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ratz99

Cruising and Blasting Experiences

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For me blasting and cruising didn't work for me in the long term. For scope:

Blast= 8 weeks 1-2 grams total 

Cruise= 8 weeks 125mg test 

After  2 years my sensitivity was zero and I had completely plateaued. I kept on looking for the next drug that could push myself into new territory but no success. 

 

I took 10 months off and my HTPA never full recovered. I felt like was only 20% a man and had all the typical low test symptoms. Before I blast and cruised I never had any issues recovering after a cycle (had done 5cycles) in 1 to 2 months and thought my natural test would always come back no matter what. Blast cruising is a risky game. I just don't see the minimal benefits (if any) outweighing the risks 

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8 hours ago, Terrymundo said:

For me blasting and cruising didn't work for me in the long term. For scope:

Blast= 8 weeks 1-2 grams total 

Cruise= 8 weeks 125mg test 

After  2 years my sensitivity was zero and I had completely plateaued. I kept on looking for the next drug that could push myself into new territory but no success. 

 

I took 10 months off and my HTPA never full recovered. I felt like was only 20% a man and had all the typical low test symptoms. Before I blast and cruised I never had any issues recovering after a cycle (had done 5cycles) in 1 to 2 months and thought my natural test would always come back no matter what. Blast cruising is a risky game. I just don't see the minimal benefits (if any) outweighing the risks 


Jeez mate. What do you do now? Just TRT?  That writeup is enought to put me off ever cruising and blasting haha. 

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19 hours ago, ratz99 said:


Jeez mate. What do you do now? Just TRT?  That writeup is enought to put me off ever cruising and blasting haha. 

Yeah self perscribed trt of 250mg a week which I  might drop back to 125mg. May cycle next year if my training and diet get consistent again. 

I'm glad it's put you off haha wish someone put me off the idea a few years back. Not that I would have listened 

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Logically to people that makes sense it happens with caffeine, clenbuterol, ephedrine etc but it's not the case with AAS. It's actually the opppsite the longer you use the more receptors your body produces and the Androgen receptors don't down-regulate they up-regulate and are constantly turning themselves over. 

 

The only negative to cruise blasting is the amount of time you are shutdown for. If you do the cruise properly then all your blood levels and tests can be just the same as if you had come off completley once everything's levelled out.

 

most likley it's people's diet and training that either doesn't evolve and progress to compliment any gains they have made so they plateau off. If you use 2000mg of gear a week and you gain 10kg then you should probably be eating different to what you were when you started. I think people start off with a hiss and a roar then they just can't keep up the intensity or lose some drive so they just fall into a maintenance routine without even knowing it. it's dumb to just think you would keep growing it getting stronger at a consistent rate the bigger and stronger you get - Diminishing returns blah blah blah..

 

L-carnitine L-tartrate increases androgen receptors so if you believe they do down-regulate then take that.

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4 hours ago, Realtalk said:

Logically to people that makes sense it happens with caffeine, clenbuterol, ephedrine etc but it's not the case with AAS. It's actually the opppsite the longer you use the more receptors your body produces and the Androgen receptors don't down-regulate they up-regulate and are constantly turning themselves over. 

 

The only negative to cruise blasting is the amount of time you are shutdown for. If you do the cruise properly then all your blood levels and tests can be just the same as if you had come off completley once everything's levelled out.

 

most likley it's people's diet and training that either doesn't evolve and progress to compliment any gains they have made so they plateau off. If you use 2000mg of gear a week and you gain 10kg then you should probably be eating different to what you were when you started. I think people start off with a hiss and a roar then they just can't keep up the intensity or lose some drive so they just fall into a maintenance routine without even knowing it. it's dumb to just think you would keep growing it getting stronger at a consistent rate the bigger and stronger you get - Diminishing returns blah blah blah..

 

L-carnitine L-tartrate increases androgen receptors so if you believe they do down-regulate then take that.

You mean people actually have to address their nutrition and/or output to get results?!?! Noooo I don't believe it...

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6 hours ago, Realtalk said:

 

Only as a last resort lol

 

If we want to increase our fat intake can we just pin more? Need 20gm more fat.... I'll take that in test e thanks hahahaha

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14 hours ago, Realtalk said:

Logically to people that makes sense it happens with caffeine, clenbuterol, ephedrine etc but it's not the case with AAS. It's actually the opposite the longer you use the more receptors your body produces and the Androgen receptors don't down-regulate they up-regulate and are constantly turning themselves over. 

 

 

Initially yes, there is an up-regulation of the AR but after sustained elevated testosterone levels some desensitization occurs which leads to a decrease in mRNA levels acting as a negative feedback loop.

 

In several cases it was found that the AR content increased but the binding affinity for androgens decreased resulting in a net loss of testosterone utilization.

 

Essentially, after sucha long period of exposure the extra testosterone (above a certain point) becomes useless, whereas initially when first starting a cycle the extra free testosterone results in an almost linear dose-dependent effect curve.

 

So, there's still benefit to an extended cycle (longer than 12 weeks) but the growth experienced isn't near what one expects an the beginning of a cycle... almost a sort of plateau effect.

