The best supplements you need for all your goals)

[musclearmor]

Noted Flex- what's ya take on Kre-Alkaline? Didn't make any noticable difference when I tried it.

[Flex]

Noted Flex- what's ya take on Kre-Alkaline? Didn't make any noticable difference when I tried it.

My honest opinion is that it's the biggest bunch of overblown shit on the market.

They've created negative and unsubstantiated claims about the most effective product on the market and try to peddle off an inferior product that has absolutely no independent backing to show it is more effective than creatine mono in any positive way, or even that it works.

The marketers of krealklalyn are the reason people wrongly believe that creatine mono causes kidney failure, bloating and muscle cramp. I doubt the guys that make and sell this shit have even used creatine monohydrate. Any sports nutrition company that puts their name to this and seriously buys into the fallacies spouted off by the developers of KA are doing the industry absolutely no favours.

Well that's my opinion anyway.

[rose]

Noted Flex- what's ya take on Kre-Alkaline? Didn't make any noticable difference when I tried it.

My honest opinion is that it's the biggest bunch of overblown shit on the market.

They've created negative and unsubstantiated claims about the most effective product on the market and try to peddle off an inferior product that has absolutely no independent backing to show it is more effective than creatine mono in any positive way, or even that it works.

The marketers of krealklalyn are the reason people wrongly believe that creatine mono causes kidney failure, bloating and muscle cramp. I doubt the guys that make and sell this shit have even used creatine monohydrate. Any sports nutrition company that puts their name to this and seriously buys into the fallacies spouted off by the developers of KA are doing the industry absolutely no favours.

Well that's my opinion anyway.

I second that! :grin: Don't believe the hype! Yo Chuck, they must be on a pipe, right?

[musclearmor]

True that- I am very pro- Beta-Alanine which makes a great companion to creatine. Have seen some good scientific literature showing significant improvements in time to exhaustion when used in effecous dosages.

3) carnosine loading slightly but significantly attenuated fatigue in repeated bouts of exhaustive dynamic contractions

http://jap.physiology.org/cgi/content/a ... 103/5/1736

One reason why I swing between Superpump (without) and Shotgun (with Beta-Alanine) as my pre-workout booster. SyntheSize stacked on Superpump was pretty effective too- pumped out the hell cardio session on that combo a couple of weeks back...500cals in 35 mins.

[Flex]

Sorry but I'm not sold on Beta Alanine. I don't believe the majority of strength athletes have any pressing need to boost carnosine and buffer lactic acid. Funny that you reference a study to sprinters that shows it enhances carnosine levels yet doesn't actually benefit their sprint times. What's the benefit in that?

All the studies I've read use at least 4.5grams a day and show that it needs to be used for at least 12 weeks for it to really start offering any supposed benefit. Most of the supps fall well short of this and for some reason recommend shorter cycles.

I thought maybe it might be beneficial to endurance sport however it's of no longterm beneficial use to endurance athletes either unless they want to be on it for the rest of their life and are willing to use it whilst racing to maintain adequate carnosine. Lactate training is what endurance athletes need to do to enhance their ability to handle lactic acid. If you're on beta alanine your body can't adapt to handle lactic acid (which it will with lactic acid training).

When the carnosine levels drop during endurance events or when you stop using BA suddenly the body has to do something with lactic acid and it can't handle it.

I'm still open to the potential of it but I think that on paper it looks great however in the real world doesn't actually offer any benefit.

[rose]

Sorry but I'm not sold on Beta Alanine. I don't believe the majority of strength athletes have any pressing need to boost carnosine and buffer lactic acid. Funny that you reference a study to sprinters that shows it enhances carnosine levels yet doesn't actually benefit their sprint times. What's the benefit in that?

All the studies I've read use at least 4.5grams a day and show that it needs to be used for at least 12 weeks for it to really start offering any supposed benefit. Most of the supps fall well short of this and for some reason recommend shorter cycles.

I thought maybe it might be beneficial to endurance sport however it's of no longterm beneficial use to endurance athletes either unless they want to be on it for the rest of their life and are willing to use it whilst racing to maintain adequate carnosine. Lactate training is what endurance athletes need to do to enhance their ability to handle lactic acid. If you're on beta alanine your body can't adapt to handle lactic acid (which it will with lactic acid training).

When the carnosine levels drop during endurance events or when you stop using BA suddenly the body has to do something with lactic acid and it can't handle it.

I'm still open to the potential of it but I think that on paper it looks great however in the real world doesn't actually offer any benefit.

Again, agreed. Oooh, I feel all tingly, it must be working! :pfft:

[samoan_muscle]

Sorry but I'm not sold on Beta Alanine. I don't believe the majority of strength athletes have any pressing need to boost carnosine and buffer lactic acid. Funny that you reference a study to sprinters that shows it enhances carnosine levels yet doesn't actually benefit their sprint times. What's the benefit in that?

All the studies I've read use at least 4.5grams a day and show that it needs to be used for at least 12 weeks for it to really start offering any supposed benefit. Most of the supps fall well short of this and for some reason recommend shorter cycles.

I thought maybe it might be beneficial to endurance sport however it's of no longterm beneficial use to endurance athletes either unless they want to be on it for the rest of their life and are willing to use it whilst racing to maintain adequate carnosine. Lactate training is what endurance athletes need to do to enhance their ability to handle lactic acid. If you're on beta alanine your body can't adapt to handle lactic acid (which it will with lactic acid training).

When the carnosine levels drop during endurance events or when you stop using BA suddenly the body has to do something with lactic acid and it can't handle it.

I'm still open to the potential of it but I think that on paper it looks great however in the real world doesn't actually offer any benefit.

