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Want to know about T-3..


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I've been asked about T-3 in PM so thought I'd share it on here..

I've borrowed it from another forum, if anyone is offended I can always delete it....!!

T-3

Never stops to amuse me that there are so many people using t3 and barely a handful of them know how it works and why it is doing what it is doing and how their choices are in a majority of cases directly responsible for their complaints

glycogen - a simple fix with a good carb up, this shouldn't even be mentioned anymore it's so lame.

energy - run a deficit, there is going to be a drop off in performance...factor in what t3 does, it aids in protein synthesis but it also speeds up protein turnover...have more synthesis than catabolism and you're in a great space to build muscle, anabolic state...ptor to simplify is removing broken down proteins to make place for new ones...if turnover is pushing out the broken down proteins and you're not keeping up with replacing then the body is looking to get what it needs from elsewhere, feeding off muscle stores which will sap your energy that much further. Up your protein intake and you'll feel less tired and feel less weak, the higher your t3 dose the more efficient ptor is, the more protein you need to keep up...if you started offseason last month with grams of deca/test/dbol/tren etc etc etc and took in 1000 cals under maintenance ed and didn't grow is it the compounds fault or did you not give it what it needed to succeed. That's the problem with t3 users, most of you guys are so afraid of it, while not knowing what it does and with no concept of how to work it into your blast so it doesn't do more harm than good.

dont use an ugl t3, a mcg is soo small the equipment needed to measure those doses is expensive... I don't trust an ugl lab anywhere that says they can do it...the real deal is pennies, be safe.

doses- if you think 25mcg is a dose you're wrong, unless you're thyroid is massively under producing all you're doing is taking close to what you produce naturally. And if you are massively under producing your introduction of 25mcg just made you function normally you aren't getting any advantage to your t3 run... You might as well throw the 25mcg tab into the wishing well and wish for weight to come off it's got the same odds as doing anything to you from a weight loss perspective 

100mcg isn't too high a dose for most and is probably a good place for most if they could arrange macros and learn to eat for optimal t3 performance. For weight loss purposes that is...for synthesis doses 50-75mcg are easier to work with.

You also have to keep in mind 75mcg barely makes a blip in terms of your metabolism, it will take many weeks for that dose to catch on and have you losing weight, that you're feeling more tired and lethargic lately is probably a sign that its making a difference now. T3 can work wonders quickly if youre using it at the right dose... at a low dose its a slow process, providing more for protein synthesis than it does for metabolic rate, its working but it will take weeks for you to start seeing results at a low dose. People who say theyre using a small dose and losing weight, its diet, glycogen or theyve been on that dose a long time but somebody starting from scratch at 50mcg losing weight in the first week, its not the t3, at all.

Disagree slightly with the recommendation of 50mcg and 75mcg for weight loss, on the same token, you can take higher for bulking purposes as well if youre protein intake is inline with your dose so long as you keep that dose below the point at which it effects metabolism. In most individuals with healthy thyroid function that dosage will do little to increase actual metabolism you'd be relying on protein turnover and a deficit for weight loss and while you will experience some weight loss that route, it is not the most efficient way to lose weight using t3. To find your optimal dose of t3 to increase your metabolic rate just do a search for one of my past t3 posts, Ive gone over it many times. The science speaks for itself, find your correct dose and make sure protein intake is high enough to account for turnover and you'll be loving your t3 results.

Easiest way to find out is next time you're off, off for a few weeks at least so your thyroid can rebound, grab an ear thermometer, take your temp upon waking, wake up shove it in your ear,  5 days in a row, then start supplementing t3...if after 5 days your temp isn't up .3-.6 your t3 isn't raising your metabolism...raise it by 25mcg until it does go up by .3-.6. I don't get a bump in metabolism until 100mcg...anything less is just increased protein synthesis to me...if you do indeed feel it in low doses, the thermometer should indicate it. The science based approach to taking t3.

