How do I know if I am Over-working at the Gym?

[ExpensiveUrine]

To OP, it's just DOMS and the usual pain that goes with it. In your case it's probably from an increase in loading and/or working a bodypart too infrequently, just an adaptive process. There is a thing called overreaching (as well as overtraining, but this is much harder to achieve) and it's accompanied by quite a few symptoms.

[SamWelly]

Another reason whey should only really be used post workout is because at any other time when it is taken by itself your body only uses about 30% of the amino acids.

Where did you get that from?

You see, whey gives your body such a quick flood of aminos that the body thinks it has more protein than it actually does and it sends the "excess" to the liver, where it is oxidized and used as energy

Not necessarily. There are many factors that will influence AA oxidation and you will find that if the glucose supply is adequate, excess AA's will be converted to fat.

There is a link to the article I copyed it from above. I have been told this by a fair few people as well.

Are you agreeing that not all of the Whey will be utilised as intended?

[morala]

So Sam what do you suggest is an optimal protein intake for someone trying to cut up?

[SamWelly]

.

[SamWelly]

I would recommend keeping protien at the same level all year round.

Increasing cardio, and reducing carbs and saturated fat will result in weight loss.

Increasing carbs, and decreasing cardio or anabolic activity will result in more growth, strength, and possibly fat gain.

[morala]

Sweet cheers for the advice. I was thinking though that 600gs of protein when cutting down would still result in fat. im taking in 250 atm

[ExpensiveUrine]

Another reason whey should only really be used post workout is because at any other time when it is taken by itself your body only uses about 30% of the amino acids.

Where did you get that from?

You see, whey gives your body such a quick flood of aminos that the body thinks it has more protein than it actually does and it sends the "excess" to the liver, where it is oxidized and used as energy

Not necessarily. There are many factors that will influence AA oxidation and you will find that if the glucose supply is adequate, excess AA's will be converted to fat.

There is a link to the article I copyed it from above. I have been told this by a fair few people as well.

Are you agreeing that not all of the Whey will be utilised as intended?

Yes I agree with that statement up to a point (as said before it can be stored as fat). I was questioning "30%" value and it seems like an arbitrary number after speaking to Layne, as the article didn't have any references. It's hard to say how much protein will get used, oxidized, stored as there are many factors that contribute to fate of proteins in metabolism.

[2guns]

so sam welly.... are u only having one shake a day? (pwo)?

[SamWelly]

Yep, and the occasional one in the morning with my oats.

[2guns]

i have probably 5 shakes a day at the moment, just coz u have that many doesnt mean your not eating other food as well

[Luigi]

Yep, and the occasional one in the morning with my oats.

yea i go for one or two shakes my mate has 10 ..... then wonders why he cant lose his fat :? reckons its better to overdo it than underdoo it but yea everyone had different ways of doing stuff

[IronGame]

Forget about the shakes with the possable exception of PWO, shakes should be used as something to fall back on when you cant get in a real meal or you physically cant eat the required amount of cal to induce growth, other than that it takes real food to build real muscle 8) it took me a long time to learn this to but now days I get all my protein from whole unprocessed foods (except sometimes PWO) and I am much better off for it. You should eat when your HUNGERY and you should be hungery every couple of hours, if your not you need to change something up, wether it be your training, macro ratio's, food choices, supplements, sleep, stress, lifestyle ect.

[SamWelly]

Glad someone agrees :wink:

Nothing wrong with more than a couple a day bro. Just not going to be as effective when it is not PWO. Real food is better IMO.

[Marcus]

I was having 5 shakes a day also, but cut it back to 2 per day some time ago. I don't seem to hold as much water as before.

I don't even have a shake PWO anymore, just get home have some waxy maize & BCAA's etc, then dinner about half an hour later. Haven't noticed any difference which makes me believe that its more important to get the carbs in straight away after a workout.

[Small]

wat is waxy maize ?

[craig.j]

As SamWelly said - doesn't need to be protein in the form of shakes. Try tuna, chicken, lean beef, egg whites. Eggs are still reasonably cheap.

try to keep your eas protein for after the gym, have your shake + some carbs, then throughout the day try to stick to protein that isnt going do be digested in 30min. like the article said casean (cottage cheese), meat (tuna, chicen brest, blablabla any lean cut of meat), or eggs

try to get some fibre as well: green beans, broccoli, lettuce are very low in carbs and will help you stay in shape 8) this is turning more into a nutrition Q&A.

train hard! three days rest should be enough for you if your just getting into it, as your cant physically do as much damage to a muscle as veterans can. if your sore have a few more days off. any way good luck! :clap:

[2guns]

wat is waxy maize ?

its a corn grain. i dont think it spikes insulin levels though, i thought u would want this pwo marcus?

[Marcus]

Here's some info I found. I tried it just to see what the hype was about. But for the low cost I think I will stick with it. It just tastes like water really. I like the fact it doesn't bloat me & I can also see it coming in useful when bulking to get the extra cals in without feeling stuffed.

this info says it is hard to mix but the stuff I has mixes fine with a fork. It is quite messy to handle as it's a very fine powder & tends to go all over the place.

copy n pasted:

Waxy Maize Starch is derived from natural corn starch and is a food grade modified starch. It is very bland in flavor and has a white fluffy like consistency. We recommend using a shaker or a blender (this is best) to mix this product as it does not mix well. Immediate use is recommended as it has a tendency to clump. We have gone through great lengths testing and tweaking our Waxy Maize Starch to be palatable. We have found one that tastes fairly well and functionality wise it is top of the line.

So what’s so special with Waxy Maize in comparison to dextrose or maltodextrin? Many people have used a mix of dextrose and maltodextrin for post workout nutrition for years because it works and is vital for proper glycogen replenishment. Welcome to the new era of post workout nutrition… Waxy Maize Starch. WMS has a much higher molecular weight and a much lower osmolarity rate compared to dextrose or maltodextrin, so what does this mean… Mainly, WMS bypasses the stomach, is absorbed by the intestines and immediately is assimilated; this is all done at a much faster rate than dextrose or maltodextrin, almost double.

WMS can help the absorption rates of many of your favorite supplements like creatine monohydrate, creatine ethyl ester, cell volumization and nitric oxide type supplements, etc. Nutrients like this often times are left in the stomachs harsh acidic environment and degrade absorption rates. WMS helps shuttle these nutrients to bypass the stomach and allow the body to assimilate these nutrients at a much higher rate.

WMS has the ability to replenish the body’s glycogen stores much faster than a mix of maltodextrin or dextrose. This is accomplished again by WMS’s ability to bypass the stomach and go to the intestines for immediate absorption. WMS’s ability to shuttle all these nutrients and starch gives the body an immediate "pump" you can physically feel in your muscles post workout. You will see a much larger, fuller and rounder muscle belly.

[Small]

You will see a much larger, fuller and rounder muscle belly

um..

excellent?

they mean wher the glycogen is stored in the muscle, not ure gut i assume ?

[Pseudonym]

Interesting. How well did it live it up to the hype, Marcus?

Also: how much, and where do you get it?

[Marcus]

The stuff I am using at the moment is "Carbslam" from Endorphin Systems. It's unflavoured.

http://www.endorphinsystems.com/view_product.asp?prodid=414

Next time I will buy it from Trueprotein.com, lots cheaper.

The thing I like about this stuff is I can mix it with a glass of water & it doesn't bloat me. It's quite "light" to drink & I can easily fit in a meal shortly after.

I don't really buy into the hype of any product, I just thought I'd give this a go since it has good reviews & is fairly cheap. Seems to be effective too.