Transgenders in strength sports

[Skeletor 522]

Bit of a controversial topic here I'm sure but lately it seems all over social media and different news sites there are a lot of articles on transgenders and how they are not getting a fair run . For example a 6 year old boy recently identifying as a female so the school put in place a unisex toilet and it got me thinking about how people would react to a transgender competing in strength sports. ( powerlifting,  weightlifting etc ) more so the male "identifying" as a female and competing against other females. Now I know the ioc recently allowed female to male transgenders to be allowed to compete in the male class pre surgery which I guess makes sense as females are generally not able to compete with males and I understand male to female transgenders must have shown at least one year post surgery to have low test levels before being able to compete. How does it work for powerlifting in NZ?  Can a male who identifies as a female compete against females?  They would be at a huge advantage would they not?  It's confusing as hell I know but unfortunately this is the world we live in now.  Thoughts?  

p.s...... I'm not looking at competing in female classes just a curious topic. ?

[HarryB 849]

Yeah its interesting to see what the rulings will be. My guess is they won't let any male to female Transgender compete against women. Just because of the inherent advantage they would have. I believe in mma there was one? And then there was that Thai trans kickboxer but she fought men and was awesome. I'm sure they'd have never let her fight women. 

 

With Croc coming out now as Trans it's been interesting following the industry and seeing the immediate results. Loss of sponsors etc etc etc etc and the future competitive aspirations and possibilities for her/him. 

[Skeletor 522]

Yeah it's definitely going to be interesting down the line when male to female want to compete against other females . You dont let them and it's instant discrimination. You'd think even after a year or so of showing very low test levels that they'd still have a huge advantage. 

[Realtalk 2,433]

6 year old... Isn't that just a joke? How does 6 year old boy know they want to be a girl. Classic nature v nurture  f*ck up there. Failure from so many points

[Skeletor 522]

2 minutes ago, Realtalk said:

6 year old... Isn't that just a joke? How does 6 year old boy know they want to be a girl. Classic nature v nurture  f*ck up there. Failure from so many points

Yeah I'm with ya on that mate.  That's the society we're living in nowadays . 

[bang_bang 215]

This lady won her class at proraw 

[Polo 15]

1 hour ago, Realtalk said:

6 year old... Isn't that just a joke? How does 6 year old boy know they want to be a girl. Classic nature v nurture  f*ck up there. Failure from so many points

I guess a 6 year old boy would know they wanted to be a girl if they act like a girl, want to dress like a girl and play with the other girls definitely alarm bells would be ringing for the parents. What I am getting at is if you are born that way then you hold them characteristics from day 1 and would want to identify as the other sex. Guess it's the same as a gay guy, people don't choose to be gay it's just a thing that you are born with.

 

I don't think it would be fair for a male transgender to compete in a women's class considering body difference and that a lady to male transgender would have to compete in womens class also or maybe they could compete in a transgender class? 

[nate225 257]

Croc / Janae is an interesting situation but she commented she wouldn't be competing in lifting. Reckons the female hormones caused a lot of strength and mass loss but she'd still own 99% of genetic girls on the platform. 

 

If it's all about genetics there's a few other anomaly out there, with XXY women and XYY men, many of whom wouldn't realize the had an extra sex chromosome. Interesting / controversial area.

[PETN 650]

@GyzzBrah

 

[Bruce Al 157]

[Skeletor 522]

11 hours ago, bang_bang said:

This lady won her class at proraw 

Serious?  I wonder how the runners up felt. Obviously they probably wouldn't say to much in public but I wonder how they really felt about it

[bang_bang 215]

Not a good look for the sport especially at the Arnold's where 1000s of people got their first look at powerlifting. 

[HarryB 849]

Or maybe from a non participants perspective they think "wow how accepting is powerlifting".... perhaps it's an awesome look for powerlifting. Plus guy taking female hormones vs girl taking male hormones.. is there a point where it balances out? Probably not but no doubt that will all be weighed out and in a few years we'll have Trans divisions? 

 

Identifying with a different gender is definitely a state of mind but as far as accepting it being sociopathy I'm not sure. We could extend that premis and say the same about accepting gays... by biology it doesn't make sense but I don't agree with the premis for 2 reasons.. 1. I don't think that sexual preference is as simple as x and y and 2. To each their own. 