 

Leaving a 3 month gap or so between cycles can result in a stronger initial response to the androgens.

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6 minutes ago, Daz69 said:

 

So, there's still benefit to an extended cycle (longer than 12 weeks) but the growth experienced isn't near what one expects an the beginning of a cycle... almost a sort of plateau effect.

 

Leaving a 3 month gap or so between cycles can result in a stronger initial response to the androgens.


Whats the ideal length between cycles Daz for optimum response? Obviously the longer the better, but is there a point that it becomes less worth waiting any longer to jump back on?

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12 minutes ago, ratz99 said:


Whats the ideal length between cycles Daz for optimum response? Obviously the longer the better, but is there a point that it becomes less worth waiting any longer to jump back on?

 

That really depends on previous cycle, hormone(s) used, amount, time on etc..

Three months is about enough for improved AR/mRNA response, but for reversal of deleterious changes to cardiovascular system, such as LVH, fibrosis of myocardium, improved ejection fraction, etc 6 months and above might be optimal..

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Just now, Daz69 said:

 

That really depends on previous cycle, hormone(s) used, amount, time on etc..

Three months is about enough for improved AR/mRNA response, but for reversal of deleterious changes to cardiovascular system, such as LVH, fibrosis of myocardium, improved ejection fraction, etc 6 months and above might be optimal..

Cool cheers Daz. Will do some research into that stuff too as some of it I have never even heard of lol

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30 minutes ago, ratz99 said:

Cool cheers Daz. Will do some research into that stuff too as some of it I have never even heard of lol

 

Try some of these:

 

Santamarina RD, Besocke AG, Romano LM, et al. Ischemic stroke related to anabolic abuse. Clin Neuropharmacol 2008;31:80–5.

Lane HA, Grace F, Smith JC, et al. Impaired vasoreactivity in bodybuilders using androgenic anabolic steroids. Eur J Clin Invest 2006;36:483–8.

D’Ascenzo S, Millimaggi D, Di Massimo C, et al. Detrimental effects of anabolic steroids on human endothelial cells. Toxicol Lett 2007;169:129–36.

Achar S, Rostamian A, Narayan SM. Cardiac and metabolic effects of anabolic-androgenic steroid abuse on lipids, blood pressure, left ventricular dimensions, and rhythm. Am J Cardiol 2010;106:893–901.

Zaugg M, Jamali NZ, Lucchinetti E, et al. Anabolic-androgenic steroids induce apoptotic cell death in adult rat ventricular myocytes. J Cell Physiol 2001;187:90–5.

Fineschi V, Baroldi G, Monciotti F, et al. Anabolic steroid abuse and cardiac sudden death: a pathologic study. Arch Pathol Lab Med 2001;125:253–5.

Wysoczanski M, Rachko M, Bergmann SR. Acute myocardial infarction in a young man using anabolic steroids. Angiology 2008;59:376–8.

Liu PY, Death AK, Handelsman DJ. Androgens and cardiovascular disease. Endocr Rev 2003;24:313–40.

Hartgens F, Rietjens G, Keizer HA, et al. Effects of androgenic-anabolic steroids on apolipoproteins and lipoprotein (a). Br J Sports Med 2004;38:253–9.

Maravelias C, Dona A, Stefanidou M, et al. Adverse effects of anabolic steroids in athletes. A constant threat. Toxicol Lett 2005;158:167–75.

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6 minutes ago, Daz69 said:

 

Try some of these:

 

Santamarina RD, Besocke AG, Romano LM, et al. Ischemic stroke related to anabolic abuse. Clin Neuropharmacol 2008;31:80–5.

Lane HA, Grace F, Smith JC, et al. Impaired vasoreactivity in bodybuilders using androgenic anabolic steroids. Eur J Clin Invest 2006;36:483–8.

D’Ascenzo S, Millimaggi D, Di Massimo C, et al. Detrimental effects of anabolic steroids on human endothelial cells. Toxicol Lett 2007;169:129–36.

Achar S, Rostamian A, Narayan SM. Cardiac and metabolic effects of anabolic-androgenic steroid abuse on lipids, blood pressure, left ventricular dimensions, and rhythm. Am J Cardiol 2010;106:893–901.

Zaugg M, Jamali NZ, Lucchinetti E, et al. Anabolic-androgenic steroids induce apoptotic cell death in adult rat ventricular myocytes. J Cell Physiol 2001;187:90–5.

Fineschi V, Baroldi G, Monciotti F, et al. Anabolic steroid abuse and cardiac sudden death: a pathologic study. Arch Pathol Lab Med 2001;125:253–5.

Wysoczanski M, Rachko M, Bergmann SR. Acute myocardial infarction in a young man using anabolic steroids. Angiology 2008;59:376–8.

Liu PY, Death AK, Handelsman DJ. Androgens and cardiovascular disease. Endocr Rev 2003;24:313–40.

Hartgens F, Rietjens G, Keizer HA, et al. Effects of androgenic-anabolic steroids on apolipoproteins and lipoprotein (a). Br J Sports Med 2004;38:253–9.