The thermometer will give you the dose at which point youre metabolism has increased...thats just the lowest effective dose...now anything above and beyond that just increases your metabolism that much further, but also increases protein turnover both great for us but also raises heart rate , so if after youve tested, you find your effective dose to be 100mcg for example and you want to try 150mcg there is no harm in checking, if you find your heart rate elevates to a level that makes you uncomfortable then back off the dose but if you handle it fine just make sure gear intake, and protein intake is high enough to compensate for the increased dose and enjoy the revved up fat burning.

t4 for weight loss purposes pointless, use t3

t3 for thyroid while on gh pointless, use t4  (100mcg t4)

if you want to use t3 for fat loss while on gh you need to keep ratios in balance 3-4:1

ie.... using 50mcg t3 on cycle including gh, use 200mcg t4

t4 doesnt convert at 4 to 1 perfectly it does taper off as you get to higher doses and other factors come into play abit but you want to keep the ratio somewhat close.

Re: t4 and hgh, you will absolutely lose fat without the inclusion of t4, its a matter of bang for buck. Hgh is your most expensive addition, if you can make it work better, optimally, for little added cost then there is no logical reason to not use it. The body regulates t4 conversion so it will make use of it in conjunction with hgh as needed, excess excreted...in terms of pros vs cons, its all pros.

one of my closest friends, technically my cousins best friend but in my inner circle of friends, they went to med school together, is an endo, I've hashed thyroid meds to death with him, I've sat thru his conferences where he spoke directly on thyroid meds, where I hashed out the med with other endos...there is over sensationalizing of the potential risks and understating of the actual numbers that get affected...t3 Globalge is absolutely widespread, the numbers of users staggering the numbers adversely affected a laughably small percentage. There is rational fear and responsible caution and then there is fear mongering

there have been numerous studies on medically induced hyperthyroidism, that is far beyond a tiny dose of 75mcg t3 and thyroids have bounced back within 2-3 weeks. You'd have to be taking huge amounts for a hell of a long time to be doing any damage and with the fear level you have associated with t3, im guessing you haven't been to that point lol

the literature says you can take it with a meal or an empty stomach, and that only t4 needs to be on an empty stomach but my experiences are more anecdotal and from an endo friends anecdotal experiences as well, we've both found better results loading on an empty stomach at least a half hr prior to meals for weight loss purposes (he doesn't prescribe for that purpose obviously). He says he's found many of his endo colleagues recommending the wait time but that there is no official guideline to wait...As such I recommend at least a half hr but I err on the side of caution and take a full hr.

if I get up to 100mcg+ I like to split the dose. The lit says it's half life is over 24 hrs so you don't need to split it but I find that my temp drops after a few hrs so if im taking that much I want to keep my temp elevated as long as possible so I split the dose to keep it higher longer. I take it every 4 hrs. At 50 mcg no point in splitting. It won't lose effectiveness, just keep adjusting your diet and it'll keep doing it's thing.

does tapering off help alleviate recovery time at all?

No. Once youre shut down the longer you stay on the longer thyroids suppressed, tapering up and down is pointless.

Then once youve stopped dosing the thyroid usually kicks in, in about the same amount of time, 2-3 weeks give or take.

tapering is pointless till you hit 75 mcg...once you hit 75mcg theres a chance itll start upping your metabolism, then youd check via the thermometer for a few days to see if that has indeed happened if not then bump it up another 25 mcg and then go through the process again, for most 100mcg is when the metabolism starts kicking but if youre one of those individuals that runs a little high it could happen with 75 mcg, if you run a little slower it might need 125-150 but thats usually more than enough for anybody. So its not tapering per se but finding your dose. If you know from previous experience where you need to be, then no, no need to ramp up.

Everybody is different yet the same, there is some variance in tolerances and thyroid performance...if your thyroid is underperforming a dose of 12.5mcg might give it a slight boost and get it to normal levels... but an optimally working healthy thyroid is already producing in excess of that amount. t3 is much like test in that when you start introducing exogenous t3 or test it shuts down your natural production even if the exogenous amount is lower than what you produce...if you're producing close to 25mcg and you're introducing 12.5 mcg you're going backwards, not supplementing and getting 37.5mcg...so in essence you're becoming a less efficient machine, you're better off not using than adding 12.5 mcg, again unless your thyroid is naturally underactive in which case the doctors would be prescribing that dose for you and you hopefully aren't self medicating.