 

And in relation to croc I watched an interview and she was talking about maybe going endurance sports. Hard to just not compete at something when you that super competitive mentality. It'll be interesting to see. 

[Pseudonym 1,337]

22 minutes ago, HarryB said:

Plus guy taking female hormones vs girl taking male hormones.. is there a point where it balances out?

I was going to ask the exact same question. My guess is that, after a period of time, the girl taking male hormones would beat the guy taking female hormones - provided that as part of the guy's hormonal supplementation, he was also suppressing his testosterone.

 

Which begs another question... if you're a male-to-female transgender, and you're competing in a strength sport where higher testosterone gives you an advantage, just how much are you going to suppress your test levels? Or are you going maintain your naturally high test levels for the sake of your sport?

[maccaz 1,471]

Off topic, just an observation but why do a lot of the people that we hear about in media that are transgender tend to have either 1. Unconventional upbringings, or 2. Unconventional names ?

 

the kids I read about that have decided they're in the wrong body at age 6 or whatever tend to have names that make me feel like their parents have strong hippy status. 

 

9/10 these people have had influences pushing them in that direction after they were born, so "born that way" is a load of shit. 

 

I feel bit different about irina and pro raw as it's pretty clear she was at some point a female and probably has all the bits, she's just abused drugs which has fucked her appearance. Bit unfair to say she shouldn't compete as technically and genetically she

Is female. Not saying it's good to look at though at all lol. 

[bang_bang 215]

Has all the bits? you mean those flaps of skin where it's tits used to be lol. where do you draw the line most transgenders are more feminine than her even if she was born fully female. 

[maccaz 1,471]

3 minutes ago, bang_bang said:

Has all the bits? you mean those flaps of skin where it's tits used to be lol. where do you draw the line most transgenders are more feminine than her even if she was born fully female. 

I dunno lol but not like she can compete male right ? Too weak 

[HarryB 849]

Oh so the pro raw is genetically female? But ftm Trans? Wouldn't be taking any more hormones than any of the other women probably. 

[HarryB 849]

28 minutes ago, Pseudonym said:

I was going to ask the exact same question. My guess is that, after a period of time, the girl taking male hormones would beat the guy taking female hormones - provided that as part of the guy's hormonal supplementation, he was also suppressing his testosterone.

 

I'd imagine the bone density and joint thickness would be an advantage for the trans in this instance. 

[maccaz 1,471]

2 minutes ago, HarryB said:

Oh so the pro raw is genetically female? But ftm Trans? Wouldn't be taking any more hormones than any of the other women probably. 

I believe she was born female, but looks like a short man with gyno. Stubble on face etc 

[HarryB 849]

Yeah so female to male trans. Probably just taking as much test as most of the other girls in the division. 

[Realtalk 2,433]

25 minutes ago, HarryB said:

Yeah so female to male trans. Probably just taking as much test as most of the other girls in the division. 

 

Exactly. And if she had a pony tail no one would give a f*ck.

[PETN 650]

15 hours ago, bang_bang said:

 

 

Edit: Been answered

[PETN 650]

The difference between this shit and being gay is that being gay is just a preference whereas saying you are a man when you're a woman and vice versa is a load of delusional shit and a mental illness.

 

Sure you can say you 'identify' with the opposite sex and the stuff that society associates with that sex and even play dress up with your body and try look like that sex. That makes you a fucking weirdo but ok whatever. Plenty of weirdos out there. It doesn't actually mean you're that sex though. Caitlyn Jenner is definitely a man etc. DNA doesn't lie.

 

 

There are other sex linked genes beside those responsible for testosterone and estrogen that differentiate the sexes too.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Wookie 563]

I outthrew the Olympic womens shot put champion when I was 17.

And I wasn't even that good on a world level. 

The current mens  #2 in shot put recently threw the womens shot over 30metres. 21m would be a lock for Olympic gold. Put him on all the hormones and the surgery and I guarantee he'd still win comfortably.

 

Men have an inherent advantage that is more than just hormonal. Bone structure and density being one such area.