Maravelias C, Dona A, Stefanidou M, et al. Adverse effects of anabolic steroids in athletes. A constant threat. Toxicol Lett 2005;158:167–75.


Cheers mate!

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It's debatable. Some say the levelling off has nothing to do with the AR but other functions in the body. People gain 8kg off first cycle and just think after that they are gaining less each time because their AR are down-regulated. How dumb. As if you should just be able to gain 8kg on your second blast and another 8kg on your 3rd. So soon I'm going to be 350kg in bodyweight lol. Maybe you're genetics just aren't up to building much more muscle than 90kg worth or you just need to work harder or you're 120kg and 30% body fat so no matter what kind of blast you run it's impossible for your body to be in an anabolic state so it's your receptors is it..

 

post your references and links to all these copy pastes you post so we can read the entire article please.

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18 hours ago, Realtalk said:

 

post your references and links to all these copy pastes you post so we can read the entire article please.

 

Long-term exposure to high concentrations of androgens may downregulate AR content in some tissue:

 

V.A. Bricout, P.S. Germain, B.D. Serrurier, C.Y. Guezennec, Changes in testosterone muscle receptors: effects of an androgen treatment on physically trained rats, Cell Mol. Biol. (Noisy-le-grand) 40 (3) (1994) 291–294.

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On 30/11/2016 at 10:23 AM, Daz69 said:

 

Long-term exposure to high concentrations of androgens may downregulate AR content in some tissue:

 

V.A. Bricout, P.S. Germain, B.D. Serrurier, C.Y. Guezennec, Changes in testosterone muscle receptors: effects of an androgen treatment on physically trained rats, Cell Mol. Biol. (Noisy-le-grand) 40 (3) (1994) 291–294.

 

The overall effect of androgens on AR at the mRNA level is down-regulation (Burnstein et al. 1995; Krongrad et al. 1991; Shan et al. 1990; Wolf et al. 1993).

 

For example, blockade of androgen action by treatment with anti-androgens results in more than 4-fold increase in testicular AR mRNA content (Dankbar et al. 1995).

 

Both androgen and dexamethasone down-regulate AR mRNA in COS 1 cells (Burnstein et al. 1995).

 

However, in some cells, such as PC3 prostate cancer cells and osteoblasts, AR mRNA is up-regulated by androgens (Dai and Burnstein 1996; Wiren et al. 1997).

 

Burnstein KL, Maiorino CA, Dai JL, Cameron DJ (1995) Androgen and glucocorticoid regulation of androgen receptor eDNA expression. Mol Cell Endocrinol 115(2):177-186

 

Krongrad A, Wilson CM, Wilson JD, Allman DR, McPhaul MJ (1991) Androgen increases androgen receptor protein while decreasing receptor mRNA in LNCaP cells. Mol Cell Endocrinol 76:79-88

 

Shan L, Rodriguez MC, Janne OA (1990) Regulation of androgen receptor protein and mRNA concentrations by androgens in rat ventral prostate and seminal vesicles and in human hepatoma cells. Mol Endocrinol 4:1636-1646

 

Wolf DA, Herzinger T, Hermeking H, Blaschke D, Horz W (1993) Transcriptional and posttranscriptional regulation of human androgen receptor expression by androgen. Mol Endocrinol 7:924-936

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12 hours ago, Daz69 said:

 

The overall effect of androgens on AR at the mRNA level is down-regulation (Burnstein et al. 1995; Krongrad et al. 1991; Shan et al. 1990; Wolf et al. 1993).

 

For example, blockade of androgen action by treatment with anti-androgens results in more than 4-fold increase in testicular AR mRNA content (Dankbar et al. 1995).

 

Both androgen and dexamethasone down-regulate AR mRNA in COS 1 cells (Burnstein et al. 1995).

 

However, in some cells, such as PC3 prostate cancer cells and osteoblasts, AR mRNA is up-regulated by androgens (Dai and Burnstein 1996; Wiren et al. 1997).

 

Burnstein KL, Maiorino CA, Dai JL, Cameron DJ (1995) Androgen and glucocorticoid regulation of androgen receptor eDNA expression. Mol Cell Endocrinol 115(2):177-186

 

Krongrad A, Wilson CM, Wilson JD, Allman DR, McPhaul MJ (1991) Androgen increases androgen receptor protein while decreasing receptor mRNA in LNCaP cells. Mol Cell Endocrinol 76:79-88

 

Shan L, Rodriguez MC, Janne OA (1990) Regulation of androgen receptor protein and mRNA concentrations by androgens in rat ventral prostate and seminal vesicles and in human hepatoma cells. Mol Endocrinol 4:1636-1646

 

Wolf DA, Herzinger T, Hermeking H, Blaschke D, Horz W (1993) Transcriptional and posttranscriptional regulation of human androgen receptor expression by androgen. Mol Endocrinol 7:924-936

English plz

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10 hours ago, ratz99 said:

English plz

 

Regarding my post:

 

Long-term exposure to high concentrations of androgens may downregulate AR content in some tissue:

 

I've been reading a book on AR's, and have found more research papers that show AR downregulation..

 

Thought I'd share..

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