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Sleep....How Much Do You Get ?


Skeletor

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Ive had severe sleep problems for quite a long time now probably averaging 5 hours a night max of broken sleep . Have had some success with sleep supplements but the effects soon diminish and it's back to square one . Getting in an afternoon sleep occasionally nets me another hour but is that enough? Does anyone else have issues sleeping ? Wondering how it's hurting my recovery by not getting the standard 8 hours and not spending enough time in the deep rem type sleep. Sleep pills from doctor only work in above prescribed dose and then I'm so groggy and dozy the next day I'm literally likely to fall off a roof . Anybody found alternative that works? 

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I find I have really patchy sleep, have had it like this for as long as I can remember tbh.

I'll try for 8+ hours but it's always broken up heaps, some nights I wake up a shit load, and it's really annoying.

 

I find supplementing with a decent dose of magnesium helps a bit, makes for better quality of the sleep that I do get I think, makes it more restful.

But yea I still will wake up a few times a night at least.

Jam a nap in the afternoon if I have a quiet day, but that's not often and I never had a chance to do that back in NZ and still slept the same for the last few years.

 

It's good enough for now and I've dealt with it for ages, maybe it's just how I sleep since I'm a lot heavier than my body is genetically supposed to be. I dunno.

 

But when I get home I'm definitely going to go get a sleep test and see if I need to get a C-Pap or something, and see the difference it makes for recovery etc if that is the issue.

Too expensive over here for me to do it due to not being local.

 

Dunno what your issue might be though dude, and sorry can't be more help solution wise, just a topic that I've been thinking about a bit lately.

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Best thing for sleep that I occasionally use is Quetiapine (12.5-25mg). It's used for other indications primarily, so use for sleep is an off label prescription. If your doctor is knowledgeable he will readily prescribe. In the dosage range specified above it acts primarily as an antihistamine due to it's biochemical affinity towards those specific receptors - it goes there first before the other receptors. Only when you go above that dosage range does it spill over to the other receptors - it's primarily prescribed as an antipsychotic at much higher dosages (>150mg).

 

I find it is the best antihistamine to combat sleep issues. It has a short half life, so you don't experience  the grogginess that you do with other antihistamines. With Quetiapine, less is better... as long as you crowd out the receptors for a few hours you will wake up with a very low amount still in circulation when it's time to get up in the morning (hence no grogginess).

 

Apart from Quetiapine, I love Xanax for sleep. It leaves absolutely no grogginess the next day (it's not an antihistamine, rather a GABA drug), but it's very addictive so you need to be the type that can keep to once a week use and leave it at that no matter how tempting it is. Otherwise you will quickly start seeing tolerance develop and find yourself escalating the dosage and craving for it between dosages.

 

 

I hope the above info is useful. Any questions, happy to answer. 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Skeletor said:

Ive had severe sleep problems for quite a long time now probably averaging 5 hours a night max of broken sleep . Have had some success with sleep supplements but the effects soon diminish and it's back to square one . Getting in an afternoon sleep occasionally nets me another hour but is that enough? Does anyone else have issues sleeping ? Wondering how it's hurting my recovery by not getting the standard 8 hours and not spending enough time in the deep rem type sleep. Sleep pills from doctor only work in above prescribed dose and then I'm so groggy and dozy the next day I'm literally likely to fall off a roof . Anybody found alternative that works? 

To much flapping off to Instagram hoes before bed?  

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6 hours ago, I Declare War said:

Best thing for sleep that I occasionally use is Quetiapine (12.5-25mg). It's used for other indications primarily, so use for sleep is an off label prescription. If your doctor is knowledgeable he will readily prescribe. In the dosage range specified above it acts primarily as an antihistamine due to it's biochemical affinity towards those specific receptors - it goes there first before the other receptors. Only when you go above that dosage range does it spill over to the other receptors - it's primarily prescribed as an antipsychotic at much higher dosages (>150mg).

 

I find it is the best antihistamine to combat sleep issues. It has a short half life, so you don't experience  the grogginess that you do with other antihistamines. With Quetiapine, less is better... as long as you crowd out the receptors for a few hours you will wake up with a very low amount still in circulation when it's time to get up in the morning (hence no grogginess).

 

Apart from Quetiapine, I love Xanax for sleep. It leaves absolutely no grogginess the next day (it's not an antihistamine, rather a GABA drug), but it's very addictive so you need to be the type that can keep to once a week use and leave it at that no matter how tempting it is. Otherwise you will quickly start seeing tolerance develop and find yourself escalating the dosage and craving for it between dosages.

 

 

I hope the above info is useful. Any questions, happy to answer. 

 

 

 

I have a question, what good is Xanax if you can't use it on a regular basis? So once a week, that's hardly going to solve his problem. So he will get one night of sleep a week and 6 shit ones instead of 7 shit ones. That's hardly worth it

 

i have seen this topic come up lots, the last was actually a guy from gpc that you would know asking on his FB page, and the amount of idiots with no idea on anything telling him to go to doctor and ask for on zopiclones and other 'z' drugs like its no big deal. Often the path people choose with this kind of thing is make or break.

