   5.7 mmol/L ( < 5.0 ) H

Triglyceride:                  1.3 mmol/L ( < 2.0 )

HDL Cholesterol:               1.34 mmol/L ( > 1.00 )

LDL cholesterol:               3.8 mmol/L ( < 3.4 ) H

Chol/HDL Ratio:                4.2 ( < 4.5 )

Comment:                       For most patients non-fasting lipids are acceptable for CVD risk assessment, as Chol/HDL ratio is not affected.

For established CVD risk (including diabetes) NZGG optimal levels are Cholesterol < 4.0, LDL < 2.0 and Chol/HDL ratio < 4.0

 

 

23 Mar 2015, Testosterone

Testosterone:                  > 50.0 nmol/L ( 8.0 - 29.0 ) HH

? on supplement.

 

 

23 Mar 2015, Reproductive Hormones

FSH:                           < 0.5 IU/L ( 2.0 - 12.0 ) L

LH:                            < 0.1 IU/L ( 2.0 - 9.0 ) L

Prolactin:                     141 mIU/L ( 70 - 300 )

 

[cruxis]

About right, My guess a Testosterone only cycle? Your natural production is now shutdown from LH,FSH. As you can seen your Testosterone is so high it is outside what the lab test can test for. It could be 75+. That means you gear is not bunk. :-) You should be making alot gains weekly by now especially if its your first cycle.

 

Would have got Oestradiol done to seen if that has risen to much and to adjust AI dosage if that was the case. Thats if you are taking a AI? 

 

How much weight gain have you had?

[xfit]

About right, My guess a Testosterone only cycle? Your natural production is now shutdown from LH,FSH. As you can seen your Testosterone is so high it is outside what the lab test can test for. It could be 75+. That means you gear is not bunk. :-) You should be making alot gains weekly by now especially if its your first cycle.

 

Indeed it is my first cycle. Test-E only.

 

 

Would have got Oestradiol done to seen if that has risen to much and to adjust AI dosage if that was the case. Thats if you are taking a AI?

 

I was taking some Arimidex twice a week @ 0.25mg but I have a feeling it was hindering my gains. I'm now only taking it weekly as of the last 2 weeks or so, no symptoms of too must aromitisation (e.g. no water retention or itchy/puffy/sensitive nips).

 

 

How much weight gain have you had?

 

I've gained ~9kg in the 8 weeks and I'm at least as lean as when I started, if not leaner. Started at ~78kg and now weighing in at 87kg. Looking forward to the rest of it, don't want it to end! Haha.