sponge Posted September 2, 2005 Report Share Posted September 2, 2005 Hope there wasn't an existing insulin thread - if so then my bad.Who here has tried insulin? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrdcor Posted September 2, 2005 Report Share Posted September 2, 2005 did you just use insulin on its own ???, insulin use is not for the novice or faint hearted, insulin is the most powerful hormone in the human body, and can have dire side effects, I have used insulin on a number of occassions and i gotta tell ya it can make you feel like crap, but in saying that it was not on its own, i actually wouldnt advise its use on its own, as their are just to many things that can , and do go wrong, actualy i dont think i would use it again if i ever got serious again !!! One thing i do strongly advise though whilst useing insulin is to always carry a Clucogen shot with you to combat the very real danger of hypoglycemia that can strike any time !!! I have seen many bodybuilders in my time f*ck up with insulin as they just didnt have a good understanding on how it works and its capablitys !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sponge Posted September 2, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 2, 2005 hi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varven Posted September 3, 2005 Report Share Posted September 3, 2005 sponge, what do you use insuling by itself for ? whats the goal and how does it work ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.A Muscle Posted September 3, 2005 Report Share Posted September 3, 2005 Yeah it was by itself at the time. Why woudln't you use it just by itself? Sponge. I have used it before and not on its own. With GH & T3. Question. What do you think you will gain by taking insulin? What do you think insulin is used by B/B? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sponge Posted September 3, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2005 gdsagdsasgd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flex Posted September 3, 2005 Report Share Posted September 3, 2005 Don't take this the wrong way sponge but I think you need to research your supps a bit better. I noticed from another post that you'd only been training for about one and half years before straying to the darkside, and I'm guessing you've been training for less than three years total yet you are already on insulin - personally I'd be focusing more on my diet and training, and increasing my knowledge before relying so heavily on chemical enhancement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sponge Posted September 3, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 3, 2005 hi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrdcor Posted September 4, 2005 Report Share Posted September 4, 2005 you are right sponge the moral choice is yours and yours alone, flex is of anti supp backround , i did find it intresting though you would use insulin on its own, not including the danger that insulin may present , the anaboilc advantage you talk of also requires increased hormone activity and a higher gh secretion or injection, one thing i would be carefull of is gaining insulin sensitivity, which can make you fat , tired , and at worst a diabetic, i would chose a good testosterone , anabolic combination (which is a lot safer)over a insulin intake any day!! you can minipulate your own insulin activity with food alone you know !!just saying be carefull bud , thats all !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flex Posted September 5, 2005 Report Share Posted September 5, 2005 I hadn't gained for ages before I turned to the dark side. Besides that's not relevant to whether I need to research my supp's...Hadn't gained for ages? Dude, you're 20 years old - I'm not totally against chemical enhancement - I'm just not that big on people who don't reach their full natural potential before jabbing a needle in their butt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExpensiveUrine Posted September 5, 2005 Report Share Posted September 5, 2005 I hadn't gained for ages before I turned to the dark side. Besides that's not relevant to whether I need to research my supp's...Hadn't gained for ages? Dude, you're 20 years old - I'm not totally against chemical enhancement - I'm just not that big on people who don't reach their full natural potential before jabbing a needle in their butt.I'm more or less of the same opinion.If you say you haven't gained any/little hypertrophy during those first ~1.5 years, I'm straight away thinking shitty diet/training/recovery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sponge Posted September 5, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 5, 2005 I gained 20kg naturally? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frogie2001 Posted September 5, 2005 Report Share Posted September 5, 2005 :shock: that falls into the genetic freak category of weight gain. what do you weight now 90 kg lean mass?