Headaches, they shouldn't be lasting headaches, its common for someone new to t3 to have an adjustment period, I got up to 250mcg without any issue but ive put people on 100mcg and headaches started so its entirely individual but they should subside within 2-3 weeks, you can also try breaking up the dose, instead of 75 mcg at once, take it 2-3 times a day. T3s onset is quick, while its half life is longer, its effective time is well under 5 hours, closer to 3.5 I'd guess by my estimations, if you take it every 4 hours for example, you aren't feeling the full power of the dose at the same time, should help relieve some of the pressure. If anyone gets over 100mcg I do recommend breaking up the doses, keep an effective dose at various points vs all at once, less and all at once in the am on an empty stomach is fine. If neither time nor breaking it up is helping you may potentially have something else causing the issue. Have you checked the vitals, bp, hr etc before and while on?

Fats aren't the enemy, I eat a lot more grass fed steaks and such as the protein count is high but it breaks down slowly and has plenty of fats in the mix. You need the protein when using t3 so keep throwing the protein sources at it that satiate you the longest, its whats going to help you with that lethargic feeling...take down a protein shake or piece of tilapia on t3 and half way thru it you're thinking about what else you want to eat lol those are useless but that ground grass fed beef will keep me stuffed for a few hrs, which is about the tops I hope for these day...I mix in carbs as well again slower digesting carbs, I try not to incorporate anything that burns thru too quick otherwise as you guys know you're in a constant state of hunger. So there is a method to t3 madness...its not as hard guys make it out to be but if you're just grabbing anything when the hunger hits and it's a sugary carb source for example, itll turn it over quickly and you're ready for the next hit immediately. That's when it goes off the rails...seems off that the compound meant to make dieting easier makes you have to focus on diet but to get the best results and feel healthier on it the little diet changes can make the experience a hell of a lot better. I like to increase protein intake by the same dose of t3 I'm taking, at my weight I'm aiming for 250 grams on average, add in 50 mcg and im upto 300 grams of protein and so on so adjust those macros so the protein is hit.

big key in making sure besides gear is keeping protein intake high...I think this is another reason people are quick to blame t3 for being catabolic, it increases your protein turnover rate, the higher you push t3 the more protein that is required, as people go on extreme calorie deficits they'll cut protein down to levels that aren't inline with what the body needs to maintain muscle.  Gear will cover your ass for a large chunk but as you get into the heavy t3 range (over 100mcg) you need to push up your grams of protein.

It really is dose dependent, the higher the dose the higher the protein turnover the more protein you need to keep up. At 200mcg I was at 2.25 grams per pound, 480 grams of protein daily. Ran 1400mg tren ace/ 700 mast prop as well. Didnt lose any muscle over my run. At current im running 150mcg and im at 2 grams per pound. Im personally a big believe in large amounts of protein in general but on t3 it becomes doubly important.

I too wouldn't touch t3 without aas but saying t3 is catabolic is incorrect, clinically it's proven to be not catabolic and can put you in an anabolic state but without the right fuel whats it to do? if you ran 1 gram of tren and 300 calories a day and lost muscle does that make the tren catabolic? by the same token, if you run t3 high enough and dont have the macros in place to cover its needs, its going to take it from where it can.

the myth is that you're going to lose f*ck tons of muscle with a little t3. Now if you're talking higher amounts of t3... if only there was something you could take to preserve muscle like a steroid of some sort that would help with this...I'll rack my brain and think about it

I've run pharma grade t3 at that just to see what it was like and it's not nearly the hell on earth you guys are making it out to be. Had my bananas (potassium), had my magnesium, kept myself hydrated well, on loads of tren...did my dexascan before and after, kept it up for 3 weeks, had a 3k cals a day on average, tons of protein, solid fat loss, muscle loss was nil...workouts unaffected, energy unaffected. Looked flat as hell but did everything I expected. I've done 100mcg  and less and felt infinitely worse on reduced cals, felt lethargic and half assed workouts so as long as you take care of yourself while on higher doses of t3 it doesn't have to mean the end to your muscle or render you useless. It's not to be played with and better to take less and eat clean than take more and eat garbage. That said I felt better losing fat with 200mcg and having more than enough high quality clean food than I did eating like a bird and taking 50mcgs. Thyroid is running efficiently as well bounced back like a champ, currently running 150mcg. If you've ever read my posts on how to check your thyroid meds are working efficiently and if you need to up them you'd see sometimes you gotta up the dose that high rather than sit at a low dose indefinitely.