So what's your supplement shopping list look like Flex?

[Flex]

So what's your supplement shopping list look like Flex?

Creatine mono, BCAA's, Glutamine, l-tyrosine, normally ZMA though not on it at the moment, used to use a lot of HMB, I like stims and noo-tropics so normally some form of caffeine and Amine's pretraining, and if I'm making things in the kitchen sink I've found ginkgo biloba, yerba maté, tyrosine, Coq10, potassium gluconate, pyruvate, Rhodiola, Phosphatidylserine, vinpocetine, BCAA's and DMAE works quite well together.

I also quite like ecdysterone and methoxyisoflavone together though not too many people seem to be into it anymore.

[Luigi]

wow http://www.nbr.co.nz/usana mind=blown

[rose]

wow http://www.nbr.co.nz/usana mind=blown

[Grover]

Oxydrene gives great recovery and stamina increases,

Stacking with Endothil CR but not sure that this is doing much

[ThePman]

I wouldn't write it off - I know who HP is refering too. Remember for a time people thought the world was flat > Scientific paradigms in this sport change very slowly as the topics of most interest to bodybuilders specifically are not generally commercially viable.

I haven't written it off. I just don't trust interpretations of research and prefer to read the paper myself before drawing conclusions. There's a lot of context issues that are often left out when people just cherry-pick the conclusion of an abstract.

As far as the relevance of science, I'd rather not get into that except to re-state the above - science is just empiricism. Most of the mistakes made are due to lack of context and poor interpretation of research, not the research itself.

[cycomiko]

Lol, you will be waiting a bit longer as well Im affraid. Is not due to be published for a while . I only heard about when speaking with a collegue on facebook who used to be a nutritionist over here but has since spends his time working in canada and the US. It is a pelimenary study that has yet to be duplicated.Even though it was a full fledged "double blind procedure" untill the results have been reproduced in at least 2 more studies by his peers it wont be "officially recognised", that alone published.

If they really wanted it published, there are multitudes of journals that will publish preliminary work. So either the quality of the trial is low, or something else. Which University group performed the work on the protein receptor (sic) within the muscle?

or is it all top secret

[cycomiko]

I wouldn't write it off - I know who HP is refering too. Remember for a time people thought the world was flat > Scientific paradigms in this sport change very slowly as the topics of most interest to bodybuilders specifically are not generally commercially viable.

what is there to write off? a vague claim on a bbing website?

But excellent on bringing up "people thought the world was flat".

Scientific knowledge is ultimately based upon measured observation. Evidence if you will. The scientists that had provided the evidence that that world was not flat were persecuted by those who had a world view based upon faith.

In the case of this, who do we want to be? Those who rely upon actual evidence - providing methodologies and a dataset that can stand on its own. Or perhaps we should have faith that somebody posted something on the internet from somebody who was a nutritionist has got some data that may never be published.

[Optimass]

The thing that pisses me off abot VPX is that they bang on about how great their new forms of creatine are (COP and CPT) and yet still use Creatine Monohydrate. .

I'm not 100% but would think that Creatine Monohydrate would be may more stable in a diet product than the other forms > Increasing the shelflife able to be printed on the label. Would be interesting to know for sure ...

[DeeDuub]

hey there everyone!

finished exams and finally got back into the forum!

never knew the thread would get so many posts!!!

Ive gota mate whos got hook ups for supplements. 8)

Altho i dont believe in powders or anything .they DO help but lately i just drink up n go or whatever protein i can find..heck even milk...as long as I lift heavy and eat right..

anyways what im trying to get at is the following 4..I gota choose one powder to get:

Il summarise the powders in order of the links:

Harden up Multistack--- 10hour slow release protein... IMO slow is the best

Cytogainer.. one of the best massgainers as it has no sugar rubbish like PVL

Monster maxx..-- shit as its another PVL with loaded sugar to get my gut bigger? :naughty:

Mutant pro... same as monster maxx?

http://www.supplementsdirect.co.nz/view ... dCode=HUC1

http://www.supplementsdirect.co.nz/view ... de=CS22010

http://www.supplementsdirect.co.nz/view ... dCode=mmv1

http://www.elitenutrition.co.nz/Catalog ... ID=1032882

Ive been lowering my junk lately..and eating alota protein at nite and carbs pre workout etc... trying to lose my belly..

I dont really do ''bulk and cut'' cycles because I just do weights coz all my bros do it and am all ''into it now''.

Although I know for a fact that increasing calories does help you lift alot.

Anyways most people would say ''im cutting up'' now but I still aim to get alot(cleanly though) .. :nod:

anyways (i always talk too much BS sorry ) :oops:

which powders are good???

only tub ive ever used was optimum...and despite all the hype around it..its nothing that special... 24g /120 calories a scoop?? whoop whoop alota tubs got that....

Im thnking the cytogainer is the best one from that list as its a balance between the massgain without the bullshit sugar like PVL etc and aound 16g protein per scoop(little I know but allgood for me)..?

Or the harden up multistack.... alota people,trainers and bodybuilding.com articles say casein is real good as whey protein is just too fastly absorbed..

-cos absorbing and utilizing are too different things(il post the link for that when I find it)..

Anyways hope someone can help me choosing powders!!!

also gna make a workout journal soon!!! (if anyone cares lool)

thanks again and please mind the slang/formal/short typings... its just me :grin:

[Ordy]

Btw mutant pro is nothing like Mutant Mass and Monster Maxx.

Its more of a slow release protein (has caesin and whey) high glutamine

[tadung]

Hi all, nice to see you all here.

Hope that i can learn something interesting in this forum

Have fun

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