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varven Posted September 6, 2005 Report Share Posted September 6, 2005 frogie why would you say 20kg lean gains are un-natural ? surely over a 2 year period for a relative newbie it would be easy.Take someone like Jono who bulks up about 40kgs over 2 years and then cuts down.. there would be at least 20 - 25kg of lean muscle right ? ... Or maybe I just misunderstood your post ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Growth Posted September 7, 2005 Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 I think he was being sarcastic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted September 7, 2005 Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 20kg natural is nothing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sponge Posted September 7, 2005 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 yeah but i didn't need to cut at the end of the 20kg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frogie2001 Posted September 7, 2005 Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 hang on guys, i didn't say it wasn't natural. I read an article my Mentzer a coupl of years ago, and it was stated that for the average person true lean mass gain is between 1-2 kg a year. that is with good training and dieting. I am not sure what that gain would be for a newbie though. I am still impressed at 20 kg ggain though, your mum wouldn't know what to do with buying clothes for ya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Growth Posted September 7, 2005 Report Share Posted September 7, 2005 I read an article my Mentzer a coupl of years ago, and it was stated that for the average person true lean mass gain is between 1-2 kg a year. that is with good training and dieting.That cant be right mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frogie2001 Posted September 8, 2005 Report Share Posted September 8, 2005 i know i was surprised to read that too, because as the pros go, weighing in at 120kg that is 20-30 years of solid gains from the ag of 15 ish...... but than again they are a fair way from non chmical enhancement. So I am still a little up in the air, either way :roll: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flex Posted September 8, 2005 Report Share Posted September 8, 2005 true lean mass gain is between 1-2 kg a year. that is with good training and dieting. I'd say that would be about right - if you train consistently (naturally & chemically) for 10, 20, 30 or even 40 years the most you would hope to gain in that time would be 30-60kg of lean mass depending on your frame size, over and above your natural weight. Not everyone gains 20kg lean mass when the first start training - the most likely reason for that is conditions prior to training might have meant that they were beneath their natural level of muscularity - i.e they could be a 100% mesomorph that, for whatever reason, spent the first 20 years of their life eating less than they needed - once they clean up their diet and add a bit of training in, their genetics come into play with initially rapid results.Even training with chemical assistance you couldn't hope to consistently gain more than 3 or 4 kgs a year for very long. This of course all depends on your training age - if you've been training (correctly) for less than 5 years your gains will probably come reasonably quick. Someone that has been training for 10-20 years+ will more or less have reached "saturation" point and will be in a stage of tweaking the muscle that they have. There's only so much muscle that the body can build, or that is required for you to function properly. Of course every so often you may go through a phase of rapid muscle growth, but this will most likely be followed by a proportionately long lack of growth (kind of like the housing market).Case in point - Ronnie Coleman is 41 years old and competes at between 280 to 300lb - 127 to 136kg.At age 26 he weighed 215lb - 97kg - thats a gain of 39kg or so in the last 15 years - or around 2.6kg a year. And while he may like to say he's drug free I'd wager he's on a little bit more than just lots of food, whey protein and creatine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frogie2001 Posted September 8, 2005 Report Share Posted September 8, 2005 whew I'm glad I wasn't gonig nuts. either way i reckon you're pretty lucky being able to put on 20 kg in 2 years. well done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Growth Posted September 8, 2005 Report Share Posted September 8, 2005 Oh ok, if you average the gains over the whole training time then i can see how it would be around that mark. Its a bit simplistic for my liking though, if you were to look at a graph of LM vs age then i dont think it would be a straight line, theres things like gaining heaps when you first start, then theres things like as you gain more and more LM it may become harder to put more on etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varven Posted September 8, 2005 Report Share Posted September 8, 2005 At first I was going to blow the BS whistle and then I realized it was the method in which you compare it.Better way to put it:initial gains are usually most rapid, EVERYONE can gain more than 2kg of LBM a year WHEN they start.This cannot be maintained, it will slow down n eventually stop.You may use AAS and so forth to prolong, increase it, but sooner or later IT WILL STOP.then take all your gains and divide it by number of years you trained for= you get an average of 1 - 2 kglbm/year. Which IMO is not a smart way to compare it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExpensiveUrine Posted September 9, 2005 Report Share Posted September 9, 2005 I read an article my Mentzer a coupl of years ago, and it was stated that for the average person true lean mass gain is between 1-2 kg a year. that is with good training and dieting.Maybe if they train HIT'ard style, then it wouldn't come as a surprise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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