this is the problem...guys take higher doses of t3 to cover up for cheat days and shitty habits and wonder why they feel lethargic...who feels great eating shit all day, add drugs to the mix and now they're supposed to be better off?  If you took tren would you live off a high fat diet with limited carbs in the mix? not if you want it to be successful...same applies to t3, you want it to to work, you dont want to feel like shit on it, make an effort to understand what it needs and not that its there to fix your mistakes. If your diet is proper at 50mcg and you can keep it proper upto 100mcg then the results will be better with more drugs...chemical warfare this is how it works...on the flip side, if you eat shit and take 50mcg then the whole metabolic process is a little slower so it's not going to hit you as hard, you do the same at 100mcg you're going to feel worse...that's why a lot of guys feel worse at higher doses, they never learned to eat for t3 and then pushed the dose and it hit them harder...so they backed down...but the issue isn't fixed they just don't feel it as much. 

the key is to use enough to increase protein synthesis and aid in ptor without it affecting metabolism. For most metabolism starts to kick in around 100mcg so with doses of 50 mcg-75mcg youre aiding your bulk along. 50 for moderate protein intake, 75 if youre protein intake is on the higher end. 12.5 mcg my god, irrational fear of t3, that is pointless and will do NOTHING in a bulk or while leaning out, dont start there thinking you need to ramp up or any of that nonsense. If youre going to include t3 either run it properly or dont bother.

We all like to feel big and strong, but the muscles dont recognize the poundages they recognize the stress theyre under, so as long as you're giving it all you've got the body will respond. Unless youre training for strength and powerlifting the goal should be body improvement. What t3 will do for your ability to put on muscle will negate the short term hassle of seeing your bench drop. Remember to adjust your protein intake upwards to account for t3, its pointless to increase ptor if youre not taking advantage of it. Lastly if strength is really a concern, it shouldnt be but if you feel strength dipping that dramatically, some drol, halo, methyltren will straighten that out and some...Dont be afraid of the poundages dropping short term think long term and what the ultimate goal is cause the short term problems can be worked around.

I'm not sure how much you were taking on a bulk but that's extreme, no way even 100mcg of t3 should require an additional 1500 calories. You could've kept 4500 calories and just adjusted macros to account for ptor and had better results. Your theory was backed up only because you used the wrong approach and then felt like crap cause you were overstuffing to compensate. 50 mcg on a bulk will put you into a favorable anabolic state and have you adding lean tissue quicker than you would pack it on without. Added protein synthesis is very helpful to our goals when applied correctly.

on 50mcg and that amount of gear you'd have to have an abnormal response to t3 to lose muscle. I took roughly the same amount of gear, 2 grams total, took in over 2 grams per pound of protein and was able to run 200mcg for 3 weeks with less than 1 pound of lean muscle lost...I do dexascans religiously monthly and during that run before, on and after to see how it was affecting me and it didn't. As long as you don't operate at too high a caloric deficit, take in sufficient protein and take in a good amount of gear it's very hard to lose muscle on t3...

Now whether 50mcg will do anything but give you a boost in protein synthesis is another question and one you need to establish yourself by checking your temps. And whether you need to sit below 5% when not competing is again a question to ask yourself but on the topic at hand, t3 and muscle loss, let me just say it's highly overstated, you'd have to run it stupidly or be an outlier in terms of reaction to be losing muscle.

Nobody is losing crazy amount of weight at 100mcg unless their diet has them running a very high caloric deficit in conjunction, some weight loss should be there assuming diets is in check. Going to the can a lot can be accompanied by t3 Globalge but as you adjust the dose it doesn't come into play nearly to the degree that it can when you first start but it's highly individual...hunger, again individual, some guys have a placebo effect, some guys may genuinely feel some added hunger but they're probably the guys pooping a lot...I've been well over 200mcgs more than a few times and if you trust the sides i'd be an anorexic looking dude who spends hours in the can in between food binges, just not the reality. If you want to check if your t3 is working use the thermometer method I've written and shared countless times,  stop trying to interpret what sides mean and take the guesswork out of it. If it's working you'll know if it's not, you'll know that too.