 

dude look at what you're eating before bed time or drinking in the late afternoon - if you have a really low tolerance to caffeine or are taking stimulants before training then that can affect you for hours after. Look at what you're doing at night before bed, are you watching a screen till right before you go to bed. Read before you go to bed it is Great for relaxing your brain and focusing on one thing.

 

like I says before I see this topic come up all the time and people are looking for a magic prescription or a supplement and often with sleep it's such a minor tweak that you need to fix your problem.

 

Popping a Xanax or a zopiclone to get to sleep is such a lazy uneducated way to over come a small problem.

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8 minutes ago, Realtalk said:

 

I have a question, what good is Xanax if you can't use it on a regular basis? So once a week, that's hardly going to solve his problem. So he will get one night of sleep a week and 6 shit ones instead of 7 shit ones. That's hardly worth it

 

i have seen this topic come up lots, the last was actually a guy from gpc that you would know asking on his FB page, and the amount of idiots with no idea on anything telling him to go to doctor and ask for on zopiclones and other 'z' drugs like its no big deal. Often the path people choose with this kind of thing is make or break.

 

dude look at what you're eating before bed time or drinking in the late afternoon - if you have a really low tolerance to caffeine or are taking stimulants before training then that can affect you for hours after. Look at what you're doing at night before bed, are you watching a screen till right before you go to bed. Read before you go to bed it is Great for relaxing your brain and focusing on one thing.

 

like I says before I see this topic come up all the time and people are looking for a magic prescription or a supplement and often with sleep it's such a minor tweak that you need to fix your problem.

 

Popping a Xanax or a zopiclone to get to sleep is such a lazy uneducated way to over come a small problem.

 

 

agree

xanax/zopiclone etc are good for one off things like flying, or recreational purposes, no use trying to establish a good sleep pattern by knocking yourself out cold at 10pm

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Good input guys. Yes and no, I agree to some extent, but also want to share my take below.

 

My take on Xanax is that with me sleep depravation builds up. I can catch up on sleep during the weekend,  but if I'm only getting 4-6 hours a night from Monday onwards, due to work, then by Thursday or Friday I can be a bit of a narcoleptic and/or grumpy mess. Taking a Xanax on Thursday night kind of hits the reset switch for me... Friday is then good as gold again.

 

I only do this when needed... works a treat. Quetiapine is better than Xanax for sleep where it's not anxiety/stress related.

 

Fully agree with finding the source of the problem... and working on sleep hygiene. Stress less, that helps.

 

Zopiclone is shit. Bad taste in the mouth in the morning and you don't feel right. Well I don't. It's pretty addictive too. I'd stay away from it.

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Aww Dont been able to  sleep is the worse thing ever you poor thing I know that for experience, all that drugs look hash and addictive, you should get an sleep analysis so they can maybe see the root of the problem instead of keep u drugged,  Maybe your Melatonin (which is the hormon responsible for your body clock)  is the issue? do you have a bathtub? have you tried Valerian? you can use some in a nice warm bath or take  the mixture of lemon balm and Valerian which is excellent for anxiety stress and even blood pressure as well  in teas about 2 hours before bed time, but this works only if you keep going taking them at least couple of weeks, I hope you get  back you sleep soon XX

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I try and aim for 8. Usually only get 6 here, and wake up a couple of times to piss.

 

There's a useful app that you might want to check out. It's called SnoreLab. It records when you snore (if you do?). You can listen to the recording and try and figure out if you have obstructive sleep apnea. I had some good results from using it. I found that at certain times of the night when I go into deep sleep, I was snoring really loudly, and waking from it after about 15 minutes by choking on my tongue a bit (could hear myself struggling to breath and gulping for air. I managed to sort this out by losing weight... only about 5kg made the difference. From 105kg down to 100kg. Have lost a further 5kg since and snoring is no longer being recorded in the "epic" range on the app. Wife is happy and so am I.

 

Worth checking out for anyone with sleep issues.

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you look and perform (at powerlifting, #nohomo) like you are recovering alright man but end of the day only you can be judge of that.

 

i allow a minimum of 6, generally between that and 8 hrs. any less than 6 and i am evidently f%ked. at times have gone as far as 10 hrs sleep when schedule allows for it, that feels kinda ideal for me. i'm just a 26 yr old growing child though

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Thanks guys , to many posts to respond to everyone . I definitely don't have a snoring problem as far as I'm aware or I'd have been throat punched in my sleep by now and wouldn't think I have weight issues although the only place I do have any mass is chest and back . Have used zopiclone for 2 weeks and didn't want any more as I felt like a bag of dicks all day so no more medication . Have not looked into a lot of other things mentioned though so gives me some ideas. Played around with a lot of different things before bed . I need to get a huge meal in before 7 because I tend to wake up hungry as anything during the night to.  Probably being on my phone isn't helping but ridding Facebook and insta has sorted a bit of that . Will try a bit of the reading and trying to sleep earlier to, getting into a set routine. Thanks again

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in the winter i get to sleep 8-10+hours a day including my day naps and i love it , usually have a broken sleep at night get up to piss allot cause i drink a heap of water probably , when summer rolls around i try my best to get 6 hours due to work , if i cant make 6 hours i start dropping cardio for that day to let me sleep in an extra hour

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