200mcg is a hefty hefty dose, the ptor on that is vicious, to keep from losing muscle at that dose you needed to be taking in 500 grams of protein and a few grams of gear. Losing no muscle on extreme doses of t3 can be done, I've done the tests to confirm but it's work, nobody really needs more than 150mcg and that's at the very high end, few would even need that. Most would get a metabolism boost at 100mcg. When you get to the doses you mentioned your whole life gets affected by it.

12.5 mcg is insignificant. If you're feeling your thyroid performing better at that dose you're an outlier, you had an underperforming thyroid and this made your thyroid run closer to optimal or you're imagining it.  At that small a dose it's effect on metabolism in an individual with healthy thyroid function is nill. You'd be getting a bit of protein synthesis but if that's the goal then dose it properly, at least 25mcg and put yourself in a truly anabolic state. 50mcg if protein intake is sufficient will do more for muscle gain than not having t3 and having the same protein intake in the mix would. With all that gear muscle loss shouldn't even be talked about unless you're again an outlier. On 50mcg or less, you shouldn't be going that flat, but flat is irrelevant, it's an easy near immediate fix...it doesn't hinder gains, affect cutting efforts etc...its a temporary state from lack of glycogen, don't mistake it for more than that.

Now to the t3, you're not wrong, way too many people use t3 in a weight loss capacity as a band aid to cover up for poor eating habits and laziness. If you can't get single digits bf thru diet and cardio alone, you are jumping the gun introducing t3 for that goal as those are the basic foundations of what this lifestyle is built on. Diet, training, rest, you need to know how to do each to get the most out of any compound Globalge. Once you've learned how to manipulate your diet, then its just wasting time not to use t3. It boils down to efficiency but is it needed, absolutely not. But then, aas aren't technically needed but when you reach for the extremes, really low bf,  mass monster size, these kind of compounds help you reach those levels. T3 also has as others have mentioned, added benefits in protein synthesis, and can result in improving the results of every cycle you run, not just in fat loss potential but in lean muscle gains. It's a very versataile, effective tool in the hands of somebody who uses it properly. As for the are you wrong question, its all personal choice, so there is no right or wrong here but do I think you, a serious bb'er would benefit from t3 Globalge, absolutely. 

Clen is just a fat loss tool where t3 has other benefits that it brings to the table, it is definitely not necessary and not the most pleasant drug as you mentioned. It does however for those inclined have great synergy with t3. In the end no single compound is needed, you don't even need tren but some tools just work better than others for certain purposes, tren may be the best compound we have but if you are absolutely bonkers on it,  you can get to the same place tren would take you with work and time. Its the same with t3 and clen...they are efficient and effective but you can always go another route to reach the same levels you would on either of those.

Albuterols user friendly, easy on the sides but way light on the results. Clen is a bitch for me but regardless of how closely related albuterol and clen are on paper the results aren't in the same ballpark. EC is better for appetite control but neither ec or albuterol touch clen for fat loss.

Why choose...clen and t3 are magic together...if you get past the cramping and heart racing a million miles per hour...once you adjust, sweet fat burning with some tren in the mix..  Ephedrine has it's place, but it suppresses my appetite, gives me a good buzz to get off my ass but once you've played with clen and t3, you don't even notice any fat burning effects...so my answer use all 3.

I'm a proponent of U.W.W.  (use what works) 

Why take a plane when you can walk across the country? Because it is simply more efficient.

The less time I have to spend dialing it in, the more time I have to focus on building. T3 is versatile, workable into offseason or prep with equal benefits with little to no downside. Do you need it no but then you can make the argument you don't need any compound, only reasons not to use a compound in my book are if it is unhealthy to do so.

Birth control pills are a conflict, they can lower the effect of thyroid meds, it's unknown how much of a conflict they cause and how much they lower the effectiveness of t3 but it could be lowering the effect somewhat.

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